dd says her uncle pulled up her skirt and rubbed her- locked

marina

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 11:20 am

detroitmom wrote:

We all need to remember not to paint the 13 year old as a monster. He is only a minor child, who was probably molested himself. The monsters are the child's parents who apparently are so disturbed they would stop talking to their daughter in law for being upset over this behavior. They condone it and very possibly are guilty of incestuous behavior.

This is a very important post. The perpetrator is not a grown man. He is a child. We don't know what happened to him, we don't know what his home life is like, we don't know how much impulse control he has or what he knows about how horrible his behavior is. Assuming your daughter, OP, is not hysterically crying as he's doing this, the boy may just be thinking she'll be okay with it, it's not so bad, she'll come around at some point.

As for advice, I don't know if this is practical in your situation, but I would call a counselor (or equavalent) at the boy's school, tell them this whole story, and ask them to condition the boy's attendance on mandatory counseling. It depends on the school but it might force the parents into helping their child. At the very least, the boy's school will be aware and can keep an eye on problems down the road.

happy12

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 11:39 am

marina wrote:

As for advice, I don't know if this is practical in your situation, but I would call a counselor (or equavalent) at the boy's school, tell them this whole story, and ask them to condition the boy's attendance on mandatory counseling. It depends on the school but it might force the parents into helping their child. At the very least, the boy's school will be aware and can keep an eye on problems down the road.

OP mentioned that her ILs are Chasidish. I highly doubt the school has a counselor or anyone with any training equip to handle this situation.

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 12:30 pm

Culturedpearls wrote:

Run don't walk to the nearest police station!!!
Shabbos at your In laws? Are you out of your mind?
I'd report this yesterday & then go to the in laws & tell them exactly what I did. I'd pick up the snotty faced BIL by his ears & tell him that if he so much as goes anywhere your kids within a 5 mile radius he'll be arrested (take out a restraining order). I'd probably beat him to a pulp first!
And no I wouldn't talk to DH or counselers or anyone else. This would be my first & only reaction as a mother.
I would take DD with me to all this. Let her see justice served, it would go a long way to recovery.

I wish my parents would react like this! Instead they chose to shush me down for the sake of the family! 20 years later, and Im still suffering of PTSD. OP do right by your daughter, even if it enrages or breaks teh family!

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 1:51 pm

you MUST protect your daughter. #1 priority. I was SA by a family member for 10+ yrs and I too have PTSD and severe problems. If it means never going to your in-laws again and never having them over then so be it. but your DD should be protected. Please take her to a qualified therapist ASAP. Not just any therapist, but someone who specializes in SA (took me about 3 yrs to find a qualified therapist).

Please also educate all of your children on good touch/bad touch ASAP and tell them that they can and should talk to you abt anything. Also make sure your children know that your DH is not allowed to touch them in their private areas as well and make it clear that your ears and heart is open to WHATEVER they say!!! (even if it is horrible and horrifying and makes you sick)

Once you figure out how to help your daughter you must talk to your Husband, BIL and In Laws. your BIL is likely a predator (don't care how old he is) and needs help asap. Who knows how many other kids he is hurting, his other cousins, nieces nephews etc.

(note - I did not read the thread, it is too disturbing and triggering for me)

RUN RUN RUN to get help for your daughter. if she had a broken bone you would not sit for days thinking about what to do for a broken bone. this is an emergency and should be treated as such!

Shana_H

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 2:16 pm

Ms CulturedPearl & Ms GreenFire you are two of the smartest most insitefull ladies I've had the pleasure of "meeting"! I second & third every scrap of advice you've given OP here! To the Amother who feels as though DH is "covering up" some terrible family secret, I can't agree with you more. To all the Amothers who are still suffering from their own childhood abuse, my heart goes out to you all, a million, trillion hugs and good wishes, :-)

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 2:36 pm

Shana_H wrote:

A new amother here. Thanks for the good wishes.
I can unfortunately give firsthand testimony to the destruction s-xual abuse causes.
What hurts me most is when people don't realize how truly devastating it can be to every area of one's life.
No, it is not something one can just "forget and move on."
Whether you think a little kid was hurt by it or not, it is not something you want to shove under the rug. You never really know the true effects it may have.
The biggest gift one can give their child is loving, unconditional and open support. When a child has nowhere to turn, that hurts more than anything. I know. Because I was once that child. And until I can find inner peace...I will remain that abused child.

Sorry, reading this thread made me want to share.

QuellingandQvetching

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 2:51 pm

Please please please call the police. They have special officers who are trained to talk to children and figure out what is going on. If you allow this to go on or to go unpunished other children, including yours, will get abused further. ANd then he'll graduate to full on rape and other types of abuse. The bigger he gets the more power he'll have over his victims. If you don't report this you are the worst kind of mother and the worst kind of Jew. I get that stuff happened that you cannot undo, but are you going to sacrifice your child for the sake of playing nice with your in-laws? Are you willing to sacrifice other people's children for the sake of this one little abuser?
I am struggling to conceive a child and then I hear about women like you who are lucky enough to have beautiful and healthy children and you're willing to just hand them over to be abused. A real mother protects her child with every ounce of her being, she sacrifices her own wants to keep her child safe.

gp2.0

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 3:03 pm

I'm seeing a lot of overreaction here. Run to the police? Seriously? What the heck. Why should that be the first step? They're kids. Yes therapy is required for both the girl and boy. Someone needs to have a quiet, non dramatic talk with the boy and explain to him that he's not allowed to touch someone else's privates and no one is allowed to touch his. Some inquiry should be made into where he learned the behavior.

