PSA - Fire Hazard - don't put out tealights with water!

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Forum -> Yom Tov / Holidays -> Shabbos, Rosh Chodesh, Fast Days, and other Days of Note

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Goldie613

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 6:57 am

Long story very short -

For some reason (we think it might be because of the way the used matches were positioned by the candles), the flames on the tealights I used for lighting were much higher than usual this past Shabbos. I didn't like the way this was going, and they were getting high enough that I was worried that a nearby wood cabinet might soon catch fire, so I figured I'd best put it out. Figuring doing it with a shinui was probably the better option halachikly, I tried to put it out with salt (the same way I would for a grease fire), but it was taking too long, so I figured I'd best use the kitchen sink faucet sprayer to put it out...

Bad move. I mean, really really REALLY bad move.

The flames shot up straight to the ceiling, creating an even bigger safety hazard. Between more salt and flipping over the tealights with a long knife (to deprive the fire of oxygen), B"H the fire was put out and no one was hurt and there was no damage.

I assumed there must have been some grease on the counter with the candles, or maybe on the candleholders, but when I googled it after Shabbos, I found out that you are NEVER supposed to use water on tealights, that it would be like putting water on a grease fire.

I'm including a link at the bottom of this for the curious. I'd heard before about not using water on glass holders when dealing with candles, but I always thought that was to avoid the possibility of the glass cracking.

I don't recall seeing any warning labels over the years on packages of candles...have any of you?

tl;dr = don't put water on tealights - it will make the flames get even bigger! Surprised

https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.co.....ning/

Last edited by Goldie613 on Thu, Jan 06 2022, 7:19 am; edited 1 time in total

FranticFrummie

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 7:03 am

Wow, how scary! Surprised

B'H everyone is OK. Thank you so much for sharing the info. I had no idea.

amother

Powderblue

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 7:48 am

FYI you're not allowed to put out fire shabbos even with a shinui unless you live in an apt building. If fire gets out of hand, you put water around it to prevent it from traveling not on it.

Ema of 5

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 7:56 am

amother [ Powderblue ] wrote:

FYI you're not allowed to put out fire shabbos even with a shinui unless you live in an apt building. If fire gets out of hand, you put water around it to prevent it from traveling not on it.

FYI not everyone holds like this.
OP I’m happy everything was ok in the end and no one was hurt and nothing was damaged.

Ema of 5

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 7:58 am

Goldie613 wrote:

https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.co.....ning/

The video isn’t playing, are you able to summarize?

Rubies

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 8:16 am

amother [ Powderblue ] wrote:

FYI you're not allowed to put out fire shabbos even with a shinui unless you live in an apt building. If fire gets out of hand, you put water around it to prevent it from traveling not on it.

Not true. Ask lor.

doodlesmom

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 8:31 am

Some hold that if you live near many other houses you’re allowed to as well….
Or if you fear for the safety of anyone….

amother

Powderblue

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 9:38 am

Rubies wrote:

Not true. Ask lor.

I have. What I said is true.

Ema of 5

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 10:17 am

amother [ Powderblue ] wrote:

I have. What I said is true.

What you said is what your rav told you, for you. Other rabbanim pasken differently.

amother

Broom

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 10:20 am

Wow I’d never dream that water will make more trouble on a tea light candle fire! So scary! So what would be best to use?

amother

Whitewash

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 10:23 am

I recently saw this. There was a news reporter in the news who was severely burnt when she bought out a candle with water and it exploded back on her.

It was a good time to discuss with my kids how to extinguish wax candles, and grease fires

(For the future I was told if I can move the flame I should place in a safe area like bathtub, metal sink, or stovetop. And wet the surrounding area so it can’t spread. To extinguish on Shabbos is really a last resort in case of extreme danger. Sometimes it is hard to think in the moment.)

zaq

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 11:26 am

amother [ Broom ] wrote:

Wow I’d never dream that water will make more trouble on a tea light candle fire! So scary! So what would be best to use?

