S/o kids funding own...

amother

Cerulean

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:11 pm

amother [ Lilac ] wrote:

Wow! That's terrible. I expect that my working kids will have to contribute to their weddings because money is tight and I don't see that changing anytime soon. But I will not let them spend ALL of their saved money, and definitely would never spend it on their siblings. To me that sounds like stealing.

Was she always so manipulative and dishonest? Or was this a surprise to you?

She is a very manipulative and dishonest person, but I never thought she would go so far.

thunderstorm

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:15 pm

amother [ Turquoise ] wrote:

As much as I think a child should keep the gifts he received, it's still mostly a party that the parents made for the child.
You can't compare it to taking money from a child that worked for it and using it towards tuition.

Do you think it's ok for parents to EVER use their child's birthday money? To me, my birthday gifts were special for me. It was one of the only times in my life that I had money to spend for myself. Maybe it's people that grew up in poorer homes like me that have an issue with this. It's not like our parents ever indulged us in luxuries . It was the gifts from people that helped us have some luxuries in life. Maybe parents who always buy their kids lots of extras feel freer to do with their children's gift money as they wish.

imorethanamother

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:15 pm

amother [ Cerulean ] wrote:

My mom used my money to marry me off. I was ok with that part. But there was a decent sized sum left over, and she refused to hand that over to me. She married my brother off using the rest of my funds.

I have not forgiven her for that till this very day.

Yeah. That's harsh. I'm so sorry about that. Do you have a relationship with her at all?

33055

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:19 pm

amother [ Cerulean ] wrote:

No. She pretends it never happened or totally denies it, whichever excuse works at that moment. She either claims I'm miscalculating the numbers or she spent much more on my wedding than she actually did. I cannot tell her that I had a copy of the bank book and statements, cause I got that behind her back. I stopped bringing it up after a number of tries, cause it got me nowhere.

I worked for 3 years before my marriage, and started life penniless. She took every cent I had earned through those years.

I would show her the bank book. And I would point out the inconsistencies in her story. I am normally the type to laugh things off but not this.

This is so wrong. Where was your father in all this?

I also imagine that your mom isn't the easiest. I am so sorry for you. Hug

amother

Jade

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:21 pm

amother [ Cerulean ] wrote:

Hugs. I worked full time for about 4.5 years before I got married, and many, many side jobs while I was in high school , and my father took almost all of the money. I got married with only the wedding gift checks. I asked him a few times where the money was, he just kept saying her had a cheshbon. Right.
I am very angry about this. We will probably never be able to buy a house thanks to him.

mig100

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:22 pm

thunderstorm wrote:

The gifts are for the Bar Mitzvah boy and for the chassan and kallah to start their new home.

The weeding gifts I understand r to help set up home - living expenses of new couple- at least under ideal circumstances.( Of course there r times when it's used otherwise)

I honestly never understood the logic of giving bar mitzvah boy cash? Honestly curious.

A present / sefer seems definitely seems more meaningful at that stage

amother

Sienna

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:25 pm

It's unfortunate, tacky and tough on relationships, but think it's not unusual for this to happen due to the need to keep up with the Joneses. Kids dont know the ins and outside of adult financial situations and different households handle this stuff differently.

As for weddings, dh and I used our wedding money to pay his family's expenses for the wedding, like the photographer, the video, and the albums. It's not for me to judge our parents' motives or expenses. We hope to make small weddings for our kids so we can help with rent the first year if needed. IYH soon.

IMA bc personal info shared.

singleagain

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:30 pm

Re cash instead of a physical present

I still remember with fondness the combination cassette tape/ radio with a CD player and two huge deatachable speakers I bought for 70$ with my bat mitzvah money.

It made me feel really grown up and adult to know what I wanted, set a budget and pick it out myself.

But the key was that it was with my own money. Not money my mom took out of her wallet and gave me. I hadn't really babysat much at that point.. we didn't get a huge allowance.. besides, who saved allowance for a long time when there was snacks to buy.

