S'farim in guest bedroom

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Ruchel

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 4:44 pm

Many put one couple in one bed and if she's nidda the husband sleeps on the couch/floor/three chairs/they make a separation, depending on what they learned. Not everyone has two individual beds to put in a guest room, or beds at all (many use convertible sofas).

No I don't assume couples would be intimate under my roof. If they can manage, good for them. But I don't assume this.

amother

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 4:46 pm

oh come on people!!!! if you for some reason can not abstain because you have to go to the mikva that night then its your responsibility to come prepared!!!!!!!!!! you come with your sheets , towels or wtvr else you may need. it is NOT your hosts problem to think heyyy maybe theyll have relations I better move out the sefarim. Seriously, either abstain or if u MUST have relations in someone elses house (which I would never do since I dont feel comfortable) bring your own sheet!!!!!!!!!!!

prettyone

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 4:57 pm

Ruchel wrote:

thats not very nice as a host. are you for real that you would want your guest to sleep on three chairs or the floor?

(a couch - fine but the floor?)

dont have a married couple over if you cant accomodate. or at least warn them in advance so they know they are expected to sleep on a floor.

amother

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 5:03 pm

we had this exact problem at my in laws...the room we always stayed in had 2 bookcases full of seforim it was really annoying every time we went there.....after a while...I discretly hinted it to my mil and the next time we came there was a nice curtain hanging over the book shelves!

amother

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 5:05 pm

why cant you just abstain when youre by ur in laws???!!! or bring a sheet and cover the shelves urself??????

Dini

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 5:08 pm

amother wrote:

wow that would be too embarrassing for me. Prettyone I agree with you 100%, guests should feel as comfy as possible in your home.

I have a friend that was a guest at someone's house on her shabos sheva brachos and the host put out a white sheet just in case she was in her shivah nekiem. I think it is very thoughtfull though a bit much.

amother

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 5:09 pm

why cant you just abstain when youre by ur in laws???!!! or bring a sheet and cover the shelves urself??????

Metukah

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 5:12 pm

To all those who say guest should abstain; my mil has seforim shelves in her guest room, we stayed at her for five weeks.
(being that this was the home dh was bought up in he knew where the sheets were kept, and knew they wouldnt be missed so he bought some into the room and put them up when nec. (how romantic and spontaneous)

Rodent

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 7:02 pm

It is forbidden to have s*x in front of a sefer tora (and only a kasher one) without a mechitza. This does NOT extend to all sefarim. In fact we have ALL of our books in our bedroom (they used to be in the loungeroom but #1 was particularly fond of paper as a baby and destroyed so many of our books). We also have a pasul sefer tora that my husband hasn't finished fixing on top of the bookshelf in there. We never cover our bookshelf.

We don't have a guest bedroom but even if we did I wouldn't be covering books or leaving sheets so they could cover them if they want to. If our guest has some desire to cover books then they can work that out themselves, I'm not going to cater to people's every unnecessary desire.

I do, however, normally tell stay-over guests where extra linen can be found if they need any other sheets, blankets, towels etc so if they choose to take one for that it's fine (but still clean so I'd prefer it was folded and returned to the closet so that I'm not washing more than is necessary).

amother

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 7:05 pm

Another reason why a couple might go away for mikvah night:
We stayed by good friends for 5 weeks when our house was damaged by a rocket and the rockets were still coming. My mikvah night was in the first few days we were there. There were seforim shelves in the room but there were extra sheets in the room too. I don't think abstaining wold have been appropriate as we were ttc and before fulfilling peru urevu. and no we did not bring extra sheets. We didn't even bring extra clothes. I wore the same clothes for the first week.

amother

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 7:06 pm

im sorry but u r not allowed to have relations if there r seforim in the room including a tallis or tefilin

lamplighter

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 7:56 pm

The places that I've been where there were seforim, it was only a few and we just put them in a draw or closet.

I actually remember once sleeping at someone and the room had 2 beds, and one bed had a white sheet on it. It was really thoughtful. I was in the sheva nikeiyim but had brought my white gear with me.

