A Chilling And Awe-Inspiring Malaysia Air Flight 370 Story

Raisin

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 9:28 am

Barbara wrote:

Not only do I doubt it (travel agents tell people to make their own reservations? -- uhh, doubt that), I truly HATE those types of stories. 239 people are missing, presumed dead. They have parents and spouses and kids who love them. I don't know why they died. But I'm not going to gloat about one person who allegedly avoided the flight, when so many others are gone.

really, you wouldn't be happy if your friend/relative/aquaintance missed being on a flight or in a car that crashed? You don't feel a little happy that 9/11 was the day of local elections so less new yorkers died then would have on another day?

I'm sure there are dozens of people who should have or could have been on this flight but weren't for various reasons. bh for them.

Its like saying I won't say mazel tov to my friend who had a baby since I have other friends who are still waiting for children.

Yes, sad and horrible things happen in this world...doesn't mean we shouldnt celebrate the good things.

Chayalle

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 9:33 am

There was a similar story about a non-observant Jewish couple that planned to get married on Tisha B'Av and then honeymoon in Thailand, was it? The details are fuzzy.....an Orthodox Rabbi persuaded them to reschedule their wedding, despite the fact that they lost out on alread-booked honeymoon reservations...and then, the hotel they were supposed to have stayed at was washed away by tsunami....

Don't remember where I heard the story, nor have I verified the details.

Barbara

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 9:49 am

Chayalle wrote:

Every disaster brings those stories. The guy who stopped to daven, so he wasn't in the WTC on 9/11. Me, I think of Avremel Zelmanowitz, who was in the building, could have left, but stayed with a paraplegic friend.

causemommysaid

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 10:17 am

Barbara wrote:

yes these stories really bother me.

like the one about the israeli soldier who went back to his bunker to tie his shoes according to halacha and his whole team got killed by a grenade except him.

ummm he wasn't saved because he followed halacha. he was saved cause Gd wanted to save him. Gd used his shoes as a vehicle to save him- not the other way around. The other guys would have died regardless of how they tied their shoes cause thats what Gd wanted.

Zehava

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 10:49 am

My husband is a travel agent and this is a dilemma he often has. He works with non-observant partners so he usually tells them he doesn't want to know who's flying on Shabbos. If does know, which has happened, he is not allowed to book that flight. This story has been very inspiring to him and gave him a boost to continue doing the right thing.

self-actualization

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 10:55 am

My favorite stories in the whole world are about Nathan Straus and the Titanic and Rose and the Triangle Shirtwaist Factory. I have every reason to believe that the DansDeals story is true, and I plan to print it out and share it at the Shabbos table this week. When I retell the Titanic and Triangle Shirtwaist Factory stories, I have usually prefaced them by saying - I don't know all the details, so I am ad-libbing some of them. My audiences (my children or campers in shiur) usually are okay with this Smile

amother

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 11:12 am

Barbara wrote:

WOW!!!

Last nite , when I read "not a fanatic" 's comment on Dans site, I thought to myself Barbara, come out, come out wherever you are

mille

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 12:15 pm

Barbara wrote:

I'm of the same mind. It's nice to have these cute stories (go to shul and you'll hear them every week, and I highly doubt the majority are true despite the rabbi always saying 'someone in the congregation told me...' or 'this happened to a buddy of mine from yeshiva...'). If they help you feel the wonder of Hashem, lovely. I just personally don't like these types of stories that basically trivialize the 239 people who DID go through such a tragedy. Apparently these 239 people did not do anything so good as to make Hashem save THEM like this dude who supposedly decided not to fly on Shabbat. Who is to say that none of the 239 on board the flight weren't Jewish? If any were Jewish, what does that say about them? Are they all evil sinners for flying on Shabbos, and that's why this happened? It's dangerous to extrapolate cause/effect from situations like this, imo. You are doing a disservice to those who did not have such a happy outcome by doing so.

monseychick

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 12:29 pm

mille wrote:

You make a very valid point... However, maybe we shouldnt overthink everything.. The 239 other ppl, the 6 million, the victims of the crusades, inquisitions were kiled because Hashem willed it... We will never understand why until we get to Olam Emes..

Shabbos helped this one yid, and my thoughts and prayers are with the families of everyone else works for ME, more than random bad stuff just happens all the time, because life sucks....

tigerwife

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 12:32 pm

Rejoicing over one survivor should not in any way negate from the tragedy of the other 239 people.

The circumstances of this man's escape from (death? or maybe these people will still be found?) is definitely food for thought. You can take a positive or negative take on it, depending on your personality.

I don't think anyone is concluding that the rest of these poor victims are gone because they flew on Shabbos. We are not G-d; so let's not try to figure out His plan.

rosehill

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 12:56 pm

After 9/11, for every story I heard of someone who was booked on one of the doomed flights but missed it because they missed their connection/went to slichos/meeting got cancelled etc, there was an equal and opposite story of someone who missed their connection/went to slichos/meeting got cancelled, and wound up on a hijacked plane they were not supposed to be on.

Ours is not to reason why.

lubaussie

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 1:48 pm

DrMom wrote:

grace413, I thought of those issues as well.

I was also pleasantly surprised by how this customer was persuaded to change his plans. "Gee, I really should be more observant." The travel agent's advise may not have been so well-received by other Jews.

I know my parents, for example, would be annoyed if their travel agent told them not to fly on Shabbat, no matter how gentle his rebuke. "Who is this guy to tell me when to fly? His job is to book tickets, not advise me on spiritual matters! I'm using someone else next time! These Orthodox people are insane!" Sad

Yes, but he didn't tell him not to fly on Shabbos, he said he can't book it. (Whether that's the actual Halacha/guidance from his Rov, I have no idea). Also, he made it seem as if it was HIS - the travel agent's - problem - "gee, you know I don't like flying Jews on Shabbat." I thought that was worded very neutral, subtle and non-pushy. (Isn't that how they tell you to bring up problems in relationships - word it as if it's YOUR issue not the other's?)

causemommysaid wrote:

I agree, I don't think that his life was hanging by a thread and dependent solely on whether he kept Shabbos or not. his time just wasn't up yet. *however*, maybe Hashem orchestrated this whole event to show us the importance of Shabbos? Not sure if that makes sense - just a thought.

Ruchel

Tue, Mar 11 2014, 1:55 pm

Let's not forget these are all tzelem elokim, real people with real families and real lives...

Yes, we're happy for every person saved. Yes, we're even happier when shabbes saves someone (shabbes guarding the Jews even more than the Jews guarding shabbes, sorry, bad translation). But there are also people who were NOT saved by their observance, or even chas veshalom condemned by it (like the man in the WTC who died because he stayed with a coworker = mitzva).

Life is not so simple, or there would be no merit to observance and we would be malachin, not humans. The simple fact we have bechira makes us stand higher than the angels. Now, throughout history, many have wondered if it is worth it... such a high price. But Hashem has a plan, bh.