Homosexual behavior ...a curable disease?

jelly belly

Wed, Jan 11 2012, 11:36 pm

mamommommy wrote:

jelly belly wrote:

havefaith wrote:

What do you mean? I thought the torah was made for everyone to be able to keep. Almost nobody is like that that they could control themselves. even if they could, does the torah wan't us to do things to punish ourselves bec. it seems these guys were punished to never enjoy relations for no good reason.

Not necessarily. Someone who is deaf, for example, can't fulfill every mitzva. And not to bring the conversation back to other forbidden relationships, but do we know that the desire for any of those is not as strong as the desire a gay man can feel? Also, the Torah looks differently at someone who truly can't overcome his desires, and fails despite his efforts on occasion- vs someone who says "screw it, I'm gay, I'm going to embrace it and live with my boyfriend as a couple."

There is a difference between the inability to perform a mitzvah, and doing an aveira.

And I absolutely agree with the second statement.

You're right. Really what I mean is- pretty much no one is born with the ability to go through life without sinning. Some people are created with a terrible temper. Some people are created with a compulsion for lying. Some people are created with gay tendencies. All of those can make it impossible to go through life without sinning at times. Our mission in life is not to say "I will never sin." It's to try to overcome each temptation for sin as it comes up.

chavamom

Thu, Jan 12 2012, 12:07 am

mamommommy wrote:

Barbara wrote:

willow wrote:

I guess I also just don't understand if someone is attracted to children. What isn't it natural? Do you think they choose to want that desire? Would that not be the same as someone attracted to same gender. So why is one looked at scandalously and the other is ok?

Willow, do you buy things from the store? That is, do you take money that you or your husband earned and exchange it for goods or services from a vendor?

Now, do you steal? Just walk into the store and take whatever you want without giving anything in exchange?

Or do you tell others what their goods are worth, and give them that in exchange, whether or not they're willing to sell? For example, if you like my candlesticks, would you drop a $20 on my counter and take them, even though they're family heirlooms, and not for sale.

Homosexuality is buying from the store. Its consensual zex between two adults.

Pedophilia is theft. Its rape. One party has not, or cannot (due to age) consent.

Very nicely explained, except many pedophiles don't ever act on their desires. In fact, a pedophile is one who is s*xually attracted to a prepubescent individual, not one who necessarily acts on those attractions. In short, one can be a pedophile without ever doing anything illegal or immoral.

If I'm not mistaken, she said "daughter" not "juvenile daughter". Makes a big difference. If it is two adults, we are talking about a taboo, not abuse.

Clarissa

Thu, Jan 12 2012, 12:09 am

amother wrote:

I don't see why some posts insist on being insulting. Please try to keep this an intellectual conversation.

Mamomommy you're doing a great job and are talking for a lot of us who don't have the same eloquence to explain ourselves as you do! Keep it up!

You're pathetic. You're either one of the people involved in this discussion, agreeing anonymously to sound like an extra voice, or you're even more of a loser for posting this anonymously when you lack the courage to participate. Cowardly worm. That is not what another is for.

And you claim to be in favor of intellectual conversation. Right.

EmesOrNT

Thu, Jan 12 2012, 12:12 am

Clarissa wrote:

amother wrote:

I seriously laughed when I read amothers post!

Speaks as if she's a mod but isn't.

Commends another poster without having to come out and say the same thing in her own words.

Ah, the joys of amother.

Clarissa

Thu, Jan 12 2012, 12:15 am

emesornt wrote:

Clarissa wrote:

amother wrote:

I used to post on this completely anonymous board, and people admitted to often posting comments in which they agreed with their other posts. It's so easy to do.

So sick of amother.

amother

Thu, Jan 12 2012, 12:19 am

amother wrote:

Clarissa, you're absolutely right. In fact, you're always right. And, if I may say, your recipes are the absolute best I've found on imamother. Your Whip pudding with Whip sauce and Whip-dipped strawberries was the best, yum yum.

(Hey, this feels pretty good)

I agree. She's the wisest person here. And I hear she can pick up tiny objects with her toes. She has fantastic toe dexterity, that Clarissa.

justanothermom

Thu, Jan 12 2012, 12:19 am

emesornt wrote:

Clarissa wrote:

amother wrote:

Okay, but is that a reason for name-calling? I don't think someone stating their opinion anonymously is what moves things away from intellectual conversation.

I'm reading and following this thread, but I learned very quickly not to even bother participating in these types of conversations exactly because of this type of thing. I wouldn't blame someone for wanting to put in their two-cents but still stay anonymous. "Cowards" are entitled to their opinions too.

Clarissa

Thu, Jan 12 2012, 12:22 am

No, they're not entitled to their opinions. The amother feature is not for that. Everyone else is posting under their board name. If she can't, she should stick to other boards. I won't stop calling people out on this baloney.

She should step forward and say who she is. Otherwise, I'm going to assume she's one of the posters who was already involved in this conversation.

Cowards deserve to be called out on their cowardice.

chavamom

Thu, Jan 12 2012, 12:24 am

amother wrote:

chavamom wrote:

I agree to that. What poster wants to sign up for a drubbing by Clarissa?

I'm not Clarissa, mind you. But she seems like s smart, sensitive person with great toe dexterity. Let's see your feet, lady.

Had my phone not been stolen from the J locker room, I would gladly post photos of my feet on facebook for Clarissa....er, "amother"...to see.

justanothermom

Thu, Jan 12 2012, 12:30 am

Clarissa wrote:

Then you're a bully, deciding who deserves to have a say or not based on your terms. This behavior is ridiculous and has to stop. If you don't like it, then you find another board to post in! Maybe people would stop posting anonymously if you would stop attacking people with sarcasm and name-calling.

Clarissa

Thu, Jan 12 2012, 12:33 am

justanothermom wrote:

Clarissa wrote:

My terms? My terms? What are the reasons for using amother, exactly. Arguing anonymously without revealing anything about yourself? I don't think so. Everyone deserves a say in this discussion. I have way more respect for those who argue their point, even if I'm diametrically opposed to their point, if they do so as themselves. It's useless for people to pipe in to applaud each other anonymously. If someone did it for me it would mean nothing. He**, then people would have every right to wonder if I was doing it for myself.

I make no apologies for getting angry about the horrible and ignorant things being said about gay people here. But I actually stopped arguing with those people, because it's pointless. I just pipe in now and then, and this time it was to call out a coward on cowardly behavior.

Clarissa

Thu, Jan 12 2012, 12:36 am

chavamom wrote:

Sigh. I was looking forward to photos of feet and discussions of toe dexterity. Maybe even getting a pedicure.

I've never had a pedicure. My feet are so ugly, it's not worth the money. But they're like any great athlete or thoroughbred horse -- doesn't have to look good if it's super athletic. I can pick up a straight pin with these babies. Next time you come over I'll demonstrate.