$100K great new income, yeh right!!!!!

amother

Wed, Aug 22 2007, 9:12 pm

This whole thread makes me really angry. We left NY and moved to an out-of-town community because financially it was too difficult in NY. I am ashamed that so many people in Klal Yisrael are willing to lie in order to live in a community which is too expensive for them. Yes, I would love to live near my family. It is not an option for us. Oy, oy, oy, to see what Klal Yisrael has sunk to. You know, all these bubbies and zaidies worked long, grueling hours in factories because they spoke no English--and they raised Torahdik families who are beautiful, and yes they should have the nachas of living close to the eineklach and being at all the simchas--but what sort of nachas is it for them, that their children and grandchildren are lying and deceiving and breaking the law and over basic halacha with ZERO BUSHA? Better the families should live farther away from the bubbies and call a lot on the phone and drive/fly to visit, and be mentchen.

raizy

Wed, Aug 22 2007, 10:43 pm

some of u ladies are really mean to that original poster. she grew up in a house and enviorment where pple got stuff . wheter u like it or not.

and no some pple can not live without a cleaning lady every week. what is better "waste"I say "invest" in a cleaning lady every week 50 dollars for 5 hrs or even more.
do u ladies even want to know what would happen to alot of households without cleaning help. it would disentergrate. then the lady would land up int he hospital then the kids would be scattered to the four winds. and the poor father would have to pay 85 dollars a day for babysitting times it for as many kids that u have ... it ends up more then that lousy 50 dollars u jewish women didnt "fargin" that women. because accroding to u that women should suffer and clean and cook and take care of her 6 ,7,8 kids and work 10 hrs a day. so that her children should be in day care all day long so as long as she doesnt get food stamp and whatever else u get in ny.

you ladies put me in big shame that u can not fargin someone a cleaning lady. u should be first in line to pay her the cleaning lady .

next about lying to the goverment. thank g-d I live in a country where they pay u alot of money. but if u make over the cut off. u get cut off. so fast of everything. so it really makes u wonder if u should try harder and improve your lot or just stay where u are and not have to go up on your tution. since there is no such thing of food stamps or other things. medicare is universal everyone gets it. so is day care. u just pay 7 dollars a day.

so I end up having to pay for my mortgage , food ,utilities,tution, which I think adds up to onther mortgage payment each month. I have 4 in school. it doesnt cover it never covered.... I dont buy new clothing. and I never buy in the children place that is a luxery for me. try having a hubby out of a job for 2 yrs maybe then your compassion for that women would start to show up.

so I work and yes it is a goverment job they pay me so everythibng is white as we yiden say. it doesnt cover. we are jumping from one bill to the next.

I am laughing at all u ladies who talk about how some n.y pple lye and cheat to get goverment funding what do u really want these pple to do. eat bread and butter. and hike everywhere. not buy any new cloths. ever. and live in a 2 bedroom apartment with 12 kids because that is all they can really afford if they dont take any money from the goverment. the list goes on and on.

and one last thing I do thing that it is u ladies who have 2 kids only who tell other ladies how to live bc u "suffered" and only had 2 kids and anybody who doesnt make good money is not allowed to have more then two kids.this is a totoly anti jewish way of thinking.

amother

Wed, Aug 22 2007, 11:07 pm

amother wrote:

Does anyone know if HALACHICALLY getting benefits from the government you may not need is the equivalent of stealing?

amother

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 9:09 am

OP makes me see red!!!! We live live in the northeast too. dh works 12-or more hours a day in a deadend job making very little with no benefits. I worked fulltime our entire married life, suffered through periods of dh unemployment, only took off 6 weeks maternity leave with each child, we make less than $100,000 together, are paying 4 yeshiva tuitions right now, I don't have cleaning lady, we can't even imagine owning a house. I buy most of my clothes in thrift shops, eat chicken only on shabbes and yontiff, "vacation" means visiting my in-laws over succos. I buy no-name brand everythingwhen its on sale, half our furniture is from our parents' houses and almost as old as we are. I accept hand-me-down clothes, cut my kids' hair myself, bake my own challah and baked goods, and would grow my own vegetables if I had a yard, which I don't. I take good care of everything we have to make it last as long as possible and replace things only when they can't be fixed any more. I reduce reuse recycle not just b/c it's the right thing to do but b/c it saves me money. I never buy books or magazines but borrow them from the library. I have 6 pairs of shoes to my name not counting the $5.99 pair of mock crocs I just got for YomKippur b/c my canvas shoes ripped over Tishabove, and I consider that a lot of shoes. I have 5 skirts, 8 blouses and 2 jackets for work that I wear all year round, 3 shabbos suits and 4 shabbos blouses that I mix and match and accessorize with colorful scarves that I've had forever. And 2 long dresses that I bought on sale from catalogs to wear to fancy weddings.