Playing in locked rooms usually means kids getting into some kind of mischief and should never be allowed.

Your DD will likely not be traumatized by the experience as long as it stops now - IME. Obviously all kids are different.

Far better to wait until after Shabbos and make rational decisions than to make hasty hysterical decisions now. For goodness sake.

CatLady

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 3:14 pm

Quote:

Can you please explain to me how this is also a red flag? If he's obsessed about it or plays with real ones, then that's a red flag, but he's a boy and it's normal for a boy.

I don't think bombs or guns are typical preoccupations for well-adjusted teenaged boys. As the mother of a son, bombs and guns (real/fake/virtual) were not a part of his life, especially as he entered his teens and put away his GI Joes and Ninja Turtle action figures. My son at 13 was into punk music, movies, shooting hoops with the guys, eating junk food, and so on. It would have never occurred to him to take one of his female cousins into a room, lock the door and act like the OP's BIL. That "boys will be boys" stuff doesn't work for me.

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 3:20 pm

gp2.0 wrote:

This just doesn't make sense. It is not normal for a 7 yo have her privates rubbed even one time. Here she said more than one time. Are you serious. Just imagine c"v happening to someone you know. Not mentioning your own dd. this is horrendous.

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 3:32 pm

OP here. I called SOVRI every few minutes today until they closed. No one ever answered. Eitzah is closed on Fridays, according to their recording. So I have no choice but to wait until after Shabbos now, which is fine with me. As long as it will be taken care of then. I don't live in the same town as my in laws, so there is no danger for dd as of now. He has no other girls around to abuse.

To the person who thinks I'm a troll, thanks. That's the first time someone suspected me of that. Acting calmly is a great way to deal with any situation, and I strive to do that always, but unfortunately, I don't always succeed. Luckily this time I think I'm doing the best job I can under the circumstances. Thank you to all the rational posters who are advising me to tread carefully. I appreciate it. All posters who are saying to run to the police mean well, I'm sure, but that is not best solution right now. It may become the only solution if we exhaust all others, and then we will do it, but there are better ways to accomplish what we need to accomplish. Once we are totally clear on our options, which will hopefully be by Monday, we will proceed. By then the SOVRI hotline should be working again.

Shana_H

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 3:33 pm

amother wrote:

gp2.0 wrote:

Agreed! This is not normal behavior and is definitely in need of further investigation!
My 5 y/o daughter prefers showers to baths, but either way I shampoo her hair, and wash her body off with a soapy "pooffie", I wash her back and front privates too (obviously), last night at "pooffie" time she stopped me when I got to her private parts and took the "pooffie" from me, "I'm a big girl now Mommy, I got this, thanx"
My point is, kids know, understand, feel, more than we give them credit for, I for one believe OP's DD,

QuellingandQvetching

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 3:38 pm

amother wrote:

The police SVU department is open right now. Just dial 911.

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 3:43 pm

QuellingandQvetching wrote:

I thank you for you kind words. Rolling Eyes

So call me what you want, it's not going to scare me into doing the wrong thing. I fully intend to report this, as I have been saying all along, the question is to who and how do I go about it. The police are not the right choice in every situation. This is a child who can be helped in other ways if his parents allow it or if they are forced to allow it, and that is what we will try to accomplish. I am not sacrificing any children, thank you. I am taking care of this problem in the way that I see best for all parties involved. I have no interest in playing nice with my in laws. I just want to get bil the help he needs in a way that it will actually get to him. Have a good Shabbos.

QuellingandQvetching

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 3:48 pm

amother wrote:

QuellingandQvetching wrote:

I thank you for you kind words. Rolling Eyes

I am sorry for your children. If you are not a troll then you are clearly a horrid mother. period. You would rather let your child get abused rather than ruin your shabbos dinner or your image iwth your in-laws. You will have no place in Gan Eden. Have a horrid shabbos, this weekend and forever more. May your children reject you as you have rejected them. May they take care of you in your old age as you have cared for them in their childhood.

MrsButterfly

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 4:07 pm

To all the people judging OP (as I did in the beginning), she is clearly thinking ahead and more logically than most of us would.

She can't make it into a big deal, because as she said, if G-d forbid this ends in a divorce, the father would have some sort of custody arrangement. Where do you think he'll be for some, if not most, of that time? I mean, sure, they can always get a restraining order but would you hold by a restraining order against your parents' house? She's looking out for DD's best interest in the long-run. DD doesn't sound horrified. I'm not saying it's not a big deal or she isn't traumatized, just that the urgency of therapy and taking action/telling people doesn't outweigh the risks involved in that. Obviously DD needs support and validation, but I'm not sure why that must include taking immediate action without thinking it through.

I also thought that OP didn't know what she was doing before I read her other posts. The situation isn't as straightforward as it sounds. And I have no idea who OP is, it's just that when you read things clearly they make more sense.