Chossidmom's thread about childhood vaccines

amother

Dimgray

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:01 pm

ChossidMom wrote:

My husband spoke to a client in Bne Brak recently, who told him that after he had a few kids he went to Rav Chaim Kanievsky zt"l and spoke to him about childhood vaccines. Rav Chaim told him to stop vaccinating his kids. The next batch of kids didn't receive vaccines and they were way healthier than the first batch.

Sounds sketch. Rav Chaim ztl was extremely pro vaccine.

amother

Hotpink

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:04 pm

amother Olive wrote:

I give shots but I get so nervous every time. is there any data that shows it’s better to stagger the shots?
Also, what about all the diseases these shots eradicated? Bh we don’t have kids getting sick with polio any more. Is that not a good thing?

Yes, and many deadly disease no longer effect 1st world countries as it used to. And that is because of the vaccines.
I'm wondering if the rise of polio now is due to the rise of people not taking the vaccines.

Of course you should not blindly follow and take every single vaccine out there. That's what we call balance.

Trademark

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:06 pm

amother Snowflake wrote:

No, Rav Chaim was pro Torah. There are families who genetics do poorly on vaccines, it would be against the Torah for them to continue to take them. Every psak is unique to the circumstances.

Now that he is not alive anymore, anyone can say whatever they want in his name and we have no way of verifying. Typical tactic of these types to quote dead people.

amother

Hotpink

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:07 pm

ChossidMom wrote:

You have to do your own research only if you care about your child enough to do your due diligence. Because the doctors know zilch about vaccines. All they know is the schedule which they have every reason to stick to because they get paid for every child they vaccinate.

If you are 100% sure that all is well then keep doing what you're doing.
But you do owe it to your child to do your homework if you are hearing that there are sooooo many people out there with badly injured children. You have a moral obligation to check it out.

I know so many people with Autistic children and children with ADHD (I have one of those). These things didn't exist in these numbers way back when I received my few vaccines as a child.

Also, why are you on this thread if you don't want to "look for problems"? You know Chossidmom is always stirring the pot!

Like I said in my post above, I dont think you should blindly be taking every vaccine out there. I'm just referring to the ones that take no vaccines.

ETA- Also, the amount of documented diagnosis doesnt reflect an increase.
There were much less awareness then

amother

Hotpink

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:15 pm

ChossidMom wrote:

The next "batch" of kids?
What are you, a baby machine Wink

GLUE

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:17 pm

amother Valerian wrote:

Nope, I was thinking of rickets. My point was, life changed, hygiene changed, our food changed, and there are so many more variables that contribute to the pathogenesis and salutogenesis of a disease.

Our food changed they now put vitamin B3-niacim in the flour so that's why you don't hear of anyone getting Pellagra.

Pick up a bag of Flour,rice, corn meal and if it says enriched it means it has vitamins in them( I forgot what they put in what)
I heard that they now put Folic acid in the flour to.

In some places rickets are making a come back, I am not really so interested in that subject so I can't tell you more about it.

amother

Snowflake

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:23 pm

Chossidmom is an honest and good person. If her husband felt his conversation with that person was in earnest, then I believe it happened. But its really important to understand that medicine isn't one size fits all. Halacha is applied to different circumstances, not to generalizations. There really are kids who shouldn't be taking any vaccines. And there really are kids who have no negative effects from vaccines.

But if someone paskened with full knowledge of how corrupted the industry is, I wonder 🤔 what would come out of that???

You know there are a few frum families with the means to open a non profit community chesed based vaccine company and raise the ethical and moral standards of independent scientific proof and manufacture it with top level oversight, for goodness sakes, not in China.

Trademark

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:29 pm

amother Snowflake wrote:

Seriously? At the end of the day she's an internet stranger and this is a third hand story that we have no way to verify. I have no reason to believe it's true.

We are in a very bad state if people take such things seriously. Literally anyone can make this up.

amother

Navyblue

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:38 pm

amother Valerian wrote:

I stopped vaccinating my children in 2009 when my daughter had a brutal reaction to a set of vaccines that were given in one visit.
At the time, we were on Medicaid and I was horrified to see our nurse enter the room with vaccines and then look at our chart and say, “Oops, Medical Assistance. I’ll go get the correct vaccines.” Turns out they have two SEPARATE refrigerators for Medicaid vs private insurance vaccines. This should be TERRIFYING to any thinking parent. The NUMBER of vaccines they were prepared to administer in one visit was also appalling (a total of 10, in our case, if you break up hexavalent etc).

My gut was screaming, NO NO NO. We eventually got kicked out of that pediatrician’s office for asking questions, and when I got over the grief and confusion, I started my research journey by making a list of all the CDC recommended vaccines, what they’re for, if the illness is otherwise treatable, probability of an adverse effect from the illness and from the vaccine, severity of an adverse effect, etc. I’m still researching, 14 years later. National Institute of Health, peer-reviewed research, literally straight from the horse’s mouth. What I’ve found is incredible, and needless to say, I do not give my children ANY vaccines. None are necessary, all are harmful.

IF a vaccine ever came out for something otherwise difficult to treat and fatal, I may reconsider. (Think, cancer.)

I’m not crazy and I won’t tell you that every modern ailment is caused by vaccines. I think there’s eccentricity on both sides of the debate, BUT I do not know anyone who has done any amount of independent research and still vaccinates. That’s the sad fact. It’s smoke and mirrors, and frankly, my bottom line is this: Vaccines are just a matter of time. Just a matter of time before the illusion implodes. There is no question in my mind about that.

Fun fact, I’m a nurse and once upon a time, I vaccinated others. Know better, do better.

How do you deal with vaccines that are mandatory by schools?

If I do give shots what's the best way to minimize risks?

amother

Snowflake

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:39 pm

Trademark wrote:

Nope, interacted with her irl. Not internet stranger. But I'm just an internet stranger to you.

This stuff is just not all black and white. I've been around people who didn't give any shots and people who stopped giving, and I started out as running to get every available shot on exact schedule but really, this stuff is very gray. And there is a lot to know and learn. And I've seen people get extreme, I've seen injured people and I've seen people who are extremely healthy with every single dose. But education on the topic, there is no down side to that.

For example, the industry tests new shots against old shots. Never has it been done against a placebo.
Every medication is tested against a placebo. But not shots. They should be tested against a placebo. That would be scientific. Rfk Jr if elected would like to insist shots are held to the same level of testing as medicines are. Who would be against that? The industry is against that and give flimsy reasons.

Trademark

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:42 pm

amother Snowflake wrote:

Both you and chossidmom are strangers to the rest of us. I have no reason to trust either of you, definitely not more than an experienced doctor.

I never said things are black and white. I said don't believe everything you read online and definitely don't take medical advice from anonymous strangers.

amother

Mustard

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:43 pm

GLUE wrote:

You can also look up why people started getting these diseases in the first place.
I don't eat any enriched grains and don't have pellagra. Or rickets.

amother

Navyblue

Tue, Jun 27 2023, 12:44 pm

amother Snowflake wrote:

This is the idea I'd really love to hear more. How to how a nuanced view on it. I plan to give my kids shots because its necessary for school. But what is the best and gentlest way to go about it?