UK mum's please help get my kid into a school?!?

amother

Wed, Feb 10 2010, 7:22 am

Ok after a stint abroad im bak in the UK to live I have a 15 month old baby and all anyone can ask me is:

Where is she going to nursery?
Where is she going to school?
Where is she going to Gan?
Have a applied yet?
etc, etc, etc...

My baby will be 2 I"H, in October 2010 can any of you ladies please try and break this whole process down for me, at what age should she be going where, when I should be applying to various institutions etc. I really am clueless everyone tells me a different thing im literally sick of it I go to sleep racking my brains as to how im going to figure this all out. My mum was very lax and not knowledgeable in this area when she had me (im the eldest) so when it came time for going to school I ended up in a not great primary...I dont want to make the same mistake.

Tentatively, I am interested in:

Noam
Edgware Jewish Primary
Menorah primary and foundation

Hashkaficaly these schools are prob most suitable however they are not state aided and I really cant afford it in any way but im not in the catchment area for any of the good primary schools that are not private and surely wont get my child in. So im hoping they will be state aided by the time my daughter needs to go there.

I am trying to glean as much info as possible so please anyone who has something to say on this matter please let me know. And I am asking respectfully that none tell me not to worry and that its too early to be worrying, that wont stop everyone asking me what im doing and it still doesnt stop me from gleaning as much info as possible.

Ok so main questions are:
a) How to obtain as much info about the schools as possible?
b) How old is a child when they start at a nursery linked to a school?
c) How old is a child when they enter reception?
d) When is the appropriate time to apply for nursery? and once youve done that when do you apply for school?

MAJOR TIA to anyone who takes the time/effort to help me out,
perhaps there is a website that can explain this whole thing to me if so lemme know what it is!!

Cant wait to be enlightened!!!

Raisin

Wed, Feb 10 2010, 9:33 am

I can only tell you that a kid needs to be 4 before entering reception. My neice was 4 and a day when she started school. (in london)

good luck! my cousins made aliya when they realised they couldn't get their kid into any of the schools they wanted. But I think they were looking at more modern state aided schools. (and they were palnning to make aliya anyway, this just gave them the push)

amother

Wed, Feb 10 2010, 9:51 am

Generally nursery starts at age 2, but school linked nurseries at age 3, and then school the next year. I can't tell you about when to apply to schools, but call them and ask how early. If you plan to send your child to a home daycare place, its probably easier to get your child in even if you apply late, but my son goes to Edgware Lubavitch nursery, and you have to apply pretty early - probably by the time your child is around 1 year old.
I know that it takes months from when you apply to schools till you hear (usually you find out if they're accepted about now, I think) - and its pretty nervewracking. Yes, everybody asking you about it does not help!

amother

Wed, Feb 10 2010, 1:12 pm

Thanks for the replies,

So if I have applied to a nursery yet for sept 2010, is it unlikely for mine to get a place. Also she will turn 3 in the October and they only accept 2+ does that mean she will not get into that nursery because of that? In the event that that is the case I suppose I will have to go with a some kind of home day care type place there a few options where I live.

But what about the schools themselves, anyone got any advice on that matter?

nylon

Wed, Feb 10 2010, 2:51 pm

Barnet starts reception for rising fives: your child starts reception in September (fall/winter babies), or January (spring/summer kids), and they all turn 5 during reception.

Menorah Foundation and Menorah Primary are both state aided for primary classes. If you wanted to apply for the primary places you need to do that through the council (not sure about nursery).

I would call the schools; they handle admissions themselves. From what you said, your daughter will only be 2 this October--they may not even take her for 2010! Call and find out.

Mrs Bissli

Wed, Feb 10 2010, 3:05 pm

Basically the child must be fully 3 yr old when she enters nursery. 4yr old for reception. So if your daughter is only 15month old, she is too young to enter nursery for this autumn 2010.

Call the school for admission procedure. As nylon said, state aided should be applied via council. Also some rejigging of documents needed because of the JFS case. As for the timing, you apply about 1 year ahead of entry term, so you still have time--I guess sometime Sept-Nov this year.

As for collecting info, you can check the school website, OFSTED report (though some could be old), report from Pikuach, but the best method is asking parents.

I'm not in Barnett/Edgware, but have you considered? Hertsmere JPS in Radlett is state-aided but I believe the school is oversubscribed with few places for children without older siblings. ALMOST ALL SCHOOLS HAVE PRIORITY ADMISSION FOR YOUNGER SIBLINGS OF EXISTING PUPILS. (It's frustrating if your little 'un is the oldest, but good to know you don't have to worry about admission/multiple school schlepping for more than one kids). I thought Menorah, Rosh Pina are voluntary aided--where your tuition is still heavily subsidised, pretty much the same as state school except schools have more flexibility setting up admissions/actual running. Independent schools dont get subsidy (aside from vouchers that partially subsidises 3yr and 4yr olds). I think Mathilda Marks in Mill Hill and Clore Shalom in Radlett are also voluntary aided (correct me if I'm wrong).

nylon

Wed, Feb 10 2010, 3:37 pm

All state funded Jewish schools are VA. This means they have the right to set their own admissions policies, but the flexibility in day to day running is limited (not like academies or what have you). They are basically state schools and have to meet all the regulations; they just charge a voluntary contribution for Jewish studies (by law, they can't make you pay it.. though morally you atre obligated).

