dd says her uncle pulled up her skirt and rubbed her- locked

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:09 am

amother wrote:

I'm just curious if those of you who advocate reporting the boy to the authorities (rather than trying to make sure he gets therapy), would do the same if it was your own son.

I know someone who reported, not to police, to social services. The psychologists said it's not uncomon at that age, and it dosn't mean the boy is a lifelong abuser or he experienced abuse himself. Some boys age 13 are immature, couple with ADHD or development problems and raging hormones.
Don't make the boy into a demon. He needs help now but it doesn't mean he's a pedophile. Obv you must keep your dc far away.

I agree with this. As much as it's horrible and you do not want this to happen ever again, this doesn't necessarily mean that he was abused or will continue abusing. Boys this age are curious and immature. They think they're playing or having fun. They don't realize necessarily that they're doing something wrong. I wonder if op's dd even realized that this was something wrong. She may have thought it's something fun and exciting, (This is not to say that it actually was. Simply, she may have perceived it differently than we are perceiving it.) and not necessarily is she damaged or must have therapy. As another amother said, therapy may just blow up this situation more than needed.
{I think it depends on if he used force with her.}

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:14 am

OP here. With dh's okay, I called my mentor. She said we definitely cannot let this go, but she can't advise us on such an important issue. She gave us a number of someone who can help us and said to call after Shabbos. We will do that IY"H. I told dh what she said and he sighed, but seems to have accepted the fact that we must take action. He had an idea that maybe he should speak to his sister who is good at telling her parents when they are wrong (which is almost always) and maybe she can get through to them and get him help.

To the poster who is worrying that dd confided in her friend and not in her parents, I was thinking about this. My understanding is that she did not see it as a horrible thing. She was laughing to her friend about it. The friend's mother heard them giggling together and asked why. So I think she just didn't feel a need to tell us. But I told all my kids now that if anyone ever touches them in a way that's not tzniusdig, they must tell the person to stop, scream for help, and tell us.

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:20 am

I didn't read all the comments but this is what I would do:

First speak to your brother in law. Because you don't trust your in-laws to really do the job well, research on what you should tell him to get the point across that what he did is wrong and criminal.

Then.

Get him to sit in while you talk to your in-laws, and admit to his parents that he did it.
Perhaps get a therapist there with you to explain the gravity of the situation to your in-laws and brother in law.

This is one way to make sure your brother in law may get the help he needs. I assume you care about him, and don't want him to become an adult molester/rapist. I assume you care about your children and niece and you don't want them to suffer their entire life by being raped or molested.

This is hard. Do the right thing.

Blue jay

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:22 am

Not the original op here:

This is my gut reaction to the situation on hand. OP, I really feel like you need to set the ground rules here and not lean on your dh on this issue. You are a woman and your dd is a girl and you know what the effects of her molestation can have on her in years to come as a mother and a wife and as a whole person. Look at some of these threads here on imamother, about woman who can never and will never heal from their horrific molestations as children. See your daughter 10 years from now...you want her to grow up mentally sound and healthy.

All this in consideration. the BIL is out of your daughters life. She is not to see him nor be in her presence ever again. If you need to get her counseling then go WITH your daughter. Do not send her into another closed room again to talk about her molestation, she is too young to take this on alone. You as a mother need to be with her side by side.

As far as your dh is concerned, this is his family and you have your family. If you are comfortable enough, the in laws alone can visit with out their son. .....and this is after you tell them about what is going on with your brother in law. Let them send him to therapy and tend to his needs. but he will know what he did for the rest of his life and HE will have to live with that. Too bad he is not to see your dd ever again . If he will be at a simcha, guess what? your daughter will not be there! Got it?

I would get mad, I would call off all contact with your inlaws if they show no sign or even any motivation towards helping their son. They will hear your message loud and clear. IF your dh has an issue with this. well step right up and lets have it out! ITs too bad for everyone except your dd and you, let everyone else have a cow!

greenfire

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:23 am

would you wait until after shabbos to call the cops if your wallet was stolen ???

