DD is on her way home, she left her counselor job!

amother

Mon, Aug 01 2011, 11:10 pm

She called me that she's coming home from overnight camp, and that she had made this decision on her own, after talking it over with staff . It seems that it was overwhelming for her, although according to the headstaff she was doing her job well. Unfortunately, the camp won't allow her to reverse her decision, someone has taken over for her already, so we can't help her think it over anymore.

My husband and myself are so upset, I'm literally in tears. she applied early for this job, and put a lot of thought, planning and preparation into it. Once there, I knew that she was feeling stressed, but never imagined she would do something so impulsive.

I'm afraid that she has ruined a valuable relationship, and her credibility. What can we do now?

Fox

Tue, Aug 02 2011, 10:40 am

I agree completely with Groisamomma: relax!

First of all, this is your daughter, not you. I'm a huge champion of parents coaching their kids in employment situations as well as kids' taking responsibility and learning the concept of professionalism when it comes to work. But don't internalize this; kids have to make their own decisions as well as bear their own consequences. Don't blur the boundary between you and your daughter.

Along those lines, don't worry too much about what other people will think of your daughter (or by extension, you!). I can assure you that plenty of teenagers leave camp jobs early, and while it does cause some eye-rolling and sighing on the staff's part, they'll be on to the next crisis before your daughter walks in the front door.

Finally, as Groisamomma pointed out, there may have been circumstances at the camp that would have prompted anyone to leave. Those of us who've participated on threads about camp and teenage summer employment have heard plenty of horror stories just here on imamother. Your daughter may feel guilty or at least self-conscious about her seeming lack of ability to "handle" the situation, so she may be reluctant to talk about it. That doesn't mean her reasons weren't legitimate, so don't make assumptions. Teenagers are peculiar sometimes; they'll talk your ears off about some things while they needlessly "go it alone" with others.

So what can you do now? Here are some things I'd recommend:

1. Don't act disappointed or pressure your daughter to tell you any details initially. However, be available to listen when she wants to talk about it. My guess is that the story will come out bit by bit.

2. After some time has elapsed, begin playing a more active role when your daughter discusses the experience. Ask her how she would handle a particular situation now, given her distance from it. Ask her to think about what she wishes she had known before taking the job. Ask her what questions she would ask before taking another job. Get her thinking about what she learned from the experience.

3. Write a brief note to the camp director, thanking him/her for giving your daughter an opportunity and briefly apologizing that "it didn't work out." No abject apologies needed, but everyone likes to be appreciated, especially when things go wrong.

4. As the school year starts, reflect (and help your daughter reflect) on whether her bad experience was a result of the job itself, the specific camp, or other circumstances. If she is not cut out to be a camp counselor, start helping her think of other ideas for the summer that match her interests and needs better.

Hatzlacha, and really, don't worry!

Barbara

Tue, Aug 02 2011, 11:13 am

amother wrote:

Give her credit for her maturity in recognizing that she was overwhelmed, in discussing it with the staff, and in ensuring that someone took over the job before she left. When she's ready, you can talk with her about what she found overwhelming, and about how she can deal with similar issues in other jobs.

amother

Thu, Aug 04 2011, 8:11 am

Thank you for your input, I greatly appreciate it. I can't believe how wise some of your insights are about this, you could almost know my daughter!

I do want to point out that the camp is very well run, the director and staff are warm and supportive, it's just the best camp in our circles,has a very warm, frum atmosphere, the chinuch is so special. Everyone, both campers and counselors thrive there. We sent our girls there as campers, and dd's older sister was a counselor there as well.

It's so disappointing that dd gave up this enriching experience.

Now we have to make the best of it. DD realizes that she shouldn't do things on impulse. ( till the next time at least Rolling Eyes

) She admitted to me that things were starting to get better, she could have had just a bit more patience. It turns out that the responsibility of her position weighed very heavily on her, she was just too serious about it, in particular she took to heart the speeches about responsibility they heard from the director , it just made her very anxious and unconfident.

It didn't help that for the first week she wasn't feeling too well, which is why the 24/7 being on call aspect was physically taxing for her. She also was working with a fine co-counselor who nonetheless was undermining her confidence by questioning her way of doing things, they weren't on the same page in terms of dealing with the campers. Although they were getting along on a personal level, DD felt like she was always giving in to her.

There was one staff member who knew exactly what to tell her: Relax, it's okay, you're okay.
But another staff member told her to trust her feelings. Confused

Unfortunately, she didn't have a close friend there to confide in, and the advice given to her at the end of the day wasn't in her best interest, which is why it's so maddening that she didn't call us! (She did call us and told me that she was having a hard time, and I tried to encourage her, but she didn't speak about quitting, or coming home!)

