Can I just skip the "required" gifts this year?

amother

Magenta

Sat, Dec 05 2015, 10:05 pm

There are so many required gifts, even if I would spend $5 per gift, it just adds up! Teachers, therapists, bus drivers, for multiple children, it never ends! We are going through a tough time due to unexpected medical bills. Who made this an obligation anyway? Can I just skip it all this year? O course I appreciate these people, but I simply can't afford to give anything!

groisamomma

Sat, Dec 05 2015, 10:31 pm

Don't feel bad, OP. We are skipping Chanukah gifts for all but my son's rebbe and bus driver this year. My girls will write thank you cards to all their teachers. I am sure you won't be the only parent skipping gifts but try to write a nice card to show your appreciation.

amother

Floralwhite

Sat, Dec 05 2015, 10:32 pm

doctorima wrote:

If you can't afford it, then you can't afford it. So maybe just write a nice card telling them how much you appreciate all of their hard work and assistance.

I'm not the OP, but sometimes it's not the money that's the issue, but that I'm naturally overwhelmed and not so organized, and I get a headache thinking of all the notes I have to write, and even with the best intentions, I many times ended up not doing anything for therapists or those who weren't part of a collection. I hope no one is offended. But then again, a gift (or note) by definition is not an obligation - I would hope one is in the job because it works for them personally, and not 100% for altruistic reasons to benefit my child, and in need of the gift. Do you send gifts to your grocery store without which your family would go hungry?

seeker

Sat, Dec 05 2015, 11:38 pm

If you really can't, then send a card. Personally when possible I prefer to skip other things and be able to do the gifts. Both my kids schools take up a group collection so it's more limited, and I might not be able to deal with it if I had 7 kids and not 2, but o do feel it's an important gesture. You know very well a teacher is nothing at all like a grocery store. And frankly if my grocer went above and beyond the way teachers tend to do, I'd probably appreciate that as well. I always give part of my maser to the local grocery towards unpaid accounts, maybe that counts as a gift to the grocer because he might never see any money on those accounts otherwise, or at least now has a little less headache to run after it (though alas the size of my contribution won't fix all his headaches...)

Amelia Bedelia

Sun, Dec 06 2015, 1:26 am

seeker wrote:

I always give part of my maser to the local grocery towards unpaid accounts, maybe that counts as a gift to the grocer because he might never see any money on those accounts otherwise, or at least now has a little less headache to run after it (though alas the size of my contribution won't fix all his headaches...)

How thoughtful! Such a nice gesture!

seeker

Sun, Dec 06 2015, 1:42 am

Never thought of it as a nice gesture per se, halacha is that one of the top priorities in giving tzedakah is the poor people in your own town, and specifically another priority in tzedakah is providing food to those who don't have. So this is one way to do it, there is one main kosher grocery in our neighborhood and I ask the owner to put this money towards any family that he knows has a hard time paying.

amother

cornflower

Sun, Dec 06 2015, 6:40 am

groisamomma wrote:

because your daughters teachers don't deserve hakoros hatov, or need the income? I guess you think they just use their salaries to buy handbags, right? ... If you can't afford it, why do your daughters teachers deserve a gift less then your sons bus driver?!??

So many frum people are still stuck in the 50s.

This upsets me so much.

To the OP - please don't feel pushed to give gifts if you can't afford it.

ahuva06

Sun, Dec 06 2015, 7:12 am

amother wrote:

She said she is skipping for teachers AND bus driver. She obviously can't afford it. What is so upsetting to you about that?
As a teacher I always appreciated the note way more than the gift. I would have no problem if a family skipped the gift and sent a note.
I do think it is important to show hakaras hatov - so if you can't afford sending a gift or money then at least try to send in a thank you card... It's also great chinuch for your children Smile

Amarante

Sun, Dec 06 2015, 7:48 am

becca wrote:

Actually she is gifting the son's teacher and bus driver.

What people are finding objectionable is what seems to be her opinion that women are less worthy of gifts and by extension, her female children don't merit the same kind of "bribe" as her son. I am not sure what word to use but clearly there appears to be some reason why someone feels a need to gift the male teacher and bus driver.

amother

Yellow

Sun, Dec 06 2015, 7:58 am

becca wrote:

She is skipping the girls' teachers and bus drivers. She is seding for her son's rebbe and bus driver.

