This is what my dd's Lakewood school sent out to all parents

Simple1

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 6:15 pm

I wouldn't like my girls seeing that story.

But this has nothing to do with Chareidim, Lakewood, or where BY is headed.

Actually I think BY education has gotten more positive in the past years - trying to emphasize dignity rather than shame.

I have several girls in Lakewood schools and this is definitely not typical. But I guess, as pointed out by some posters, we should be dan lkaf zchus, that this was a slip up. I did hear that school is one of the more sought after schools. I do think OP can speak up those who put out the newsletter.

Tova

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 6:27 pm

Wasn't it in Lakewood that the Ateres program (where girls gather after licht bentching Friday nights) began? I have their materials and it's really wonderful...although in my case *I* want to be teaching this to my daughter when she is older, just the two of us after licht bentching.

Last edited by Tova on Wed, Jun 06 2012, 6:34 pm; edited 1 time in total

Peanut2

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 6:30 pm

I just read that tale in a sefer recently! My hubby was reading something and showed it to me.
Did not know what to make of it. Will ask DH where it's from since I can't remember right now.

What I took from it is that if we don't educate our children now they will suffer more later. As in, a temper tantrum now is better than a child with no compassion, empathy, discipline, etc. That was the best I could come up with.

amother

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 6:30 pm

Maya wrote:

shalhevet wrote:

Hashem yeracheim - do those schools not have any positive ways to teach tznius??? [/b]
.

In short, no.

Didn't read the entire thread, but this bothered me. I grew up in Lakewood not so long ago, and went to Bais Faiga elementary school. The teachers and principals helped develop in me a feeling of pride in being tzanua. They always taught us that we are daughters of the king, and therefore, need to act as such. (including dress, speech, where we eat, and the like). Even today, working on tznius makes me feel proud of being a princess, the daughter of Hashem. Please don't say that no schools have a positive way of teaching tznius. It is an "all or nothing" statement which is not completely true.

amother

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 6:39 pm

Simple1 wrote:

I have seen that too. I have to say the BY here is SO much better than 10 years ago or so. But I am "OOT" too.

Chocoholic

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 6:57 pm

From the beautiful stories on tznius.

To scary stories about bad luck, diseases and other not so nice things happening...

To "burn in hell" girls if you are not tznius...

Sad

Maya

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 7:05 pm

amother wrote:

Maya wrote:

shalhevet wrote:

Hashem yeracheim - do those schools not have any positive ways to teach tznius??? [/b]
.

In short, no.

I only spoke for my school, which was Satmar in Williamsburg. I heard this and similar stories repeatedly. I know nothing about any Lakewood school.

Peanut2

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 7:22 pm

Peanut2 wrote:

The story is written in Shomer Emunim by R' Aharale Roth, the 'founder' of Toldos Aharon/Toldos Avraham Yitzchak.

amother

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 8:34 pm

I went to one of the only girls high schools at the time in the UK. We were once brought for tehillim during one of the intifadas at recess, and the Rabbi proceeded to spew that the bombings were OUR personal fault for not davening hard enough. Mind you, this was the same Rabbi who also 'punished' us by forbidding us to Daven if he felt we were misbehaving... Rolling Eyes

ValleyMom

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 8:38 pm

Why must we teach with negativity
Why can't we come from a place of LOVE and TOLERANCE?>???

We should dress modestly BECAUSE we love Hashem.

Children always learn best coming from a place of LOVE ratehr than fear.

marina

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 8:45 pm

Ok, on one hand I am pleased that people, including very frum ones, are outraged.

On the other hand, help me to understand how this is worse than the klalos in the chumash. Do you get upset when your children are taught that if they don't follow the torah, they will be so starving that they will eat their young?

כט. וַאֲכַלְתֶּם בְּשַׂר בְּנֵיכֶם וּבְשַׂר בְּנֹתֵיכֶם תֹּאכֵלוּ

Simple1

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 9:03 pm

marina wrote:

Ok, on one hand I am pleased that people, including very frum ones, are outraged.

On the other hand, help me to understand how this is worse than the klalos in the chumash. Do you get upset when your children are taught that if they don't follow the torah, they will be so starving that they will eat their young?

כט. וַאֲכַלְתֶּם בְּשַׂר בְּנֵיכֶם וּבְשַׂר בְּנֹתֵיכֶם תֹּאכֵלוּ

I was thinking about this again before you posted this. And I think during the course of a kids education s/he's going to hear all kinds of things. Nothing will happen if they hear negative once in a long while, as long as the overall emphasis is positive.

Actually when I read the story, I had some "de ja vu" - it seems familiar but I'm not really sure. So I may have learned it somewhere sometime , but it wasn't repeated enough for me to remember it clearly.

Last edited by Simple1 on Wed, Jun 06 2012, 9:08 pm; edited 1 time in total

mummiedearest

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 9:07 pm

marina wrote:

Ok, on one hand I am pleased that people, including very frum ones, are outraged.

On the other hand, help me to understand how this is worse than the klalos in the chumash. Do you get upset when your children are taught that if they don't follow the torah, they will be so starving that they will eat their young?

כט. וַאֲכַלְתֶּם בְּשַׂר בְּנֵיכֶם וּבְשַׂר בְּנֹתֵיכֶם תֹּאכֵלוּ

ime, the schools don't really teach that in any way that makes the kids think it applies to them. they kind of gloss over subjects like that. just like they teach that yehuda "tortured" tamar. they don't use specifics.

Simple1

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 9:10 pm

mummiedearest wrote:

marina wrote:

Ok, on one hand I am pleased that people, including very frum ones, are outraged.

On the other hand, help me to understand how this is worse than the klalos in the chumash. Do you get upset when your children are taught that if they don't follow the torah, they will be so starving that they will eat their young?

כט. וַאֲכַלְתֶּם בְּשַׂר בְּנֵיכֶם וּבְשַׂר בְּנֹתֵיכֶם תֹּאכֵלוּ

I agree with this too.

black sheep

Wed, Jun 06 2012, 10:03 pm

Chocoholic wrote:

Is this even Judaism?

This has a lot more in common with Catholicism & Islam

that's a question I seemed to be entertaining a lot lately....