And I don't feel sorry for myself or consider myself poor or deprived. I think what OP needs is not more money but a change of attitude and a class on thrift. I highly recommend The Tightwad Gazette books which are chock-full of money-saving ideas.

amother

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 9:30 am

I'm the poster who moved out of NY--

Hey, thanks, I will try the NWT tip.

Quote:

I have yet to see anyone end up in a mental institution when deprived of one.

Seriously, all you New Yorkers wouldn't believe how different standards are in my town. It is very normal for ladies to wear plain stretchy skirts and polos--and I'm talking very yeshivish, chashuve ladies, kollel wives & wives of askanim...and there is no pressure to have an immaculate house. It's a different life.

I don't want to sound too harsh, but you know, we tell our kids about how heroic the Yidden were who remained shomer Shabbos in the early part of the 20th century. They struggled to feed their kids--yet they did not budge in their commitment to Torah. Most of the people in NY today speak English well and would be able to get a normal job in an out-of-town community. So when someone says:

Quote:

I am laughing at all u ladies who talk about how some n.y pple lye and cheat to get goverment funding what do u really want these pple to do. eat bread and butter. and hike everywhere. not buy any new cloths. ever. and live in a 2 bedroom apartment with 12 kids because that is all they can really afford if they dont take any money from the goverment. the list goes on and on.

it is hard for me to feel pity. MOVE OUT OF NEW YORK! These people are making a choice. The heimishe community they love versus Hashem's Torah...which wins? It is not like it's 1910 and you just got off the boat and speak only Yiddish and the only jobs are for Shabbos-desecrators!!! If your nisayon is to move out of town in order to raise our families without deceit, yes that can be hard, but it hardly compares to what previous generations went through.

Come on, ladies, our generation is so spoiled!

I think if you could be in a community where standards were different, you would feel so much better. Do you know what it's like to breathe?? To be able to relax a little and not be constantly keeping up with the Cohens? Yes, for a lot of us, parnassah will always be a challenge, we'll always be working hard to juggle ka'h our large families and many expenses, but if you live in a place where you're not doomed before you start by the exhorbitant rents/mortgages and the lavish community standards, then there won't be the same terrible nisayon to lie and cheat for survival.

Mitzvahmom

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 12:23 pm

Now I was caught in a situation, not of my own fault (well parcially). At some point in time, I was getting more money then I was supposed to from the government..

I am a single mom, working part-time and going go college. I am on foodstamps and state health insurance. My foodstamps have varied from $50 to $200 (if I am lucky). They monitor u very carefully.

Evidently for 2 months I got more than I was supposed to, oy it so hurt getting pennies for 3 months to pay back what I owed.

G-d forbid those of you cheating the system get caught, but they do make u pay it back! It's one of the reasons I am worried about moving to the NY area for nursing school. The cost of living is so HIGH, I just keep hoping to get into a school close by. But we will have to move to a smaller place just to survive financially.

I do not have a cleaning lady (maybe once a year a treat myself and it's not $50 for 3 hours it's more like $75 or$80 for 3 hours)... I use the flylady system, and honestly yes about 2/3 of my home is a disaster! 1/3 is not, and my sink is always shiny in the morning LOL

Mitzvahmom

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 12:27 pm

raizy wrote:

and one last thing I do thing that it is u ladies who have 2 kids only who tell other ladies how to live bc u "suffered" and only had 2 kids and anybody who doesnt make good money is not allowed to have more then two kids.this is a totoly anti jewish way of thinking.

I am sorry but this is rude... YOu do not know people's lives or the reason they make these choices...

