Awkward Guest Experience- need validation

amother

Sun, May 09 2010, 7:50 pm

I am rarely a guest and usually host myself. I am a very gracious person and go out of my way to make people feel comfortable. This past shabbat we were away as a family in a different city for a simcha and stayed over by a family we did not know from before. The experience was just so awkward and I can't stop thinking about it.

The hostess did not show us to our rooms when we came and just gave us directions how to get there.
The host did not help my husband getting our bags in nor loading the car at the end of our stay.
Nobody showed us where any food was nor offered us any. When I asked if I can take some milk for my baby, hostess showed me where it was and said of course, as an afterthought.
We ate out except for seudah shilishit. The family put out some food but kept it near them and did not pass it to us. I had to get up and reach over to take it and pass it to my family. They put out dips in containers that were piled and closed, with no serving spoons. Since they did not open and take any, no one from my family did out of embarrassment.
The host gave his young children food to eat in front of my children and did not offer any to them, even though my children were watching and hadn't eaten in a while. When I asked if my children can have some, he said sure, and added that they can take whatever they want as an afterthought.
The hostess kept telling my (generally well behaved) pre-school daughter that she should give toys back to her daughter without mentioning anything about sharing with a guest.
The hosts did not make much conversation with us and had a lot of dialogue between themselves in front of us. They did not go out of their way to include us or cue us in at all even though we were sitting right in front of them.

All in all the accommodations were beautiful and this was a well off family, but somehow we got the feeling that we were not welcome. It made me feel like, I don't need anybody's favors if they are doing it so begrudgingly and clearly making us feel like we are a burden.

What do you have to say? Am I quick to judge? At times, I felt like crying during our stay. All I wanted when I was in that home was to go home. I would have stayed home if there was no one else available to host us, I didn't need anybody's favors like this.

amother

Sun, May 09 2010, 8:06 pm

The overall experience does sound unpleasant sorry you had to go through that.

But I just wanted to post that BH we host people often for shabbos and some of the things you mentioned we've never done - like my dh carrying bags for the guests. Often, if the guests come at a time when I am very rushed (and my dh leaves for shul early so I am on my own with kids) I don't necessarily show them around - I just tell them where the room(s) they are staying in is etc. I do try to remember to tell them to take whatever they want (food and non-food) etc but again if I feel very rushed, I might forget. Of course some of the things you wrote are harder to be dan l"kaf zchus about (like not passing the food and not including you in the conversation) but I just wanted to mention that some things are not so "bad" and maybe you were just extra sensitive because of the general attitude.

(((hugs)))

JRKmommy

Sun, May 09 2010, 8:13 pm

Were these people used to having guests? If not, they may simply not be accustomed to thinking about these things.

They may also be used to hosting family or closer friends, who would be much more comfortable with "making themselves at home".

Finally, some families just have different styles. Some will feel the need to cater to guests, and even push food on them. Others will provide the basics, and expect that the guests will help themselves or let them know if they need something.

mimivan

Sun, May 09 2010, 8:19 pm

Yeah, maybe they were giving you the message that you should be independent......maybe it wasn't done in the most decorous way, but I've seen some of these things before, but always said much more clearly as in "If you want something on the table, help yourself." Or "There are the bedrooms, let me know if you need help with anything."

It is possible that they might have felt this way, but were too shy to say things directly..

amother

Sun, May 09 2010, 8:21 pm

I guess it's just the general attitude that bothered me and I was nitpicking on examples to help you understand why I felt unwelcome. I wouldn't expect a host to help with bags if they are rushed, which is possible they were, but when we were leaving, the couple was sitting at the computer oblivious to us loading the car. They got up briefly when we were about to leave to say good bye. And the host opened the door for me when I walked in with suitcases, but he did not offer to take them.

WriterMom, you're right. My husband said that these people probably had poor upbringing and did not realize how to make one feel comfortable, but they are of higher social breeding, both being from well off. Some things however were outright hard to understand.

Also, this couple has hosted before, from what I've heard from others.