DO NOT WAIT TILL AFTER SHABBOS TO PROTECT YOUR INNOCENT DAUGHTER !!!

call that hotline that was given above ... it seemed reliable and confidential NOW

and stop asking permission from your husband if you can protect your daughter - gosharuni !!!

Quote:

Contact Us
The SOVRI Helpline phone number is 888.613.1613. We are open Monday-Thursday 9:30am-5:30pm and Friday 9:30am-1:30pm.

If you have administrative comments or questions, then please contact Carole Sher, LCSW, the Program Coordinator of the Victim Services Program at Beth Israel Medical Center. She can be reached at 212.420.4516.

If you would like to volunteer, then please call either Cheryl Friedman, LMSW or Chaya Mermerstein, LCSW the clinical co-coordinators of SOVRI. Cheryl can be reached at 212.420.2883 and Chaya can be reached 212.420.4442.

Quote:

Frequently Asked Questions
Who are we?
We are an emotional support helpline for Orthodox Jewish survivors of s-xual abuse. We help, support, listen, and provide resources to any person who chooses to call us. We are anonymous, confidential, and don't have caller-ID. The helpline is open Monday-Thursday 9:30am-5:30pm and Friday 9:30am-1:30pm. The phone number is 888.613.1613. We are under the auspices of the Victims Services Program of Beth Israel Medical Center.

Who answers the phone?
The helpline is answered by trained volunteers. Our volunteers have gone through a 40+ hour training program focused on the dynamics of s-xual abuse in the secular and Orthodox communities, childhood s-xual abuse and incest, healthcare and legal protocol, post-traumatic stress disorder, s-xual harassment, domestic violence, suicide, and how to recommend appropriate resources. All of our volunteers are Orthodox women. All of our volunteers are supervised by licensed social workers who have extensive experience in dealing with these issues.

Who calls the helpline?
We receive calls from men, women, teenagers, and children who have survived any type of s-xual abuse, rape, molestation, s-xual harassment, emotional abuse, or domestic violence. We have received calls from every type of religious background and from many different communities.

What happens when I call?
You will be immediately connected with a trained volunteer who will listen to you, support you, and help you with what you need. She will also be able to give you information about other resources that can help you. All calls are strictly confidential and anonymous. We don't have caller-ID.

When can I call?
The helpline is open Monday-Thursday 9:30am-5:30pm and Friday 9:30am-1:30pm. If you call outside those hours, you have the option of leaving your first name and telephone number and a volunteer counselor will return your call as soon as possible. In your message please let us know when it is a safe time to call you back.

SplitPea

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:27 am

greenfire wrote:

Quote:

I am just copy and pasting this because I can't like it more than once.

LIKE!!!

Cookie Monster

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:28 am

SplitPea wrote:

greenfire wrote:

Quote:

I am just copy and pasting this because I can't like it more than once.

LIKE!!!

You beat me to it!

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:40 am

amother wrote:

I'm the amother right above op. It's as I thought. Not always do kids see things as we do. And AFTER THE FACT it is not always beneficial to blow it out of proportion.

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:41 am

ElTam wrote:

Quote:

So the action I have taken is that I have decided that dh needs to be on the same page as me before I do anything. Otherwise it will likely result in divorce, though we have had a happy marriage until now. If that would happen, he would want at least joint custody, which would be terrible. Dh cannot imagine reporting on his kid brother who he helped raise. He cannot fathom angering his parents to this degree. And so, I told him he must speak to the psychologist friend he has at work and otherwise I will speak to my mentor who we both trust and who I'm sure can advise us well. Once he speaks to the psychologist, I'm hoping he will see the seriousness of the situation. Then we can call the hotline that someone posted.

I find it so horrifying that in your plan for dealing with your daughter having been molested you are concerned with
1. yourself
2. your husband
3. your marriage (so, yourself again)
4. the molester
5. the molesters parent's

The victim doesn't even make the list. Well, it's no wonder she didn't come to you. But, you and your DH should know that each and every thing that happens from here on out to your daughter from your failure to protect her and your failure to help her, will be on your cheshbon in shamayim.

Hopefully your daughter will reach out for help to someone who will actually do something to protect her. I don't know how you are looking in the mirror right now, actually. This is a mother? This is what a mother does? Shame.