(That's just the way I remember . Don't rip my memory apart bc you don't agree with the way I was raised

happyone

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:34 pm

my brothers cash gifts all went for bar mitzva expenses. with my own children I opened a bank account so they can save it. Thats VERY different than a child working and paying for school. It may be cultural as well.
When I grew up ny parents didnt have extra funds so we paid for our "extras" meaning film developing (did I date myself here?) lol.
I have friends that put all their savings to their own weddings and are not resentful. Should their parents rather borrow from strangers?

amother

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:34 pm

Wow, so interesting to see different people's perspectives on this. I had honestly never heard of such a thing so it's enlightening to read all the thought processes behind why such a thing would be done and why it would be ok.
I guess as a giver it never crossed my mind that my check would be used in such a way - now that I know it's more common than I'd think it's something to think twice about.

happyone

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:40 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

if I want to be sure a bar mitzva boy gets the gift, I give a gift certificate. If its friends of ours I give a check and trust it will go where it is most appreciated.

amother

Amethyst

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:43 pm

Didn’t read the whole thread but at least your husband. Had a bar mitzvah!
My husband grew up in a large family and has a summer birthday. He didn’t even have a real bar mitzvah or a party..
He had an Aliyah in the bungalow colony shul and they made a lchaim ..
And they took some pics Friday afternoon.

amother

Lime

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:55 pm

Most parents do the best they can, given their circumstances. And you know what, sometimes they miscalculate and make a mistake. Or their children react differently then anticipated. They brought you into this world, loved you, raised you, fed you, clothed you, educated you. Along the way, they might have messed up. So what? We are all human. Think about how you want your children, as adults, to view you. Despite our best efforts, it is almost inevitable we will make mistakes.
I would rather focus on the positive and all they did give me then what I did not receive or could have received or should have received.

(I am referring to relatively emotionally healthy parents, in a non abusive situation)

amother

Khaki

Fri, May 03 2019, 3:57 pm

I worked for almost 3 years before I got married. Gave every check to my parents and never to this day felt resentful. Money was tight and it was the right thing to do. I also knew when the time would come for me to get married they would pay for everything I need as they did till now. I never needed to pay for my own clothes, haircuts or small luxuries.
Some of my friends kept their own money and paid for anything they needed on their own and some didn’t keep and their parents paid. Only my very rich friends were able to put away their paycheck and not pay for their wedding.

Fri, May 03 2019, 4:01 pm

As far as I know halachicaly the money a girl earns up to her wedding belongs to the parents...
In my circles I know of some families which the daughters paychecks goes for daily expenses not even for her own wedding..

chestnut

Fri, May 03 2019, 4:40 pm

pg wrote:

If the family is so poor that they need her income, there's nothing wrong with it, imo

amother

Crimson

Fri, May 03 2019, 7:24 pm

chestnut wrote:

If the family is so poor that they need her income, there's nothing wrong with it, imo

I have chassidish cousins whose parents take their paychecks from the time they start working until they get married. I’ve always assumed my cousins resent that - I think it’s outright stealing, and such a disgusting thing for parents to do. It’s so weird to me that people like my aunt and uncle (and you) exist. How could such a twisted way of thinking be so widespread? And how the hell could it be sourced in the Torah?

Last edited by amother on Sat, May 04 2019, 11:32 am; edited 1 time in total

amother

Babyblue

Sat, May 04 2019, 6:55 am

I know many people who did this for barmitzvas. When I go to a simcha I give a cash equivalent of what is likely spent on our “plates” that evening.
Parents need to buy the boy tefillin , likely pay for laining tuitors etc etc. If they can afford to give the money (in our case invest it for the child) then great but if not ...the boy still deserves the same bar mitzva as his friends.
Our Israeli mechutanim said that in EY it’s pretty standard for the parents to use the chassuna gifts to pay for the wedding (this is the norm for Russians as well). They asked if it’s ok with us to give the couple all the money.
Nevertheless many guests came with a modest gift for the couple & a larger cash gift for wedding expenses.
I see absolutely nothing wrong with it. How does anyone think it’s feasible to have a large family with huge tuition expenses & chassuna expenses? Our daughters in law all paid for their own clothing & sheitelach from their work savings. Parents can’t and do not need to do it all.
OP you sound very entitled & judgemental .

amother

Purple

Sat, May 04 2019, 10:06 am

It's cultural.

In Israel it is very acceptable for bar mitzvas and weddings to be covered by the cheques.
Nobody thinks twice of it and nobody considers it 'stealing'.

People give a cheque based on a rough estimate of what a standard plate costs at these events.

And the truth is that if the parents decide to skip the fancy party and just have a kiddush at shul, they wont get any cheques anyway (except from saba and safta maybe, but often parents let the kids kerp those cheques anyway).

So it's not stealing, it's the community enabling the family to throw a party.

amother

Goldenrod

Sat, May 04 2019, 10:36 am

My siblings got married young so my parents basically had no choice but to pay for their weddings. Because I got married “older” they didn’t pay for anything - I had been self supporting for all my single years, and not even living at home to save money. I cost them not one single dime since I graduated high school and I paid for my entire wedding myself.