Also, to clarify, I was a tidy guest, cleaned up after my kids and helped out where ever possible. I cannot imagine being such a burden, although I know it is hard work to host a family.

life'sgreat

Sun, May 09 2010, 8:57 pm

I can understand why you felt very uncomfortable and unwelcome. However, to me it seems like they simply don't have a clue as to how to host. I rarely host for various reasons. However, having just spent 5 weeks at my in laws, I learned so much about hosting and what not to do as a hostess. I don't think they didn't want you there. I just think they are either used to no guest, so they don't know. Or their usual guests are family, who are usually pretty much at ease and do serve themselves.

joy613

Mon, May 10 2010, 1:47 am

YESHASettler wrote:

I guess my husband and I are guilty of poor upbringing. We rarely, if ever, help our guests schlep their bags.

It sounds to me that they weren't expecting to feed you.

She clearly said that it wasn't just the fact that they did not help them carry up their bags that bothered her. No one is saying that they had a poor upbringing just based on that one example. It was the hosts' whole attitude in general, that they were not welcoming at all in every aspect.

Even if they were not expecting to feed them, once they were doing it anyways they could have done it graciously.

But OP, if that's really the case that they were not expecting to feed you seudah shlishit, that is a problem on behalf of the baalei simcha who should have warned the host family that they are not providing all 3 shabbos meals.

Inspired

Mon, May 10 2010, 3:53 am

It sounds like they were someone who were asked by your real host to allow you to sleep there. Is that right? I can understand why you were uncomfortable. I also understand how sometimes people are just not up to hosting guests and have a week where they don't invite their own guests (for financial or other reasons) but then a friend or neighbor asks them a favor to let their guests sleep by them and they feel obligated to say yes. They agreed to let you sleep there but maybe they didn't envision you hanging out, playing with the kids toys, etc.
Personally, if I was asked to host someone's family for a simcha my assumption would be that they would only be sleeping by me, not hanging out, eating snacks, playing. I would hope I would be more gracious than your host but I would have switch my mind set from "having someone else's gusests sleep here" to "my guests".
I could be totally off the mark but thats the way I picture it.

jflower

Mon, May 10 2010, 4:11 am

My husband and I were once Shabbos guests of a couple that we knew. The men went to shul together, and the wife slept until they came back from shul. I went down to the kitchen to make myself a coffee. There were no cups, coffee, nor anything to eat. I was pretty hungry and found some crackers in the pantry. Boy, was I happy when the men came home from shul - I finally got to eat!

I personally make sure that my guests know where the milchig cups, spoons etc are before going to sleep Friday night. I also leave out rugelach and cake so that everyone can help themselves. I guess each hostess has her own style and I try to be as welcoming as I can. I'm expecting guests this Shabbos, and will try to do my best.

Raizle

Mon, May 10 2010, 4:55 am

Once when we went to a simcha our relatives arranged for us to stay by their next door neighbors.
We barely had anything to do with them. We stayed downstairs in their basement, left and came through the basement back door. I gave them flowers for shabbos for hosting us but didn't expect anything from them really. Our relatives had left us a nice welcome package with some snacks and drinks and then anything else we needed we came to them.
But they were right next door and we could come and go through a gate between their backyards so it was pretty easy to just walk outside and then right into our relatives kitchen.

louche

Mon, May 10 2010, 5:07 am

How dreadful for you, sorry you had to go through that.
I think inspired had a good "chap," though all of the posters offered good possibilities. Not everyone knows how to be a good host, and so long as they simply didn't offer anything but didn't hold back once you asked, I would think that that's what it was. Just clueless people who aren't used to thinking ahead and anticipating the needs of guests, or people who are so used to asking for what they want that they assume others will do the same without being shy about it.
As to helping with the bags, if you do this, you are acting way lifnim mishurat hadin. kol hakavod to you, but I don't know anyone who does this.

bubby

Mon, May 10 2010, 5:24 am

I absolutely agree with OP, I too would have felt very uncomfortable staying in such an atmosphere. But just another side...I have had NIGHTMARISH guests over the years. I daren't go into details in case they are on here (I'm sure someone knows some of them.) It's not easy being a host either. This is NOT disparaging OP in any way, she sounds a very considerate guest.

Could there just have been mis-communication re meals? But either way, making your kids feel like Oliver Twist watching the Beadle chow down is awful. Sad

Nuts

Mon, May 10 2010, 6:00 am

It could be that they have guests so often that they take hosting for granted. I know somebody that has guests because her dh wants it and you could tell that she is doing the guests a favor for having them. She would go on and on about how tired she is etc. I always say that you have to be up to hosting guests. If not don't. It's not as if the guests don't have a home of their own and specifically need your house and food.