Do we owe our teens a "fun summer"?

amother

Ginger

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 7:18 am

Apart from two pieces of advise mentioned above (recognize her feelings and not giving her responsibilities to care for her siblings) I would do this:

1. Spend quality 'ladies' time together with her once a week. What kind of things would you like to do together? Focus on the fact that she is already 15 and is now able to do things with mom that she couldn't do before.

2. Let her make a list of (at least) 30 things she would like to do this summer. True, she cannot go to the camp she wanted and she might have wanted a longer family vacation, but try to get her out of that mindset by making her think of things she CAN do. Is there a certain course she would like to do where she learns a new skill? Sleepovers with friends that also didn't go to camp? Make sushi? Write a book? Whatever. Make her think in a positive way and look for opportunities.

Good luck!

amother

Ivory

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 7:20 am

I don't think you owe her camp but you do owe her respect and sympathy and a loving kind home. You should try to make her summer fun if you can. Even do some stuff in the evenings. It is very hard for a teenager to be away from all her friends having fun and when everyone comes back this is all they talk about for months and you even worry that you may lose your best friends because they might become closer to someone else in camp. it's really hard for a teenager. Sympathize and care for her.

amother

Orchid

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 7:35 am

amother wrote:

Here's a different take:
fun summers are not always a good thing. I grew up not religious in a well to do family (not very rich but we were always able to afford things). Every summer we would travel somewhere overseas for at least 1 month, staying in fancy hotels, in the pool all day, going to sites. And then the rest of the summer (month of August) I would just veg out watching TV, hanging out with friends in the mall, shopping, going out to eat, sleeping late, waking up late. But honestly, it was so boring and empty. I really hated it - even back then. I didn't want to work, as I did not need the money and did not want to wake up early.
I wish that my parents encouraged me to find a job (ie: make me work for the money I was easily spending) or do something productive with my 2.5 months (like volunteering in an old age home...)
I only started working when I was 20 years old, and it was really, really challenging to teach myself a work ethic and learn to be on time, hard working, etc.
My husband on the other hand grew up with parents who taught him that if he wants something fun or expensive - he needs to work for it. His first summer job was a paper route boy when he was 12, and since then, he worked basically ever summer and would have savings for the summer and throughout the year. I see this work ethic in him now, 20 years later, and am somewhat envious of it, as my "laid back" childhood/teenage years still plague my work ethic and I really need to push myself to get things done.

So overall:
I think working is healthy for teenagers and teaching them that we don't owe them everything instills in them good habits and determination that can last a lifetime.

I agree. I was brought up with no money like your DH only I started working earlier than him. I learned to hustle at an early age for what I needed and wanted. This taught me to be a smart hard worker.

amother

Mistyrose

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:07 am

We don’t owe our kids things we can’t afford. I had no less than 3 members of my child's school tell me that I need to send my child to camp this year. Doesn’t matter that said child has 8 younger siblings, and that I can’t pay full tuition for all of them. How to explain that I really owe my extra money to the school, and not to my kid for expensive activities? Why do I have to explain this? I try and give my kids a good time, to the best of my ability, but I can’t go into debt for camp.

Chayalle

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:08 am

I just want to say that there definitely are camps that are cheaper, or have scholarships. They still come out quite pricey, but if your daughter can do lots of babysitting and summer jobs, and maybe you can contribute something, it definitely is possible to come up with a plan for savings for next year. Maybe working toward a goal might help her with some of her resentment.

Simple1

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:28 am

crust wrote:

Camp is not a luxury anymore because the definition of luxury, especially to a teenager, is a privilege that only a small percent of society has.
Let's not discuss why camp became a necessity but it is.

OP, you dont owe your kids a fun summer but you do owe them to not make a child do something very different than her peers. It is never a smart move in chinuch.

Can she go for the second half of camp?

While OP and everyone is logically right, I think your version is a more relistic version of the reality today.

Camp is more of an experience than an actual luxury. Sleeping squished in old bunkhouses is far from luxurious. It can be very hurtful to be left out of these experiences that everyone else is doing for the summer.

Besides not everyone is mature enough to work at 14.

(Now expecting the hugs Rolling Eyes

)

SuperWify

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:40 am

I’m sorry to be late the lone voice of dissent but teens DO need a fun summer after months of working in schools eight hours a day.

