Shtisel's "Ruchami" will play Devorah Feldman in Unorthodox

Fuchsia

Sun, May 26 2019, 4:22 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

No she shouldnt have rejected the role, but her statement quoted in my OP sounds anti-Charedi to me. Like everyone in the community besides Deborah is at fault, and Deborah is the strong heroine who valiantly fights, shows them up for what they are, and outshines them all.

She said nothing of the sort. Her quote is exactly that, a woman who found her own way and her own voice after leaving a community where that may not have been possible. She’s not describing a heroine, just a fact of life. You’re coming across as very defensive, which is understandable, but not necessarily reality.

amother

Forestgreen

Sun, May 26 2019, 11:54 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Thats a first.

Id have thought its a bonding tool for the OTD community.

Do you have any newspaper articles to prove this?

Only things that were written in newspaper articles are true?
It’s a fact that a great majority of the OTD community rejected Feldman for the exaggerations and awful publicity the book generated, and generally sided with her ex, whom she maligned in the book. Feldman did not find a community here, and the only bonding was one of everyone against her.

This is common knowledge for everyone who kept up with the happenings after the book was published.

amother

Mon, May 27 2019, 12:23 am

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

In the age of everything being on the internet , there has to be some OTD discussion online, discussing what you claim to be a clear fact.

Dina2018

Mon, May 27 2019, 1:25 am

sequoia wrote:

You guys honestly think she should have rejected the role? On principle?

Actors play all sorts of characters, including thieves and murderers. It’s their job. It’s their craft. And yet this one particular role should be so beyond the pale that Shira Haas should have refused it? Just because she was in Shtisel?

thieves and murderers are portrayed as „bad people“, whereas Debora Feldman is a totally different story

amother

Forestgreen

Mon, May 27 2019, 7:50 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

In the age of everything being on the internet , there has to be some OTD discussion online, discussing what you claim to be a clear fact.

There is, but they’re in private groups and on personal FB pages.

You seem intent on believing that all OTD people are horrible people who celebrated Feldman’s smear campaign. That’s okay, you can continue believing that if it’ll help you sleep better at night, even though it’s not the truth.

amother

Emerald

Mon, May 27 2019, 8:43 am

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

Little defensive here aren't you?

That’s okay, you can continue believing that if it’ll help you sleep better at night,

is a line I see the OTD crowd using all the time when they have no real answer. It's one their many ways of manipulating people into believing them. Or at least not challenge them.

It's been used on me too many times for me to still fall for it.

Feldman says that the reason the OTD world doesn't like her is because she doesn't respect or accept the authority of Footsteps or any other OTD leaders. She has plenty of other not nice things to say about them too. Based on her personal dealings with them.

No I'm not giving a link to where she says that . I'm not giving those people more publicity.

amother

Forestgreen

Mon, May 27 2019, 9:00 am

amother [ Emerald ] wrote:

There are no OTD leaders. There is no such thing, and there are plenty of OTD people who don’t like Footsteps, say bad things about it, and aren’t shunned by their peers for it. This is HER line of defense for why the community turned away from her, her version of denial.

Like I said, you can choose to believe what you want. I just started this discussion because you seemed so shocked that the OTD community didn’t rally around her, because it didn’t fit your preconceived notions of the situation. I’m not even the one who brought it up in the first place, I only jumped in to verify the first poster’s comment.

amother

Tan

Mon, May 27 2019, 9:17 am

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

The otd "leaders" who spearheaded the smear campaign against Feldman were Shulem Dean and Leah Vincent. Both of them were writing their own memoirs and were upset that Feldman came out first with hers (and apparently got more money for her memoir than they did). Neither of them grew up Satmar though so their anger against Feldman was not warranted. That is especially since Dean chose a chasidishe yeshiva on his own which is not common in the chasidishe world and Vincent grew up oot and was exposed to things that chasidishe girls would never be exposed to but made it seem like she grew up as insular as chasidishe girls. This is problematic when your "competitors" are the ones who oppose your book.
Feldman wrote her book on her life based on her experiences. And many people who grew up in the same community as her can't say that they were raised by grandparents or that their aunt was the principal of the school, etc. So most people in that community will have different experiences than her and that is ok, it doesn't make her wrong. You are all welcome to write your own memoirs if you feel like you can tell your story better than her but dont disregard her experiences just because it differs than yours.

amother

Emerald

Mon, May 27 2019, 9:20 am

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

There are no OTD leaders. There is no such thing, and there are plenty of OTD people who don’t like Footsteps, say bad things about it, and aren’t shunned by their peers for it.(1) This is HER line of defense for why the community turned away from her,(2) her version of denial.