Fox

Thu, Aug 04 2011, 11:03 am

amother wrote:

I do want to point out that the camp is very well run, the director and staff are warm and supportive, it's just the best camp in our circles,has a very warm, frum atmosphere, the chinuch is so special. Everyone, both campers and counselors thrive there. We sent our girls there as campers, and dd's older sister was a counselor there as well.

It's so disappointing that dd gave up this enriching experience.

OP, I'm going to give some unsolicited advice here:

I don't doubt that this camp is the "best" in your circles, and I'm sure this reputation is well-earned.

However, I'm going to quote some advice from the career development/educational counseling field: What's the best college in the U.S.? One that you can graduate from. In other words, there's no point enrolling at Harvard, Yale, or Bob & Fred's Taxidermy School if you are not suited for it and won't be able to finish.

This is why the concept of "best" is destructive. The real "best" is what is best for each individual, not a reputation. Yes, yes, I know that there is a hierarchy in these things, and it's naive to pretend otherwise. But even subtly reminding your DD of this is the equivalent of rubbing her alleged failure in her face, as if you are saying, "You not only failed personally, but you embarrassed your family by failing at such a highly-regarded place." This is not a message that will encourage her to do better in the future!

For whatever combination of reasons, this situation wasn't "best" for your daughter right now. A decade from now, no one will remember. What will be remembered? Your daughter will remember whether your attitude was focused on what was best for her (and I don't mean mindless cheerleading here, but honest reflection and conversation) or whether you seemed more concerned about her missing an opportunity to be part of the "best" camp.

amother

Thu, Aug 04 2011, 6:11 pm

Quote:

For whatever combination of reasons, this situation wasn't "best" for your daughter right now. A decade from now, no one will remember. What will be remembered? Your daughter will remember whether your attitude was focused on what was best for her (and I don't mean mindless cheerleading here, but honest reflection and conversation) or whether you seemed more concerned about her missing an opportunity to be part of the "best" camp.

It's funny, but there were actually many inspiring and enjoyable moments she is telling me about, and she is even telling me how she really did like her co-counselor and wants to remain in touch with her. The only part of it that is disappointing is that she acted on impulse, and spoke to the wrong people, and that's why it ended that way, cause it didn't have to! But you are right that my attitude should be about what's best for her. I truly did believe that it would have been best for her to stay. If she would have continued to be too stressed for more than that first week, then I agree, it wouldn't have been "best for her". She admitted that she didn't want to be my "picture perfect daughter", which is why she wanted to make her own decision, and not go by my advice.

She is getting her old daycamp job now for the remaining weeks of the summer, they are happy to have her back! And she has learned some valuable lessons.

Kayza

Thu, Aug 04 2011, 11:49 pm

amother wrote:

The only part of it that is disappointing is that she acted on impulse, and spoke to the wrong people, and that's why it ended that way, cause it didn't have to!

Perhaps. But, I think you are missing something very important here. The staff person who told her to trust her feelings did something HUGE for her - she essentially told her "I trust you, I believe that you know and understand your own feelings, and I trust that you won't to anything out of line."

Everyone else was telling her that she was wrong - and all of them were people who she likes and / or respects. Can you imagine how depressing that is? I'm sure that she really enjoyed many aspects of camp, but can you imagine what it must be like to constantly be questioned and doubted?

The staff person who told her "It's ok and you're ok" probably had as much to do with her decision to leave as anyone else. Think about it: How would you feel if you woke up one morning and when you told your husband that you just don't feel like it's going to be a good morning he said "No, it's going to be a GREAT morning." And then, when you are having a hard time getting routine things done and you complain to your husband he responds "Oh, don't be so uptight, everything is FINE!" etc. I doubt you would feel encouraged. That's pretty much what happened to your daughter.

Quote:

She admitted that she didn't want to be my "picture perfect daughter", which is why she wanted to make her own decision, and not go by my advice.

Interesting - and very important! It sounds like she figured she knew what you would say, and that her perception is that your advice would be based on what would be best for a "best" girl (and her older sister), rather than on HER and her needs etc. That's something you need to work on.

amother

Fri, Aug 05 2011, 7:49 am

Perhaps. But, I think you are missing something very important here.

Quote:

The staff person who told her to trust her feelings did something HUGE for her - she essentially told her "I trust you, I believe that you know and understand your own feelings, and I trust that you won't to anything out of line."

I actually wonder whether she had her best interest in mind. Accepting a resignation so quickly... Trust your feelings here meant: you're right, maybe you're not capable. If someone's not confident, yet you know they are doing a good job, you TELL them that. It's called encouragement. She could just have easily encouraged her. The thing is that my dd can sometimes state her opinions with utter confidence, so she may have convinced them that she can't handle it.

