milk in Europe | Imamother

ffbmom

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 6:31 am

Can one go to Starbucks or the like in Europe- Spain, Italy? We are not machmir about Chalav Yisrael, but I'd like to know if you can have a plain coffee there. Any ideas about the milk?

shalhevet

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 7:15 am

CY is not a chumra. It is a halacha for which R' Moshe Feinstein ztz"l was matir to consider the regular milk in America as equivalent.

That heter was only for America because of government regulations there.

sarahd

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 7:46 am

There isn't much of a heter around here. I don't know anyone who would drink coffee in Starbucks here. Even people who are not makpid on CY and drink supermarket milk don't go to Starbucks, AFAIK.

Chocoholic

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 7:57 am

It depends where in Europe you are going to. Regular supermarket milk in Holland is OK (the government is very strict on controlling it). So you can go to any supermarket and buy milk there. Ofcourse it's not CY.
I do NOT know about StarBucks. When I lived there, it was rather new and I didn't care at that time.

However, you can drink regular black coffee served in a plastic or paper cup from just about any place.

Please visit. http://www.nik.nl/Frames_eng.asp for more info. Have a nice trip!

Zus

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 8:48 am

Chocoholic wrote:

The local dutch rabbanut only approves of that if there is no CY milk available (and there isn't most of the time).

But to be honest, you should do your inquiries at the local rabanuyot of the places you'll visit. They can give you the most updated info.

freidasima

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 9:00 am

Do you consider yourself Charedi or MO? Because in England as far as I remember the health and food regulations are even stricter than in the US. For example in America you can't count on botel bishishim because you are allowed 2% junk in anything... while in England it is 1%...also Vegetarian in England (that funny V symbol) means 100% not 99% or 98% like in America...so I would guess that the milk is the same if not more pure than in America meaning R. Moshe's psak would be even more applicable there..

As for Starbucks, don't if you frequent places in America which don't have a hechsher on their baked goods (does Starbucks in the USA have a hechsher?) but only drink coffee, doesn't sound to me like you can't have a plain cup of coffee (none of the fancy syrupy kinds as you don't know what the other stuff is) in England either. But if you do in the USA, came holds true for England.

Dayzmom

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 9:48 am

You might want to take some of those Gefen coffee whitener packages with you. Obviously it's not the same as milk, but in a bind it's not too bad.

Ruchel

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 10:04 am

Oh, then I wonder why the French rabbinate allows non CY. And I have seen my rabbanim eating treif...

Rolling Eyes

It is CERTAINLY more closely checked than in America. 0.5% actually. You can buy by the kosher list of products and ingredients if you ask for it at the French rabbinate or download it online, which is a life saver in a country where only big communities have kosher products.

I know that in Starbucks there are ok and non ok things. Unfortunately I'll have to ask dh.

Zus

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 10:05 am

Ruchel wrote:

Oh, then I wonder why the French rabbinate allows non CY. And I have seen my rabbanim eating treif...

Weird statement.

Ruchel

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 10:13 am

Zus wrote:

Ruchel wrote:

Oh, then I wonder why the French rabbinate allows non CY. And I have seen my rabbanim eating treif...

Weird statement.

That's an answer to the Europeans need to keep CY statement I'm fed up of hearing around on Imamother, when obviously it is not the case... it would just take some googling to find out, but some have their minds made up.

Chocoholic

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 10:43 am

Zus wrote:

The local dutch rabbanut only approves of that if there is no CY milk available (and there isn't most of the time).

Honestly, how often do you see CY in a local albert heijn... The CY that they do import from antwerp is generally long lasting and tastes gross (plus you'd have to go to amsterdam to get it).

Zus

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 10:44 am

Chocoholic wrote:

Zus wrote:

The local dutch rabbanut only approves of that if there is no CY milk available (and there isn't most of the time).

Honestly, how often do you see CY in a local albert heijn... The CY that they do import from antwerp is generally long lasting and tastes gross (plus you'd have to go to amsterdam to get it).

Never. But that is not the place to look for it. AH I mean.

Chocoholic

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 10:49 am

Zus wrote:

Chocoholic wrote:

Zus wrote:

The local dutch rabbanut only approves of that if there is no CY milk available (and there isn't most of the time).

Honestly, how often do you see CY in a local albert heijn... The CY that they do import from antwerp is generally long lasting and tastes gross (plus you'd have to go to amsterdam to get it).

Never. But that is not the place to look for it. AH I mean.

I know. But to go to mouwes or c100 in amstelveen if normal milk is also OK... I prefer normal dutch milk, it's one of the best.. And the yogurt..

Zus

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 10:51 am

I was only stating the official stand of the dutch rabanut. I know very few people who actually only get CY. Just because it's so hard to come by. You can get the sterilized milk but hardly any other products.

sarahnurit

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 1:54 pm

Here we get Chalav Ysrael milk from France, the long lasting one, and cy chocolate from Switzerland. CY stuff is sold in Milano and Rome, and it's available in the biggest comunities...

Ruchel

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 3:03 pm

sarahnurit wrote:

Here we get Chalav Ysrael milk from France, the long lasting one, and cy chocolate from Switzerland. CY stuff is sold in Milano and Rome, and it's available in the biggest comunities...

Does the French CY stays good a long time? far from big communities it's already not always so good, and horribly expensive...

sarahd

Thu, Jul 17 2008, 5:17 pm

It's the UHT-long-lasting kind. The one we get here from France lasts plenty long. I personally don't like the taste, but I don't like the local UHT milk either.