The Surrendered Wife: What's the deal on it?

amother

Ivory

Mon, Jul 23 2018, 5:02 pm

Rachel Shira wrote:

I don’t understand why people get so hung up on the fact that there are things in her books that don’t jive with them. Isn’t that with everything? Whenever I read something, there are things I agree with and things I don’t. I don’t feel the need to disregard an entire book because of a concept or two I’d rather not put into practice.
Read the book and see for yourself what you like about it. I also don’t get the fear mongering about it being antithetical to yiddishkeit. I didn’t find that at all.

I'm curious to hear book reviews.. that's all.
I'm not afraid of being "influenced" hashkafically.. just want to hear people's opinion on it before I buy it/take it out.

LovesHashem

Mon, Jul 23 2018, 5:17 pm

Rachel Shira wrote:

This.
This.
This.

If I only read things I100 percent agreed with I wouldn't read any frum magazines.
I'm saying this as someone who gets things PRINTED in those same magazines.
I take what I like and disregard the rest.

rosey

Mon, Jul 23 2018, 5:25 pm

I actually took a marriage class by a frum therapist based on the book. I didn't count pages, but it looked like she basically skipped two chapters (one on intimacy and one on finances) and otherwise we read many pages the from the book, discussing the strategies, and reinforcing the ideas with torah sources. A lot of it was hard to wrap our heads around (hence the discussion), but it did seem helpful.

As someone mentioned earlier, whether you're a control freak (which the book describes in many examples) or need help meeting your own needs (I would say my challenge), or somewhere in-between, it had very specific instructions on how to deal with and overcome everyday problems. But as I said to a friend who thought the book wasn't helpful for her, the book isn't meant for every marriage or every person.

The ideas are spelled out clearly and simply, although as I mentioned they still took some time to wrap our heads around them with questions like "why can't I just tell him how to do xyz if he does it wrong?" answer: "because that doesn't work for your marriage, but saying/doing abc might help." Pretty simple, but not necessarily easy.

amother

Seashell

Mon, Jul 23 2018, 5:33 pm

Rachel Shira wrote:

I am also trying to figure out which part of the book was anti Torah...

amother

Tan

Mon, Jul 23 2018, 5:47 pm

amother wrote:

I'm sure too. I just wanted to explore the takeaways of this book... and how it is so controversial.

The concept of surrender of one spouse to another is sufficient to spark controversy.

The premise is the author had a miserable (failed?) marriage because she though as a empowered modern women she should take charge in all areas of her marriage - which resulted in miserable marriage and husband.

Rather than that - a wife should restore her husband to the natural place of head of household and he will feel great - and will treat her well. The 'surrender'. She should also practice self-care.

Why people get so worked up (I feel) is because those who like it - are fanatical about it. Not like - this is a good book - take what you need.

amother

Mistyrose

Tue, Jul 24 2018, 12:14 am

Just to share the common known story. The daughter of Rabbi Shlomo Zalman read this book at a womens retreat after borrowing it from another rebbetzen who praised it. And then told that rebbetzen to adapt it for frum women. They then brought the book and concept to Sarah Yocheved rigler and the result is her marriage workshops -kesher wife - all very Torah based.
( I know I will be asked for a source but I cant remember where I read or heard this)

creditcards

Tue, Jul 24 2018, 12:54 am

amother wrote:

I would highly recommend it for ppl with reg marriages, especialy the ones that husband is not taking responsibilities. It is a torahdik approach to roles of husband & wife in a marriage. In response to the poster who said she wouldn't give her husband full responsibility of finances, according to ketubah the husband has to provide for his wife UNLESS she takes control of finances, so y would u do that? Let the brachah come in to finances by taking a step back & ur life will be a lot less stressful!

Where does this say in the kesuba? If the women manages the money the husband is not responsible to provide?

trixx

Tue, Jul 24 2018, 2:54 am

amother wrote:

This is literally Rambam's opinion. "Treat the husband like a king"

I actually find MOST of the book to be very much in line with Torah values. Just skip the intimacy chapter. And the finances one if it will get you too riled up. Seriously. There is more worth it than not in this book.

Duggie

Tue, Jul 24 2018, 3:31 am

I read the book too, and am just curious why to skip the intimacy chapter, because that didn't seem different to me from any Kallah class etc

From what I remember it was pretty much, be into it, show ur husband ur into it, make an effort etc....

Ruchel

Tue, Jul 24 2018, 4:39 am

Rambam also said to wash the husband's feet (unless it wasn't him then sorry mechila!). I read from a rabbi today that advice like this is cultural and can HURT today. You keep the idea of doing things that endear each other, but not the details if they don't fit.

I actually prefer having my husband handling the finances (ftr it was also the case when I worked) but any book telling me to? I'd burn it lol. I hate the title. I'm old school in some things but I am not surrendered, I choose my lifestyle.

amother

Ecru

Tue, Jul 24 2018, 5:33 am

I haven't read the book, so I can't comment on the contents. But I also would not want to read it.
At least as far as I'm concerned, my marriage is okay and "if it works, don't fix it."
We have our finances completely separate and split expenses. For me at least, that is essential for shalom bayit. I never have to get annoyed about my dh's earnings and spendings because it's his money and not mine. Mine is "safe". On the other hand, I maintain myself, that is, I pay for all my own clothes and accessories, for any furniture that I want, I bought our one car from my own money (I also use it most of the time, but dh is free to take it whenever I don't need it). Food, bills and big necessary household appliances we split. While I know that in Torah terms the husband owns all his wife's possesions, on the practical level I lead my own life with my own bank account and I have my own stuff and that brings me peace of mind.

amother

Maroon

Tue, Jul 24 2018, 5:52 am

I also can’t get past the title, so it’s a good thing I feel no need (or desire) to read the book.

B”H, we have a great marriage, in which neither of us has any need to “surrender.” Small and/or personal decisions are made unilaterally. Larger decisions and/or those that affect each other and/or our kids are made jointly. Same for financial decisions. All our money and possessions are under joint control. We each treat each other with respect - as equal partners. This works very well for us both - again with no need for either of us to “surrender.”

SuperWify

Tue, Jul 24 2018, 7:08 am

The Surrendered wife sounds just awful.

I have the Empowered wife and I think that title says a lot more.

Some parts in the book are extremely helpful- self care, (learning to take charge of my own happiness and not relying on dh) respect (agreeing with him ect however, even this advice is a bit dangerous. A wife is allowed her opinion) ect and some were a downright fail- telling DH to take care of finances - guess what? He prefers we do it together. Or if he says let’s go out for dinner and she said if DH says to do/buy something that costs a lot allow him to because as the the man of the house he’s well aware of what he can it can’t afford- well, well many times DH has no concept of over our budget ect.

rosey

Tue, Jul 24 2018, 7:25 am

Interesting everyone hates the title, I assume it's just marketing, a controversial title to get attention. It very much encouraged self care, clarifying, accepting and acting on your own needs, all respectfully and appropriately, which I found really empowering.

But why do so many pple with great marraige even care what this book is about? Clearly it's not for someone who doesn't want a book on marraige.

trixx

Tue, Jul 24 2018, 7:28 am

amother wrote:

Would.not.touch it since a BP.possek said no. Arent twerskys book good? Any other ( not breslev and.not.Brody )

Um I personally hate all of Twersky's books. Actually threw one down the chute for being boring and unenlightening. But hey that's why there is a big market out there.