Quote:

The staff person who told her "It's ok and you're ok" probably had as much to do with her decision to leave as anyone else. Think about it: How would you feel if you woke up one morning and when you told your husband that you just don't feel like it's going to be a good morning he said "No, it's going to be a GREAT morning." And then, when you are having a hard time getting routine things done and you complain to your husband he responds "Oh, don't be so uptight, everything is FINE!" etc. I doubt you would feel encouraged. That's pretty much what happened to your daughter.

But the girl who told her she's okay, didn't mean "it's not true what you're saying". She saw through to the crux of the problem, She basically told her that nobody was expecting perfection from her, that it was okay to be her not perfect self, and that it's NORMAL to feel like she was feeling, that all dd needed was to rest up a bit (physically speaking), get herself together, and feel better, that's all it was!

Quote:

but honestly, parents DO have their childrens interests in mind, when they want that "best" opportunity for them. Teenagers may be skeptical, but in the end they realize that. True, there are times that those "best" opportunities turn out to need some adjustment, or don't always fit. Or the Aibershter has other plans for that child.

Generally though, parents do know their children and what is appropriate for them, and part of being your child's advocate is to believe in them. The world out there is only too quick to dismiss anyone who isn't a dazzling star. WE are the ones who tell our children they CAN do it.

Kayza

Fri, Aug 05 2011, 1:53 pm

amother wrote:

I actually wonder whether she had her best interest in mind. Accepting a resignation so quickly... Trust your feelings here meant: you're right, maybe you're not capable.

Sorry, that's totally your projection. You didn't want her to leave, and you are upset, but you have nothing to base yourself on.

Quote:

If someone's not confident, yet you know they are doing a good job, you TELL them that. It's called encouragement.

Not necessarily. Remember, the issue was not just whether she was doing a good job, but whether this was too much stress for her. She was being questioned a lot by someone she respects, and felt like she had to keep on giving in to her. You can't encourage someone out of that. She was ultra worried about fulfilling the responsibilities of the job - may she wsa right and this kind of responsibility is not for her because it's too stressful, not because she's not competent enough etc.

Quote:

Even assuming that you are right, that doesn't make a difference unless the person actually told her all of that explicitly. Telling her "It's ok" as shorthand simply does not work. Remember that she was also dealing with the issue of not seeing eye to eye with the other counselor. Nothing in the above deals with that. Possibly the person talking to her didn't know about that issue, but you need to realize that it still would have played a role in what your daughter was hearing, and in how effective this response would be.

And, of course, unless you've spoken to that staff person, who told you the above, it's quite possible the she basically thought she was dealing with someone who is a bit of a "drama queen" who needs to be told to get off her high horse a bit.

Quote:

but honestly, parents DO have their childrens interests in mind, when they want that "best" opportunity for them. Teenagers may be skeptical, but in the end they realize that.

True, most parents do, but even then they don't recognize that what they think is best, really is not. And, even when the parents ARE right, teenagers don't necessarily realize that (at least until much later)

In your case, I think your daughter has a legitimate point. Look at what happened here - you were sure that this was the wrong decision before you even found out why she made the decision. And, then, when you described the camp, you talked about how "everyone" does so well there, and so did her older sister.

The point I'm making here is not that your daughter made the right choice- I simply don't know whether that's the case or not. But you seem to have come to a conclusion before you had all the facts, and you are clearly having a hard time giving real open evaluation of the possibility that it actually may be been the right thing for her.

Quote:

and part of being your child's advocate is to believe in them. The world out there is only too quick to dismiss anyone who isn't a dazzling star. WE are the ones who tell our children they CAN do it.

But, you are busy telling her that you DO NOT believe in her - or at least in her ability to make a reasonable decision, even if it's not the best one. Your devastation says that you think she really messed up here.

amother

Mon, Aug 08 2011, 5:13 am

Quote:

It's not the end of the world. it certainly puts a different spin on things. Things could have been handled differently. it's not her fault that the camp didn't try to see what could be done to help her. What's done is done, what's more important is helping her overcome her insecurity, because that is the real issue.

Quote:

Look at what happened here - you were sure that this was the wrong decision before you even found out why she made the decision. And, then, when you described the camp, you talked about how "everyone" does so well there, and so did her older sister.

SHE did well there, in the past. I was in touch with her, before she decided to leave, it's not like I didn't know what was happening. When we spoke, leaving wasn't brought up. She had mentioned the idea of switching jobs with someone else. I was encouraging her to work it out, and take it day by day.
It happens to be, that in our family, nothing comes easy, or ever has. You have to gird yourself with patience, perseverence and persistance, and work hard to succeed. Giving up isn't the way to go.