BTW the point of a forum is to have open discussions for you to state how you feel about something...and people respond.. You may not agree with what they have to say...but it's not nice to lash out at them

amother

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 1:21 pm

Raizy, I actually think you're joking about me paying for the cleaning lady of a woman who lies in order to be able to take $$$ she's not entitled to, but just in case you're serious, or anyone agrees with you, here's my rant.
My 67-year old mother MOWS HER OWN LAWN, never mind a cleaning lady.
She found herself a single mother of 3 children, a secretary at a yeshiva, and managed to put us all through College and marry us off without taking a penny from anyone. Granted, I don't believe she paid tuition, but she managed to own her home. You know how? She worked hard, and she went without. And my siblings and I all earned our own money since we were 13 years old. I babysat, waitressed, worked in retail, tutored etc. My friends would ask for $20 from their parents to go to a movie, where I had to pay my own way. Only I couldn't even go, because I was probably working. And to this day, my mother mows her own lawn.
And you know what else? After she had a burglary in her house, the insurance guy advised her to "embellish" her claim form. MY MOTHER REFUSED!!! She did not want a penny she was not entitled to.
And if many of you would see my mother, my siblings and myself, you would consider us less frum than you.

amother

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 2:12 pm

Mitzvahmom wrote:

Now I was caught in a situation, not of my own fault (well parcially). At some point in time, I was getting more money then I was supposed to from the government..

oy it so hurt getting pennies for 3 months to pay back what I owed.

When I first started working, I was replacing someone who left who was getting paid more than I was. For several months, my employer paid me the same amount that she had been getting. I had no idea I was being overpaid, since I was just starting out and had no frame of reference. You never know what your check’s going to look like after all the deductions, and it’s always less than you imagine it’s going to be.

Then one day I got a letter from my employer informing me that I had been overpaid such-and-such a sum, and did I prefer to write them a check for this sum or have them deduct it from my pay. Of course I chose the latter. Silly me, I thought they meant they would take $X out of my paycheck for several months till the debt was repaid After all, the debt was incurred over a period of months, it makes sense that it be repaid the same way. HA! HA! HA! Imagine my shock when next payday I got a check for $3.52! The whole debt was claimed back in one fell swoop, never mind that it was their mistake and that I had rent to pay and groceries to buy.

B”H I had been saving money from every paycheck since the beginning and had a cash cushion to see me through, but to this day I think the way my employer handled the situation was despicable. The excuse? “It would create a bookkeeping nightmare to let you pay it back in installments.”

Exploding anger

GAMZu

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 4:52 pm

amother wrote:

Mitzvahmom wrote:

That is a horror! Shame, shame on him. I hope he isn't Jewish or frum. What a disgrace.

mimsy7420

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 5:46 pm

amother wrote:

Does anyone know if HALACHICALLY getting benefits from the government you may not need is the equivalent of stealing?

Is that a serious question? Why wouldn't it be stealing?

TammyTammy

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 5:50 pm

amother wrote:

I'm confused... didn't you know what your rate of pay was going to be before you started? And, if so, didn't you look at your paystub and see "oh, that's more than it should be."

Tammy

TammyTammy

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 5:52 pm

only1 wrote:

amother wrote:

Does anyone know if HALACHICALLY getting benefits from the government you may not need is the equivalent of stealing?

Is that a serious question? Why wouldn't it be stealing?

If you're entitled to it, then it's not stealing. She questioned about need.

If I retire a billionaire, I'm still entitled to Social Security, and if I take it, it is not stealing at all.

Tammy

shoy18

Thu, Aug 23 2007, 6:12 pm

TammyTammy wrote:

only1 wrote:

amother wrote:

Does anyone know if HALACHICALLY getting benefits from the government you may not need is the equivalent of stealing?

Is that a serious question? Why wouldn't it be stealing?

If you're entitled to it, then it's not stealing. She questioned about need.

If I retire a billionaire, I'm still entitled to Social Security, and if I take it, it is not stealing at all.

Tammy

Social security is quite different than wic or the like. You work your whole life and put aside money for social security, its mostly your money, who cares how rich you are. As for wic, if you dont not need it why take it away from those actually do need it.