S/O How well did you learn the 3 Cardinal Sins?

amother

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 5:52 pm

amother Mulberry wrote:

As a kid I don't think I would have chosen to get killed over doing an aveira. I don't think much emphasis was put on this. Maybe it should have been. BH we live in a safe world right now.

It was pretty glorified in my school the idea of martyring yourself l’shem shamayim

amother

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 5:57 pm

amother Springgreen wrote:

My point is that this wasn’t discussed in school. It could have been a three minute clarification of definitions.

Exactly! I would think that it’s getting raped and it’s forced on you and you have no choice about it. But I’d (theoretically) want the piece of mind to know that I wasn’t chayiv kareis. (I take religious guilt seriously. When I was a bit more naive I was convinced that I was chayiv kareis because I missed a bedika)

amother

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 5:58 pm

amother Cerulean wrote:

It’s not that complicated.
Want to know what exactly comprises gilui arayos? Parshas acharei mos
Shfichas damim? Killing that isn’t for war or a goel hadam or hashkeim v’hargo
Avoda zara?
Pretty self explanatory. Serving something that had godly power attributed to it

In normal times one is required to give up one’s life rather than do any of those aveiros

In a time of shmad (we don’t determine what makes something a time of shmad, gedolim do)
Then one is required to treat any aveira, no matter how big or small, as if it’s one of the gimmel chamuros.

To be honest, I spend my time learning the halachos of lashon hara, kashrus, and working on my davening, emuna and bitachon, parenting and marriage.

It’s not that hard in day to day life to not do the gimmel chamuros

I’m not planning to get into these situations but I’m a very curious person who always had the weird hypothetical Halacha questions in school

amother

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 6:03 pm

amother Cerulean wrote:

This is discussed extensively in relation to the megilla.
Esther was a married woman, but she had to have relations with achashveirosh.
The meforshim say “karka olam haysa”
She made herself into “dirt of the ground” basically. She allowed herself to be dragged to achashveirosh and didn’t lift a finger or put a bit of effort of her own (remember she refused all the perfumes of haigai?)
This way it was allowed for her to be metaher every single month and sneak back to mordechai
It’s very interesting!! We actually learn this from the trop over the words “ובהגיע טור אסתר בת אביחיל״
The trop over those words are מונח מונח מונח מונח
Showing us that she was refusing and was literally forced with zero effort coming from herself

This is great to know! I only learned a pg version of Esther so all I learned was that a malach took her place. Had I known this then that would have helped answer some of my questions

amother

Clover

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 6:07 pm

amother Cerulean wrote:

we still have avod zara in the form of ppl.

amother

Darkblue

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 6:13 pm

amother Cerulean wrote:

The meforshim say “karka olam haysa”
She made herself into “dirt of the ground” basically. She allowed herself to be dragged to achashveirosh and didn’t lift a finger or put a bit of effort of her own (remember she refused all the perfumes of haigai?)
This way it was allowed for her to be metaher every single month and sneak back to mordechai

Interesting thing is that "karka olam" apparently even works if she enjoys it once its ongoing, as long as she didn't want it to start with.

Which is really interesting when you think of modern ideas of Stockholm Syndrome.

amother

Clover

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 6:14 pm

amother Ebony wrote:

Now I have another question... I somehow thought I knew that a Kohen's wife who is raped by a non-J must get divorced, however not if it's a Jew. DH tells me both make her prohibited. (This is practical for me, I'm kind of terrified to go out myself at night...)

otherwise you wouldnt be?
Smile

amother

Clover

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 6:18 pm

amother OP wrote:

This is great to know! I only learned a pg version of Esther so all I learned was that a malach took her place. Had I known this then that would have helped answer some of my questions

I know!
Id love a thread where women tell all the 'rated R' stuff from the torah!
(Nothing to to )

amother

Azure

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 6:20 pm

Wait. Esther and Mordechai were married?!? Why on earth have I never heard that.

I was always wondering how it wasn’t Yichud and the level of appropriation (so different to the one I was taught) between uncle and niece is so deeply and openly discussed.

Wolfsbane

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 6:24 pm

amother Azure wrote:

It's a derashah - reading the word "לבת" (as a daughter I.e. step-daughter) as "לבית" - ( as his household I.e. wife)

mommy3b2c

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 6:28 pm

amother Azure wrote:

They were cousins . Not uncle and niece

amother

Razzmatazz

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 6:35 pm

mommy3b2c wrote:

They were cousins . Not uncle and niece

I remember learning that they were uncle and niece as well. I believe it a medrash.
We never covered this particular megillah in school, it always bothered me, especially after I learnt it on my own. I think some schools have their curriculum priorities messed up.

amother

Cerulean

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 7:23 pm

amother Razzmatazz wrote:

Cousins. It’s written straight out in the psukim (אסתר בת אביחיל דוד מרדכי)
People think uncle because of the purim story tape I think

amother

Cerulean

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 7:24 pm

amother OP wrote:

This is great to know! I only learned a pg version of Esther so all I learned was that a malach took her place. Had I known this then that would have helped answer some of my questions

That is another meforash
There is never only one explanation
שבעים פנים לתורה

amother

Cerulean

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 7:30 pm

amother Clover wrote:

we still have avod zara in the form of ppl.

That’s not the issur of avoda zara. That’s when people are trying to use avoda zara as a metaphor
Unless you actually serve and now to that person because they believe him to be a god, like yeshke

amother

Charcoal

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 8:16 pm

amother Oatmeal wrote:

I can't remember the source so maybe someone else can clarify but I've learnt that although one is obligated to be killed rather than commit these three sins, if someone is threatened with death of they don't do these three and so they do it then it's considered that they were forced and so not responsible for their actions.

Absolutely not!! This is literally what Yehareg V'al Yaazor means.... if you're threatened to be killed you must accept that and not transgress these 3...

amother

Charcoal

Wed, Aug 30 2023, 8:20 pm

amother OP wrote:

I'm sorry but you weren't taught TH if you thought missing a Bedika is Chiyuv Kareis... I'd recommend a review of TH as your next learning project before researching the definition of being forced to serve Avoda Zara

amother

Springgreen

Thu, Aug 31 2023, 12:25 pm

amother Charcoal wrote:

Absolutely not!! This is literally what Yehareg V'al Yaazor means.... if you're threatened to be killed you must accept that and not transgress these 3...

there ya go 🤔

mommy2b1

Thu, Aug 31 2023, 6:07 pm

From how my husband explained it, the yehereg val yaavor regarding znus is in practicality only an issue for men. As everyone above explained with Esther, if you show no signs of consent, you are not being over on this aveirah. So if a guy put a gun to someone’s head and said have relations with me or I kill you, they could not say anything and focus on survival.
For the other two, it’s only applicable if your given a choice- kill him or I kill you. If they force you (let’s say they physically bend you into a bowing position) it would be the same situation as the rape. You don’t have control.
The mitzvah is NOT to commit suicide.