100K for a shidduch in Israel?????

chocolatecake

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 12:21 am

I just heard that in the charaidei world the girls parents need to promise 100k or the girl won't find a shidduch. Israelis, is that really true? Does that include the wedding or is it 100k going straight to the couple? Do the boys parents need to promise anything also? Where on earth do people come up with that cash especially when most are men are learning and they have large families. Am I missing something here......

shabbatiscoming

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 4:18 am

grace413 wrote:

Nobody understands how this works.

And 100K won't even get you close to the price of an apartment.

I heard that currently it's 2/3rds by the girl and 1/3 by the boy.

Thats what I was wondering.
I mean even apartments are going for 1 million shekels or somewhere in that general range.

These families either have to be loaded (which most are not) or struggle to do this or buck the system.

amother

Seafoam

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 5:07 am

I would guess more and more of them are collecting tzedaka for it. We had at least one carload of them, usually more, every Sunday in the States. Why they can't go to work, or rent like everyone else their age, or go set up a new yishuv somewhere in the middle of the Negev? Prices in Eilat are waaaaay cheaper than the rest of the country. I'd move down there in a heartbeat if we could take our jobs along.

amother

Vermilion

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 5:39 am

I'm no expert. But I've heard that the parents contribute to the down payment. That's around 30% of 1 million SHEKEL not dollar unless they are buying something very nice or in a nice area. The couple pays the mortgage.

The system in America for supporting SIL in learning is not really that different (meaning $1,500+ a month for 5 yrs). This is just being put into a tangible possession instead of regular handouts.

Many couples are looking OOT in places that are more affordable. I don't think too many Kollel couples are moving to Eilat, but definitely other yishuvim and cities w/ a Chareidi community that are much cheaper than Y"m or Bnei Brak. Only, all these places are quickly getting expensive too b/c there is a demand.

Some parents don't buy apartments, but are expected to contribute to help the couple with rent.

byisrael

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 6:07 am

There are many different circles within the chareidi world- with differences in expectations.
This is what some off my friends parent and in laws did for them. All not wealthy, good chareidi girl/boy from good yeshivas but not "tops" (where they ask for tons of money). all where for affordable apartments out of town in the 600k NIS range-with 30% down payment. The one friend who married a boy from a "top" yeshiva parents had to buy the entire apartment(also for 600k NIs) for the couple Some live in them, some rent it out and use whaterver money they have post mortgage for rent;

1/3 girls parents 1/3 boys parents 1/3 mortgage for the couple
1/2 girls parents 1/2 boys parents for down payment-mortgage couple
50k $ girls parents 25$ boys parents-rest is a mortgage

My parents gave us 25$ as did my in-laws for a down payment. My father did have to ask our family and friends to assist him in raising the money for that and our very very simple wedding split down the middle, a sheital, and basic housewares.

Just so Americans understand the system better; the salaries in Israel are very low. I work in a secular office- all my coworkers either have there married kids move in with them so that they can save up or give them the down payment. It take 36 full average (non minimum wage) salaries to save up for a down payment. Because there is a housing shortage, there are never enough properties for rent - so the rents are extremely high.

shabbatiscoming

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 6:14 am

byisrael wrote:

Your parents gave you 25k in dollars? Thats a lot towards an apartment in shekels. Thats close to 100K in shekels.
When you wrote that it take 36 full salaries, what did you mean? Months? people?

OK, and now to bebunk some things you said so that not everyone thinks that all israelis are living in poverty.
NO, not all salaries in israel are very low. Some people make a pretty ok living.
And no, there is not a housing shortage all over israel. Not at all. And rent is not high all over. It just depends where one wants to live.
And the more anglos live in an area the higher the rent goes.

luppamom

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 6:27 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

Thank you.
I think people who think that young charedi couples are buying apartments for that amount of money are not thinking real life here.

I think my area has apartments for that amount, but not completely sure b/c I'm renting. They're small apartments. 2.5-3 rooms. Not big enough for a large family, but big enough for a couple and a few children. The prices are already going up, so I don't expect it to stay like this.

Last edited by luppamom on Wed, Dec 23 2015, 6:42 am; edited 1 time in total

shabbatiscoming

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 6:34 am

luppamom wrote:

I think my area has apartments for that amount. They're small apartments. 2.5-3 rooms. Not big enough for a large family, but big enough for a couple and a few children. The prices are already going up, so I don't expect it to stay like this.

I have no idea where you live, but are there kollelim, for these kollel couples? And as you said, such apartments are not good for growing families, so what would be the point?

Tablepoetry

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 6:39 am

amother wrote:

Actually, 600,000 can definitely buy an apartment- so long as you're willing to go far enough north or south. You can even get something small in Beer Sheva or Haifa:

http://www.yad2.co.il/Nadlan/s.....Info=

If you look at the places listed there, and limit the price to 600k, you will find mainly places in cities like beer sheva, yerucham, eilat. Not many charedi kollel couples go there (are there even kollels there?)
Also the flats sold at that range are 2.5 to 3 rooms, which means 2 bedrooms or less, too small for a charedi family long term.

luppamom

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 6:45 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

I have no idea where you live, but are there kollelim, for these kollel couples? And as you said, such apartments are not good for growing families, so what would be the point?

Yes. I'm not sure what they do b/c I've only seen young couples in these apartments. I'm guessing that they sell and buy bigger apartments once they don't fit. Overall, the prices are going up, so they would likely make more than they paid. But their bigger apartment would also cost more, so I'm not sure how they pay that difference. I do think they try to stay in the small apartment for as long as possible. I think the family that owned my apartment before my landlord had 10 children k"h. It's a 3 bedroom apartment, but not that large. I can't imagine 12 people living here. Guess that's why they moved. (They left the city.)

amother

Seafoam

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 6:47 am

Tablepoetry wrote:

Like I said, you have to be willing to go far enough north or south (and not to one of the big cities). Why can't someone enterprising start a new kollel in Arad? Or a new yishuv in the Negev?

byisrael

Wed, Dec 23 2015, 8:30 am

Again I am stating what is going on in my circles.
The couple BUY( don't necessarily live-BUY) in places like haifa, carmiel, afula, acco, krayot, sfat, beer sheva, ofakim, tifrach.... There are Kollels that pay more then the standard kollels in j'lem /mercaz area because they are trying to bring people out.
I rent my 3 bedroom 90 meter apartment in one of these place out for 2,500 a month. I grew up happily with 5 sibling in the same sized apartment.

I beg to differ with you on stating that there is not a housing shortage all over. According to a Mizrahi Tfahot conference I just attended that is the reason that the housing and rental prices have jumped so high over the past 4 years. And that is why Kahalon is in office.

Explain to me how anyone on a single israeli salary and kids can come up with the 30% on a property in any of the areas a listed. I am not referring to j'lem,beitar, rbs...I am referring to out of town.

Yes our parents gave us the money for a down payment. Together with all the costs of buying(lawyer,real estate agent, mortgage broker,tax) it was 25$ for each side. Yes you will have a hard time getting a shidduch in the chariedi world offering less than that. The open minded people are the ones who are willing to buy out of town and do half half. I RBS you can find families who are looking for support as apposed to buying. I don't think that is much less and the boys side usually give nothing.

Yes SOME people make an ok living.
According to Bituach Leumi the average salary is 9,123.
Pretty good right?
Except that the average is positively skewed by the highest earners and according to leading economists we can assume the average is between 4,500-6,500 NIS a month.
5,000 x 36 = 180,000 which is 30% of a 600k apartment and that is assuming that prices stay where they are-and they never have.