I'm not advising anyone what to do on Shabbat. AYLOR. On a weekday, simply place a noncombustible vessel--a glass. saucer, pot lid--over the tea lights. the flame will self-extinguish once it consumes all the oxygen in the headspace. Leave the vessel in place for a bit, because if you remove it too soon, fresh oxygen reaching the still-smoldering wick can cause reignition.

As long as we're on the subject of home fire-fighting, here's some more advice:
1. Use heavy-bottomed pans to cook foods in oil. If the pan is too thin, the oil will overheat and may ignite. If you cook on a very high flame, oil can ignite even in a heavy-bottomed pan, but it will take longer to reach such a temperature.

2. If the contents of the pan do ignite, switch off the burner and put a lid on the pan. Let the whole mess cool before removing the lid. (see above re re-ignition.) As to which you do first, shut off the flame or put the lid on the pan, do whichever you have the presence of mind to do first.

If the pan has no lid, cover it with a bigger pot, a flame-resistant plate, a blech, or even a tightly-woven 100% wool blanket if you have one. (Only 100% wool, not G-d forbid cotton, polyester or down.) What you want to do is smother the pan so that oxygen doesn't continue to feed the flame.

3. Get yourself a small fire extinguisher, either a K-type which is specifically for grease fires, or an A:B:C which is for most household combustibles and flammables. Mount it NOT above or behind your stove, but near the door, preferably just outside the doorway. You do NOT want to have to reach across a hot stove, in flames or not, or go further into your kitchen to grab the extinguisher. You want the device to be away from the stove (the most likely place for a fire, though the microwave oven is also a biggie) so that when you go for the extinguisher, you are moving AWAY from the stove. You also want the extinguisher near the doorway so that in case the fire spreads, you can readily escape.

4. Once you get an extinguisher, LEARN HOW TO USE IT. It does you no good and puts you in danger if you try to use it when you don't know how. It's not rocket science, but it's also not intuitive.

amother

Daffodil

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 12:05 pm

Quick fire extinguisher lesson:
The acronym is PASS:
PULL out the pin (it's a metal ring sticking out near the nozzle. Pull it all the way out and drop it)
AIM at the BASE or bottom of the fire. (It's natural to aim at the top or middle of the flames, but that won't put it out. When you stop, the fire will spring up again. )
SQUEEZE the trigger
SWEEP the spray back and forth across the whole base of the fire.

Empty the whole can. If you stop too early to check if it's out, the fire can restart and you won't have enough contents left to put out the fire.

PASS: Pull, Aim, Squeeze, Sweep.

amother

Garnet

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 2:08 pm

Thanks, Daffodil. I also suggest practicing with the extinguisher once you get it. Don't pull the pin out, just pretend to, and go through the motions. The units are heavier than they look, and if you have a little one with no hose, you have to move the entire unit back and forth to "sweep." Larger ones with hoses can be held in one hand while the other hand sweeps the hose back and forth.

you want to develop muscle memory so you can do this automatically without having to think it through first.

amother

Khaki

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 2:17 pm

Another PSA, never leave the used matches right next to or inside the tea lights to begin with

Goldie613

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 3:58 pm

Ema of 4 wrote:

The video isn’t playing, are you able to summarize?

Try this link - it's about the same thing, just on YouTube, so it should load better (fair warning, some of the burn pictures are graphic)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PvFq2h12Lxc

zaq

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 6:53 pm

The only fire you can safely put out with water is a class A--stuff you find in an Alley--I.e. paper, cardboard, wood, cloth, other plant material. The other common types are Class B--stuff you find in Bottles: booze, solvents, paint, oil, other flammable liquids. Grease and wax are in this class as well. Class C: things that are in Conduit or Carry Current, iow electrical fires. You already knew that water and electricity don't mix. Now you know that water and oil don't mix and water and wax don't mix.

amother

Heather

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 7:39 pm

I think what may be confusing is that usually you can douse a candle with water to put it out. But with a candle most of the wax is not melted. A tea light is like a cup of oil because the whole thing melts.

H2O

Thu, Jan 06 2022, 7:54 pm

Thank you! Had no idea!

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