Clore is not Orthodox. The schools you listed are VA, Mrs Bissli, but further left than the OP is looking at. That list is further right than we would have gone so I don't know those schoolswell, but I do recalll being told that Menorah Primary is very hard to get into. BTW many schools also operate on a distance criterion so take that into account... if you live in Edgware and apply to Menorah (Golders Green) you could lose out based on that.

have a look at http://www.barnet.gov.uk/guide.....0.pdf - lists all the schools and how admissions works for state schools.

amother

Thu, Feb 25 2010, 7:39 am

Hi OP here, sosrry I didnt reply or been involved in the convo things been abit hectic.

In regards to HJPS yest its very close to me I am within the 'area' but as you said not many places for children w/o sibs. Also although it is a 'religious' school, many of the children there will not be coming from observant homes and I would prefer if given a choice that my daughter doesnt have to have issues with play dates (homes not being exactly kosher) or shomer shabbat etc. I am pretty middle of the road and realise the schools I mentioned are more to the left than I prob am but I just cant face all the issues that I know comes with going to a primary where big % of students are not really that observant.

What do people say about matilda marks? Ive been hearing good things educationaly but whats the student make up like?

I think I will apply for Nursery this coming september even though she wont be able to enter until shes 3 which means 2012....but I will call the schools and find out

Mrs Bissli

Tue, Mar 02 2010, 11:13 am

Good points about both of nylon's answers. I think if you look at Pikuach reports, they should list how much % of curriculum is spent on limudei kodesh (anywhere from surprisingly light 15% to 40%). Also you can pick up hints in the report--esp reference to pupils not being able to read Hebrew fluently, or reference to children entering the school with low (Jewish) attainment levels can indicate more secular background.

OP, if you're concerned about your daughter socialising with classmates from non-observant homes, you don't have much choice except for the three schools you've listed. My kids go to a jewish school where not all families are observant but parents know and respect the basic rules (like kosher foods at birthda parties, no music entertainers during omer etc), I don't think my kids suffered socially for not being able to go to their house or do things on shabbat.

I know someone whose child goes to Menora and I think they live in Borehamwood, though I suspect they moved there more recently. From what I hear, post-JFS case most schools (aside from independent ones) now require some certificate/statement of religious observances, basically a form you ask your rabbi/shul to fill out stating that you're regular shul goer.

nylon

Tue, Mar 02 2010, 2:02 pm

Here are Pikuach reports:
http://www.boardofdeputies.org.....242/1

Ofsted is at http://www.ofsted.gov.uk; you'll have to search. Those reports often list percentages of time on kodesh too, and have other useful information. All state schools have reports; independents don't have to be inspected at the same level or frequency, but there are reports on many of them. I don't think Pikuach normally does independents; I only see a couple on the list. One of the general schools websites used to list feeder schools, but I can't find it now.

The certificate of religious practice is now being used in schools that previously asked for a ketuba or other evidence of status. Some schools always had a supplementary form to confirm that families are shomer Shabbat and Kashrut and I don't think these have changed. The JFS and Hasmonean websites have their forms, so you can see what's asked for.

amother

Thu, May 12 2011, 12:11 pm

Hi. Has anyone heard if Noam is relocating to Edgware? Is it still independent or do they have a plan to become voluntary aided? Also can someone tell me more about Menorah Foundation, is it related to Menorah in GG, how frum are the families, do they accept families with TVs, boys and girls taught separately? They don't have a website so can't find much about the school.

TIA

Mrs Bissli

Thu, May 12 2011, 3:37 pm

I think there was an article about Noam purchasing a new site in JC recently. If I recall it's somewhere between Mill Hill and Hendon, don't think it's in Edgware but I could be wrong. I have a friend whose children go to Noam (and they seem happy there) so I can ask, but I think they're still independent. (Could it be you're thinking of Edgware Jewish Primary which did get a plan approval to become voluntary aided? They're still in temprary site, not sure when they're relocating to Edgware).

Sorry don't know much about Menorah foundation.

amother

Fri, May 13 2011, 3:21 am

Hi,

I'm not sure how much I can help but I can see that there were a couple of unanswered Qs from the amother a few above and thought I would try help.

Noam - they have bought a site somewhere near the Grahame Park Estate I believe, although the newspapers said between Hendon and Edgware. The school is not currently state-aided although would like to be in the future I believe, but who knows how long the process will take. In the meantime they need to raise money for the building and developing the site. As for the school itself, it has a wonderful reputation of being a genuinely frum school with lovely people and a good education.

Menorah Foundation - it was started about 25ish years ago by people who couldn't get their kids into Menorah Primary (not sure what it's like now, but back then you had to be a very active member of Munk's to get your kids in - not enough just to pay membership but also be seen at all the shiurim etc). They started in a small building, and have gradually progressed to their current premises in Burnt Oak. The education in both chol and kodesh was excellent for many years, and although I don't have first hand experience nowadays, people do rate it highly. The classes are taught mixed, with the exception of mishna for boys, nach for girls type of thing. I would guess that most families would have TVs nowadays, but there is probably a mix of people. Hope that answers your questions.

The best advice is to speak to people who have been through the process of applying, and hear what they have to say. A lot of our friends said that going to the school open days was very beneficial for them to see the chevra of potential parents and what it was like.