I am curious if a social work or lawyer on the board knows whether the "parents" of this 7 y.o. can be charged with neglect if they knowingly put her in a situation where she can be molested going forward?

I guess I didn't make myself clear here. I am very concerned about dd, and about bil (to protect other possible victims). That's why I need to make sure that he gets help, that his parents allow him to get help, and that dh doesn't end up with custody of the kids IN THEIR HOUSE because that would put dd in much greater danger. Now that I've spoken to my mentor, I spoke to dh for a long time and he said it is hard to be between the 2, but he knows we have to side with dd and protect her. Now that we're both on the same page, we are ready for more action, which will begin with speaking to the person I was told to call after Shabbos. And I told dh that our mentor is sure dd is not making it up, so he has accepted that.

proud mama

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:41 am

I did not read any updates since last night but till then this is my input:

1) Do not make any hasty decisions. I commend you for coming out and seeking to get advice and ensure you avoid making hasty decisions since this situation is huge and could affect many lives.

2) Please don't attack her. And I was deeply bothered by the poster that was insisting on reporting this thread. The only positive thing that I can see can come out of this is that other people should feel uncomfortable posting and so people might not end up getting the guidance/help they need. So I ask you to refrain from judging/threatening/jumping to conclusions. And keep this forum open to people that need help yet still want to remain anonymous. (With this I'm not talking about whether or not to report the action but am talking about this thread only.)

3) As I said this situation is huge and it is important that BOTH your BIL and DD get the help you need. There is an organization called EITZAH they advertise that Experienced and dedic ated Mechanchim and Mechanchos are available to offer compassionate advice, encouragement and guidance on all chinuch questions and topics AND REFER FURTHER WHEN NECESSARY _ STRICTLY CONFIDENTIAL! 718-851-5111. I feel that you should call a professional and not handle this yourself since it's a VERY DELICATE issue that can ruin a life if not handled properly. Professionals might guide you in how to ensure that your BIL Does get the help he needs. (He's still young and has a full life ahead of him.)

4) I can't stress this enough: kids should NEVER PLAY ALONE BEHIND A CLOSED DOOR! I often tell my kids that no one is allowed to touch them even a brother, uncle etc. If they do they should tell me. And I always tell them that they should not be alone with anyone.

Wishing you loads of HATZLUCHA!

amother

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 10:56 am

The OP also mentioned that her BIL is into playing with guns and bombs. This is another red flag.

Please make sure that this situation is taken care of by the authorities. Both kids need help ASAP. Let the authorities take over, that way it's out of your control.

Anon because I had a relative who used to have "inappropriate play" with a female child in the family and although she was eventually okay thanks to lots of therapy, the abuser went on to spending his adult life on welfare with psychiatric disability and not working. This person had one abusive parent and one enabling parent, which created this situation. Had he been treated for his illness as a teenager, maybe he would have made something out of his life.

lavendar

Fri, Dec 06 2013, 11:01 am

It is beyond me how ppl can even debate for so long what to do if this was me I would have taken action long ago ! Who the heck cares about ur in laws if they could not care about there own granddaughter ! The truth the dont care about the little baby either bec he prob needs more help then ur dd ! Doesn't mean he's a criminal for life he's young and immature and with proper help hes fine with out help or consequence he will be on the news one day in he Peyos and all for molestation ! Ppl don't just one day become the evolve ! That goes for the successful and for criminals ! As for ur daughter she is a hero ! And u let her know that children have to know that thes things are not ok not just not tzniut but dangerous u most celebrate her coming fwd and she most feel action . You said that she was laughing with her friend that cud be on the surface the only way she could get it out ! Let ur DH wakes up and realize that his family is dysfunctional and he has a choice to stop the chain here and get his act together and defend his family or he could make his own dysfunctional too ! He has to make sure bil gets help other wise this world has screwed another child ur bil needs to understand that his actions were horrible and so does ur in laws and if that doesn't get threw the u should call the police on ur in laws bec doesn't sound like they are worthy of being parents! I'm sorry that ur going threw this but u need to be stronger get ur sil involved if it will help but don't be scared be smart but not scared