Rodent

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 8:52 pm

What is your source for saying that you cannot? Don't tell me a rabbi, I want a SOURCE.

GetReal

Wed, Jan 13 2010, 10:25 pm

Rodent wrote:

What is your source for saying that you cannot? Don't tell me a rabbi, I want a SOURCE.

I don't have time now to check up all these sources, but the sefer here lists:
Mishneh Berurah 40:4-7 and 240:30-31
Mechaber and Rema 40:2
Shulchan Aruch HaRav 315:4

chocolatemilk

Thu, Jan 14 2010, 12:16 am

I learned that if ur in shiva nekiim and at s/1 elses home and they might see white sheet
not to use one b/c no1 else is supposed to know when u go to mikvah. and its ok as long as u wear white undergarments

gold21

Thu, Jan 14 2010, 1:04 am

I don't get the white sheet thing in general. Why don't we just walk around in white robes while were at it. Luckily, we don't hold of it. But it seems like there's a lot of potential for a breach of tznius, if someone should mistakenly see your white sheet.

amother

Thu, Jan 14 2010, 1:32 am

I think people don't know.
when I go to my parents they put me in a room full of sforim.
and if I'm there for 2 weeks it's not fair to us to say abstain.
so we end up sneaking to the linen closet to cover it up and then try to put the linen back not noticeable but it's annoying.
I think people who invite over a couple should think about this when they do.

shabbatiscoming

Thu, Jan 14 2010, 1:40 am

amother wrote:

sorry but most people are not thinkng about if their guests are going to have s e x or not while they stay in their homes. if you all feel so strongly about this then when you go away, bring an extra flat sheet so that you can cover up whatever you need to when you want to be intimate with your husband. but it should not have to be on the host to have to think "well, lets see, my guests might want to have s e x so I better make the room ok for them". I have had quite a few guests in my home, but I will tell you, it has never crossed my mind about their s e x life at all and it is not my job to do so.
we stayed at my in laws once for 5 weeks. my husband's room had some sfarim in them, so we just put them in a drawer. if we would not have been able to do that we would have just taken a sheet and covered them ourselves. you want to be intimate, you take care of it.

Seraph

Thu, Jan 14 2010, 1:45 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

Seraph wrote:

amother wrote:

I learned in Kallah classes that if you are having relations in someone else's home you are required to bring your own sheets and towels, etc. I can't believe that this is an actual discussion. When I invite someone to my house I leave them towels as it is a natural thing to need a towel, washing your hands, your face, etc.... I definitely would not leave them extra sheets to prepare for their possible hanky pankying in my home. Quite frankly, it is their business to prepare for themselves and it's the last thing on my mind when I invite someone over. I'm so surprised that so many people obviously have this on their mind when inviting guests over. To me, leaving extra sheets lying around is the same like leaving a bottle of lubricant in the night-table, 'just in case'. You pack your own lingerie, you can pack some extra stuff as well if you really need to. And as far as going to the mikveh from someone else's home, the only time I can see myself doing that is if I had a sibling's simchah and I couldn't possibly get out of the shabbos etc....

In my opinion, its not a normal thing to have sfarim in a guest room. So I don't bring along extra sheets just in case there's a weird setup. I do bring my own towels, but why would someone assume that there's a sfarim shelf in the guest room?

just wondering why not? where would you have people put all of their books. growing up, I know that in my bedroom I had chumashim and things like that, so why would a guest room be any different? my parents have sfarim in one of their guest rooms. why is it so abnormal?

Most people I know keep sfarim in the living room. we have secular books in the guest room.

shabbatiscoming

Thu, Jan 14 2010, 1:49 am

Seraph wrote:

shabbatiscoming wrote:

Seraph wrote:

amother wrote:

Most people I know keep sfarim in the living room. we have secular books in the guest room.

like I said, in my apartment now we have both sfarim and secualr books in the living room, but there is only so much room there and the other books that dont fit are in the guest room.
I guess for someone who does not want secualr books in their living room this makes sense but we want some of our secualr books in the living room, we have no problem with that, so the sfarim and whatever other books, that we do not use regularly, go into the guest room.

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