Staring in Williamsburg

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Forum -> Relationships -> Manners & Etiquette

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amother

Lilac

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 1:28 pm

I mean this respectfully- I’ve been going into Williamsburg and see a lot of young girls and women staring, Actually gawking, at me and I’m wondering where it comes from. Are they just curious because it’s a more insular community? Or are they taught negative things about other people/sects? Really hoping to keep this respectful. I love the community and am curious where it comes from.

amother

Powderblue

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 1:45 pm

Perhaps what you're wearing is not within community norms.

Is your sheitle very long or skirt very short?

Heels of extreme height?

Loud colors?

Do you turn eyes wherever you go, due to just some natural beauty about yourself?

hodeez

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 1:52 pm

Are you wearing a tichels? Are you dark skinned? Do you in anyway stand out from the Williamsburg crowd ? If so that's probably why they're gawking. Or maybe you're self conscious about something and that translates into you thinking they're sizing you up?

amother

Lilac

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 2:04 pm

I don’t wear a double head covering but my Sheitel is a little longer than shoulder length and I bH try to dress very tsniusly- I don’t struggle in that area BH and an pretty makpid. But just a different style than them. My mom however isn’t tsnius because she isn’t observant and I think it’s her that gets stared at. A girl was staring so much that she bumped into a table!! In such an obvious manner like it’s so socially awkward - they see that we are watching hem stare and they just don’t care and co to us gawking. I just don’t get it.
I will say I am jealous of their community and think tots amazing there Smile

I’m just curious and don’t mean to generalize because most people are so kind and warm.

shiaeisen

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 2:07 pm

amother wrote:

I find the same in boro park. If you don’t look or dress exactly as they do, they stare.

shiaeisen

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 2:08 pm

amother wrote:

I experience same, and dress completely tzanua but am not chasidish so if you look different than them they stare....

happyone

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 2:14 pm

Same in Arizona and in Kentucky and in any area you would stand out. Only place is NYC where everything goes!

Zehava

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 2:17 pm

amother wrote:

Both

amother

Wheat

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 2:36 pm

happyone wrote:

Same in Arizona and in Kentucky and in any area you would stand out. Only place is NYC where everything goes!

If you stand out from the crowd, it is natural for people to take a second look, but in many places (IME) it is considered rude to stare so people at least pretend not to.

amother

Cobalt

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 2:39 pm

The social norms in that community dictate that staring is not rude. So they have no reason not to do it. No, it's not common sense- it's a socially dictated behavior.

Personally, I understand why it makes you uncomfortable. But they don't.

amother

Slateblue

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 2:44 pm

If you think the staring is bad in Williamsburg, check out Monsey! I've never seen anything like it!

amother

Pewter

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 4:21 pm

I live oot. For a few years, I traveled to visit an ailing parent and the best way to get there from the airport was to get a Jewish bus from Williamsburg.
I want to give a major shout out.
Someone placed a comfortable green lawn chair to the stoop in front of her house at the stop IIRC on Bedford Ave. across from...a Klausenberg mossad? Don't remember.
I would sit there for up to a half hour, depending on when I got to Willi from the airport. My sheitel's not so long but my slinky skirts were. My shoes, or boots, if you could see them weren't regulation flat slip ons. Nothing high and spiky, more like comfortable but not balabatish. And I traveled with a backpack for a carry on and a beat up carry on. I never felt stared at. People invited me to their homes for a drink or to use the bathroom.

My Williamsburg experiences.

happyone

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 4:24 pm

amother wrote:

Nice!!! I have found the chesed there unlike anywhere in the world! Although there are beautiful communities all over by now bh.

amother

Seashell

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 4:29 pm

I know exactly what your talking about I get it all the time too. Yes they def stare. Like for an abnormal amount of time. I'm always perfectly tznius and not loud in any way but I just look different and the women teens and kids all stare. . I find that even the very small kids stare. I always wondered about that...do they teach their kids " when you see someone who looks different from you then stare at them?" When my small kids see someone who looks different they might say something like "look at that pink hair" but they don't gawk for an extended amount of time. They move on. I'd love to hear the perspective of someone who lives there.

amother

Oak

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 4:38 pm

I have visited williamsburg plenty and currently live in Monsey , in a very chasseidish area.
Yes, they definently have staring problems.
I also dress 100% tznius, but not their style.
I actually have some fun sometimes, I will look back at them straight in the eye, big smile and wave hi. They usually look away uncomfortably , or in rare cases nod and say hi back.
Erev shabbos a lady was standing on the st and staring thru my open window into my living room. I went to the window and waved with a smile, she turned as if she wasn't staring for the past 120 seconds (we observed from a different window)

They aren't taught that social manner and menchlichkeit is a peiority. They have other wonderful maalos and can be lovely people once you get to know them, but they are lacking in this area, very badly. It's rude, it's not tznius, it's inappropriate, it's not sensitive to other ppls feelings.
I had teenagers sitting in my backyard they braught a kid to play on our swing set. I let my young daughter go out to play as well. I come out and DD comes over to me that the girls are staring at her and making her uncomfortable. She is pretty young and not generally caring of what others do, but it was gawking! So I went over and said hi again, and subtly mentioned in a non accusing way that my daughter feel a uncomfortable she said the girls are staring... all three of them were like oh! Felt a bit remorseful and didn't stare stare at her after that, just looked here and there , (they didn't even realize and it wasnt intentional, but they were never trained otherwise. It's like kids who stare at ppl who look disabled and we teach them bot to stare its not nice... They were never told anything)
They like stopped socializing with eachothe r to just stare, and none realized what they were actually doing.

I live with them for a while, some dont say hi to me, and see me regularly, some are super pleasant and easy to converse with- once your past their barrier and once they get over staring.

To answer your question in short. Yes, it is a culture to stare. A very accepted and promoted culture.

amother

Orchid

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 4:51 pm

amother wrote:

None of this should matter. I work in Williamsburg and while I dress to fairly typical community norms (again, that shouldn't matter), I enter and exit a car (from the driver's seat!!) and that always elicits stares. If I feel a stare for longer than two seconds, I stare back. It's like having a staring contest with a cat, you can never win.

ecs

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 5:21 pm

amother wrote:

I find this very interesting as I grew up in willi and staring was certainly considered rude! Op are the people staring kids or adults?

amother

Lilac

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 5:23 pm

I seriously just don’t get it! The girls will crane their necks and turn around not caring that I am mamash watching them as they stare- I’ve never seen anything like it!! A lot of girls-teens- mature young ladies- less of the older crowd I would say.

HonesttoGod

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 5:26 pm

They stare in Boro Park too.
And Flatbush to be honest. If they don't know you and you don't "look" familiar theyll stare.
Honestly I usually just wave or smile or say hi really nicely and they realize what theyre doing.

That said it may just be that you look different than the usual person they see there. I went to a bris in Willi a few weeks ago and a little boy asked me if I was wearing tights because he had never seen someone wear non seamed tights!

amother

Ruby

Sun, Jul 15 2018, 6:42 pm

On Kings Highway and East 9 I got stared at by a woman in her 40's. I stared back and we had a starting contest. Interesting experience.

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