Like I said,(3) you can choose to believe what you want. I just started this discussion because you seemed so shocked that the OTD community didn’t rally around her, because it didn’t fit(4) your preconceived notions of the situation. I’m not even the one who brought it up in the first place, I only jumped in to verify the first poster’s comment.

I wasn't the one who brought it up either and I was also just coming to the defense of a poster.

I'm not going to argue with you about anything.

I will point out however, look at how many times you have to insist that those who don't think like you are "a line of defense", "her version of denial", "choose to believe what you want", "preconceived notions" etc.

You strike me as someone who deep down knows that she may be wrong in life. To block out such thoughts she delegitimizes them with that those who say it are "a line of defense", "her version of denial", "choose to believe what you want", "preconceived notions" etc. so not to have to deal with the possibly of them being correct.

amother

Forestgreen

Mon, May 27 2019, 9:25 am

amother [ Tan ] wrote:

Once again, there are no leaders and there was no spearheaded campaign. If Deen and Vincent were so worried about their own memoirs, why would they gang up together instead of against each other, since you’re saying they were “competitors” themselves. That makes no sense. People spoke up about how they felt about the book, and nobody made them do it.

Also, the second part of your post is not a response to mine; I didn’t say anything about the validity of her experiences.

And please, at least spell Deen’s name right.

amother

Forestgreen

Mon, May 27 2019, 9:26 am

amother [ Emerald ] wrote:

I wasn't the one who brought it up either and I was also just coming to the defense of a poster.

I'm not going to argue with you about anything.

I will point out however, look at how many times you have to insist that those who don't think like you are "a line of defense", "her version of denial", "choose to believe what you want", "preconceived notions" etc.

You strike me as someone who deep down knows that she may be wrong in life. To block out such thoughts she delegitimizes those thoughts with that those who say it are "a line of defense", "her version of denial", "choose to believe what you want", "preconceived notions" etc. so not to have to deal with the possibly of them being correct.

Right back at you.
Have a good day.

amother

Tan

Mon, May 27 2019, 9:30 am

Amelia Bedelia wrote:

For those of you defending Deborah Feldman and claiming that her memoir is accurate and based on her reality, check out this site:
http://deborah-feldman-exposed.....l?m=1

It clearly says that ""I go to Satmar school now.... There are twelve sixth-grade classes..." Which implies that she did not go to Satmar until now, that is until the sixth grade. And the tuition bill for the 6th grade proves it. Failed messiah is being irrational and nonsensical as
she does not have to say every little thing in a memoir as the book would never end so I fail to see how she misrepresented herself or lied.

amother

Tan

Mon, May 27 2019, 9:35 am

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

Of course there are leaders, Deen was on the Footsteps board and I believe Vincent played a leadership role at Footsteps as well. And then there is someone who started the OTD Meetup group so that is yet another leader. And there are others. So yes, they didn't gang up against each other because they were working together at Footsteps ( and Deen helped Vincent with her book). Feldman was just going against the grain and came out first with her book which they couldnt fargin her. Anyway, how would Deen and Vincent who didn't even grow up chasidish or have chasidish parents (and remember that Deen chose to go to Yeshiva in New Square, no one forced him to) know more about the chasidishe world in WB than Feldman who grew up there?

amother

Aubergine

Mon, May 27 2019, 9:41 am

amother [ Tan ] wrote:

What is the OTD community?

The community of people who make it their life's mission to attack Orthodoxy - as a former member?

How big is this group?

amother

Forestgreen

Mon, May 27 2019, 9:42 am

amother [ Tan ] wrote:

Ex charedi OTD adults who got out from decades of submission to their parents and rebbes are not looking to follow new leaders. I know all the players you’re discussing and none of them consider themselves, or are looked upon as, leaders. They may be active in bringing some of the community together and providing resources, but they have no authority and no way to dictate to a very diverse group of people how they should think, feel or act. It just doesn’t exist.

Again, I’m not discussing the truthfulness of the memoir.