Dreading Purim...Drunk Hubby

amother

Thu, Feb 21 2013, 6:35 pm

Is something wrong with me? Every time Purim comes around I find myself dreading it more and more. My husband becomes drunk as soon as the day starts, a little alcohol does that to him. The whole day is just embarrassing for me and the kids! As my dh tends to make a fool out of himself wherever we go! I drive him around, most times he stays in the car out cold! How am I supposed to enjoy this happy day??

amother

Thu, Feb 21 2013, 8:09 pm

Nothing is wrong with you, of course you dread it with a dh who is drunk. That's ok to dread that part of it. I think that aspect is really really unfair to women. I know it's purim and he is supposed to drink, but, I don't care how much the Torah says you need to drink on purim, if it makes your wife unhappy shalom bayis is more important.

amother

Thu, Feb 21 2013, 8:30 pm

Why drag him around if he is out cold? Leave him on the couch with a vomit bag.

be good

Thu, Feb 21 2013, 8:54 pm

can you ask him to wait to drink until later in the afternoon, so you can enjoy most of the day together? then oce he ets drunk, take him home, and soon purim will be over!

zaq

Thu, Feb 21 2013, 11:29 pm

Of course there's nothing wrong with you. IMHO men who get disgusting drunk on Purim are not doing it leshem mitzvah. More like leSHAME themselves. There is no halacha requiring one to get falling-down drunk, and in fact if one is going to act in an undignified or despicable manner after drinking, one should not drink at all.

The exact wording is to drink Ad Delo yada bein Arur haman leVaruch Mordechai.

Now, note that it doesn't say to drink till you can't distinguish between haman and mordecai--for that, you'd have to be a real goner. But Arur haman and Baruch Mordechai are not poles apart--they are opposite sides of the same coin, the same idea viewed from a different angle--iow, a very fine distinction that only a little bit of alcoholic influence would make one too befuddled to understand. So one is obligated only to get a teeny bit "elevated" and not drunk as a skunk. In fact, it's forbidden to get drunk as a skunk.

for those who cannot tolerate even a small amount of alcohol without getting drunk as a skunk, sleep is also a state in which one is unable to make any kind of intellectual distinctions. The requirement can be satisfied by taking a snooze.

None of this is Piskei Rabbanit Zaqarias--it's straight from Kitzur Shulchan Aruch siman kuf mem bet, seif vav.

I agree with amother who recommends leaving dh at home to sleep it off and you go out and enjoy your holiday without His Sottedness dragging you down. It's not a solution to the drunkenness but at least it will let you enjoy the festivities.

IMHopinion

Thu, Feb 21 2013, 11:36 pm

What does he say about it? Does he generally respect your wishes?

My DH got drunk one year, and you can be sure he NEVER did it again. He realized how hurt and furious I was.

naturalmom5

Thu, Feb 21 2013, 11:43 pm

"If one will not be able to conduct oneself in a dignified manner and be in an elevated spiritual state from the wine , better to rely on the Rama and drink a little bit more then go to sleep"
Just saw this tonite in a local magazine

manhattanmom

Thu, Feb 21 2013, 11:48 pm

It is so not a mitzvah to get so drunk that you can't function at all and become an embarrassment to your spouse and children.

Luckily, my dh doesn't get drunk ever, he does enjoy a drink (like I do) over dinner--once in a while.

But on Purim it is necessary for him to remain sober so as an active Hatzalah member he can take care of everyone elses's husband.

bamamama

Fri, Feb 22 2013, 12:05 am

amother wrote:

No. It's time this nonsense is stopped. I posted this in the other thread but I'll post it here again. Bolding is mine.

Quote:

Sobering Thoughts for Purim - And Everyday
By Rabbi Marc D. Angel
The Talmud (Megillah 7b) quotes the opinion of Rava that a person must become drunk on Purim so as not to be able to tell the difference between “cursed be Haman” and “blessed be Mordecai.” That is pretty drunk!

But the same passage goes on to report that Rabba and Rav Zeira became drunk on Purim, so much so that Rabba slaughtered Rav Zeira with a knife. The latter was revived only by a miracle. When Rabba invited Rav Zeira to a Purim celebration the following year, Rav Zeira wisely declined.

Some people read this passage but stop right after Rava’s opinion that one must become drunk on Purim. Thus, in some circles people really think it is a mitzvah to get drunk on Purim. This leads to foolish and dangerous behavior, sometimes actually resulting in loss of life.

Others, quite correctly, read the entire passage; they recognize that the anecdote about Rabba and Rav Zeira is a blatant refutation of the opinion of Rava. These two rabbis indeed became drunk, but this led to terrible consequences. The Talmud’s lesson is: don’t get drunk, don’t lose control of yourself, terrible things can happen if you become intoxicated.

Drunkenness is a shameful state into which no one should ever fall. Maimonides (Hilkhot De’ot 5:3) states: “One who becomes intoxicated is a sinner and is despicable, and loses his wisdom. If he [a wise person] becomes drunk in the presence of common folk, he has thereby desecrated the Name.” In his section on the Laws of Holiday Rest (6:20), Maimonides rules: “When one eats, drinks and celebrates on a festival, he should not allow himself to become overly drawn to drinking wine, amusement and silliness…for drunkenness and excessive amusement and silliness are not rejoicing; they are frivolity and foolishness.”

If one has become intoxicated, it is forbidden to pray or to render a halakhic decision. Not only does drunkenness impair one’s judgment, it demeans a person in the eyes of others and in the eyes of God.

The Wall Street Journal recently ran a front page article on a phenomenon among some synagogues known as “Kiddush Club.” These synagogues allow (and seem to encourage) the drinking of alcoholic beverages during services and/or immediately after services. These “Kiddush Clubs” generally convene when the Haftarah is about to be read in synagogue. Members of the “Club” walk out on the words of the prophets, and remain outside during the rabbis’ sermons: and they drink! They later return to services for the Musaf, often reeking from the odor of whiskey.

The Wall Street Journal article mentioned an Orthodox synagogue that is starting a “L’Chaim Club,” in which members will pay $100 for the privilege of participating in the drink fest after Shabbat morning services. One rabbi is quoted that his synagogue spends thousands of dollars each week, providing a lavish lunch/Kiddush along with a fancy variety of alcoholic beverages. This statement was apparently said without embarrassment, but as a source of pride that he is able to attract a large attendance on Shabbat mornings by offering food and drink.

The impression left by this article is that people come to synagogue mainly for social reasons, for a free lunch, and for the opportunity to sample a variety of liquors.

In some circles, the “Kiddush Club” concept has apparently reached new heights. People are offered a wide variety of alcoholic beverages. They compare one brand with another; they become proficient in the various blends, and they know which are the most expensive. This is a kind of hedonism and self-indulgence which shouldn’t take place anywhere, let alone in a synagogue setting.

It is right and proper for synagogues to sponsor Kiddush after services each week. This gives congregants an opportunity to socialize after the prayers have concluded. It builds a feeling of friendship and community. It offers a communal Shabbat experience for those who may be alone, or who don’t know much about Shabbat observance. It’s fine if congregants take a small drink of wine or a sip of scotch or raki. But it really is not fine if people imbibe too much, or if they pay too much attention to analyzing and discussing the qualities and ages of various alcoholic beverages.

We should strive to be connoisseurs of the spirit, not connoisseurs of the spirits.

I wish you a happy, safe and sober Purim—and a happy, safe and dignified life.