I don’t understand why you can’t make camp work. Personally as a child my parents sent us for two years and we paid a nice amount in addition to a scholarship from the camp. We worked one half made some money (about $1,000) and went to camp the next half with the money we made plus my parents covering the rest and the camps scholarship.

watergirl

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:42 am

amother wrote:

Its almost laughable. From one side of their mouth they say send to camp. From the other side of their mouth, they look at your tuition assistance form and say “oh, you spent $1000 on overnight camp (nevermind the amazing scholarship you got and grandparents who paid for the rest)? You should have given that extra $1000 to tuition. Camp is a luxury”.

amother

Sapphire

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:49 am

amother wrote:

I was the amother above who said that I just borrowed money for ds's camp.

Boys are more handicapped than girls in their opportunities to earn money, so no matter how much I personally think he should have contributed, this is the society I live in, so I just gotta go along... I don't pay full tuition, not by a long shot (we were paying 8 tuitions last year), and we don't even have any savings... but my son's life is important to me. And I think camp is just as important as school, just in a different way.

As for girls - girls DO have opportunities to earn money - way more than boys in our society. And... I don't think camp is a luxury anymore, at least not if you have 25 girls in a class, and 24 girls are going to camp... it's just not fair to your daughter to be the only one (unless she really doesn't want to go, some kids don't like camp).

amother

Scarlet

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:52 am

I think there are instances where camp is a necessity. I have happily given tzedaka to send kids to camp who really needed it (challenging home life or other challenges where the opportunity to go to camp really makes a difference in their lives). But needing to fit in with peers does not fall under that category. Sometimes you just can't have what everyone else has. If you don't learn that as a kid, when do you? If it's that important, kids can get creative. Get some jobs and save up some money to go. I know plenty who have done that. My parents were fortunate enough to afford to pay for camp. One year, I really wanted to go to this fancy travel camp. They paid the cost of what they would have paid for regular camp, and I babysat and tutored for the rest of the money (btw, my parents could afford the full cost of the travel camp, but I'm glad they asked me to contribute to the cost. Just because you can afford something, doesn't mean you should just give it to your kids).

bestme

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 8:53 am

I know someone that did not want her daughter to go to overnight camp. Once a week her daughter went to a plaster place to paint and once a week to the pizza shop with a friend or neighbors. Maybe you could think of some fun activities that she could do in the evening. Maybe you could take her one day shopping in a craft store and let her choose supplies to make crafts in the evenings.

Mommyg8

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 9:19 am

watergirl wrote:

Are you talking about the tuition committee? They say send to camp, but then they say it's a luxury? I'm just trying to clarify what you mean.

I think that in most large Jewish communities, if 99% of the girls are going to camp, then it becomes a necessity. For better or for worse.(Not that I agree with it, but that's just how it became).

What bothers me even more is that camps are getting more and more over the top. They are charging more and more money for a better "experience". And the kids (and the parents) feel pressured to go along. What's wrong with just playing ball and having fun? Rolling Eyes

Chayalle

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 9:20 am

watergirl wrote:

The dean of DD's high school - Rabbi Mayer of BK - was quoted in the local paper as saying that camp is no longer a luxury, but often is a necessity.

As others have posted, I've sent my girls to camp for 1/2 summer as teens. The camp worked with me and gave me a break, as much as they could; I paid what I could; and my teens contributed by working the other 1/2 summer.

BK's tuition committee has not given me trouble because of this.

Chayalle

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 9:24 am

amother wrote:

I think it's really insensitive of you to decide that needing to fit in with peers does not qualify a teen as "needing camp", when you then go on to discuss how your parents were able to afford to pay for camp for you, and you were even able to make a travel camp happen.

Or as it says in Pirkei Avos - Al Tadin es Chavercha ad Shetagia LimKomoh.

I agree with not giving kids everything just because you can afford it.

Bnei Berak 10

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 9:28 am

Simple1 wrote:

)

Regarding the bold: I think work will very much mature a 14 year old child. Very healthy IMO in our days where there is a tendency to infantilize up to far too old ages.

Chayalle

Thu, Jun 28 2018, 9:33 am

Mommyg8 wrote:

What bothers me even more is that camps are getting more and more over the top. They are charging more and more money for a better "experience". And the kids (and the parents) feel pressured to go along. What's wrong with just playing ball and having fun? Rolling Eyes

Well the parents are playing right into it. Supply usually exists where there is a demand.

One of my teens brought up to me the number of girls in her class going to a travel camp....to be fair, one or two of them had never gone to camp, so, as I pointed out to DD, she was getting all her summers of camp rolled into one. But for many of them, it is simply parents (or grandparents) who can afford it and are giving their kids "the experience".

Fortunately, I don't live in an area where it's a very high percentage of peers going to travel camps, so I didn't feel pressured in the slightest (and my DD didn't realistically expect anything more.)