This is plain wrong. The girls' teachers are above the son's bus driver. Bus drivers don't spend hours of their own time preparing lessons, making papers and calling parents.

amother

Yellow

Sun, Dec 06 2015, 8:12 am

Boysrock! wrote:

Just to be dan - maybe her daughter's teachers are still single girls as opposed to the rebbe and bus driver who need to support a family. If she can only afford to gift one, I think gifting the breadwinner makes sense...

Of course. Nothing should be by merit.

Let's let the single girls know they have no value for the work they provide because they are not supporting a family and their work is only to educate girls.

BTW why would you assume the bus driver for girls is less likely to be married then the bus driver for boys?

Simple1

Sun, Dec 06 2015, 8:14 am

I give when collected.

But I do wonder about the Hakaros Hatov requirement and why it only applies in some cases. For example, I always assumed high school teachers you don't give because there are so many. But they still at the end of the day work very hard. And there are some who I've seen go above and beyond and I am very appreciative to. But I'm not going to just give a handful out of like 20 teachers. On the other hand I've had the occasional elementary school teachers or rebbes (who get the gift) who were sub par and badly mistreated my kids.

I think at the end of the day, teacher should have a good enough self esteem to not rely totally on the gift for her fulfillment. And on the occasion that she does go above and beyond she should rewarded by Hashem.

Seeker, I once actually heard in a shiur that we should feel Hakaros Hatov even to to the grocer. You have no idea what craziness goes on behind the scenes to get food to your table. Think stressful Yom Tov times where seasonal items go to waste afterwords. etc.

SRS

Sun, Dec 06 2015, 8:26 am

If you don't have the money, don't give the gifts.
And on another note, I think schools should do a group collection and card, placing names of all on because no one should be singled out and humiliated because they do not have the funds. In the past, parents paid a Rebbe or tutor directly. In today's world, we pay tuition and the school is responsible for paying teachers. The 1st responsibility should be tuition and any gifts, where given, should not come before tuition and for those on scholarships, I would say a donations to the school if there is something discretionary, should come first.

Amarante

Sun, Dec 06 2015, 8:29 am

Boysrock! wrote:

This has always been the argument used to deny women equal pay and equal rights by trivializing their need to work.

They are single and using their money for trivial stuff or they are married and have a husband to provide.

No one should be paid a salary based on perceived need especially when the need is based on arbitrary gender. Do we know whether the males are single? Maybe they have wives who work at high paying jobs. Maybe they come from wealthy families. Maybe the women support their family because parents are dead or the husband is disabled.

I don't support paying people based on need especially when need is arbitrarily linked to gender. I'm just pointing out that one is making assumptions that are without merit and penalizing women just because they are women and therefore not as worthy or important as men.

The poster did this doubly in terms of how she views the female teachers and her own female children.

If someone wants to work for free, that is called volunteering.

Boysrock!

Sun, Dec 06 2015, 8:46 am

I didn't mean to offend the female teachers as less worthy! I myself tip every teacher and rebbe. I think every teacher, rebbe is worthy of recognition for the amazing job they do. But yes, I give my boys rebbe way more than I give their English teacher. My boys rebbe spend about 7 hours teaching them each day while their English teacher is there for 2 hours with them. If there is a problem with friends, bullying, or whatnot, it's the rebbe my kids are most likely to approach. But with my daughters teachers - they have evenly divided kodesh and chol hours and are amazing teachers but I do tip them less than my sons rebbe - they each teach about 3 hours and most of them even have a part time job as well. Again, it's not about them deserving less, but the rebbes deserving more. Obviously, it goes without saying that there are some incompetent rebbes who don't deserve anything - but I wouldn't keep my kid in a class with such a rebbe! Same with school, if I ever had a teacher go out of her way to support/devote herself to my daughter you bet I show my appropriate appreciation.

And even further, and I very well might get disowned my imamother for saying this - My husband tip my sons rebbe almost every month. We don't do that with the teachers at all. None of my daughters teachers ever came close to the hours and devotion a full time rebbe gives. And I write appreciation notes to my daughters teacher periodically as well.