14 year old DD does not want to get vaccinated

southernbubby

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 9:31 am

amother [ Brunette ] wrote:

If there is so much nonsense we say then prove it and it will keep us quieter. If you cant, we will keep on Wink

But this is causing rifts in families and communities because you don't have credible sources for anything that you say and people are legitimately afraid to allow their babies around people who offer false assurances about babies being protected by breast feeding and maternal antibodies. 11% of measles sufferers were infants under a year and another large percentage were children of the still vulnerable under age 3 category? How do you justify that? What do you say to parents who will have to wait decades to see if SSPE or male sterility developed chas v'sholem?

amother

Brunette

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 9:38 am

amother [ Apricot ] wrote:

Why aren't you responding with the studies regarding cancer? Cancer isn't something you 'clear'.

I am following the CDC schedule? No I'm not. Why do you say that? Do you follow me to the doctor?

And what do I mean regarding conspiracy?... you've argued something about a specific vaccine Gardasil and then say things like " This is the same with every vaccine.. I'm trying to follow what your thesis is, what are you trying to say (without referring to "they" and "you").

they dont want studies to be done with cancer and measles. I posted a link anyways in my response to southernbubby. there are more, found this for now.

possibly you dont follow the schedule, but in order to send to school in NY must be up to date with all vaccines so no way kids here can be missing any.

Which thing did you want me to prove? To go through every reason why I think each vaccine isnt safe and why some are not effective or possibly highly ineffective?

I will try to come back to this post later to read what else it is that you wanted bec my brain is fried and I need a computer break/must start my day.

southernbubby

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 9:40 am

amother [ Seashell ] wrote:

Southern Bubby, all the non vaxxers I know keep their views quiet and do not advertise or push their agenda on anyone. They just want to be left alone. So there were a few hecklers in Albany; there will always be individuals in any group who don't know their boundaries....

I guess that I met the ones who put anti-vax propaganda on social media or wormed their views into other discussions. I did admit in several posts that those who kept a low profile were harmed by the ones who trolled, threatened, and as you said, didn't know boundaries.

amother

Brunette

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 9:48 am

southernbubby wrote:

like ive said in past thrads. Natural immunity provides lifelong immuniity and is passed through breast milk. Vaccine immunity is not life long, some people do not develop immunity and isnt effectively passed through breast milk/placenta. If everyone would have measles as children, there wouldnt be the hysteria among pregnant woman and the elderly as they would have already had the measles.

How can SSPE be related if it comes about years later? How do we know that is actual factual info. (I recently heard about it and havent seen sources yet. Please feel free to share)

That being said, I know a few kids personally who got encephalitis from the vaccine. Dr. Confirmed. How can someone tell me that is better ?

amother

Apricot

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 9:50 am

amother [ Brunette ] wrote:

Who is "they"?

I don't want you to prove anything. I want to know the point that you are trying to argue for? Like - The CDC manipulates data to promote vaccination because _____. Vaccinations are not sufficiently studied. All vaccines aren't safe.

All of these statements are independent of the vaccine mandate in New York.

Politicians are corrupt - is relevant to the vaccine mandate in New York.

Possibly I don't follow the schedule?? Why would you doubt a claim that I made about myself?

nchr

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 9:52 am

amother [ Brunette ] wrote:

There are people who had cancer and got measles which cleared it. Fact. Not just 1 person. This was after trying it all.

What do you mean by spelling out the CDC conspiracy?
Non vaxxers arent talking bluff. They are saying things that are listed straight up on CDC website or in actual published studies. But everyone says is fake. You cant pick and choose. You are folllowing the CDC schedule but then cant accept the info they provide on their website? Come on...

There is an experimental treatment where they treat a specific type of blood cancer in an individual who does not respond to standard treatment where they suppress the immune system, infect it with measles and then when the measles kill all of the live cells, the hope is that they kill all of the cancer cells as well. It is not a treatment for all cancers, or a first line of treatment. Medical has also tried infecting brain tumors with polio and seen success. Its not a natural measles infection.

amother

Hotpink

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 9:53 am

amother [ Brunette ] wrote:

If we know of cases where the disease itself didn't give the adult full immunity, how can we be so sure that it'll pass to their kids?

And in the scheme of things, my baby's lack of immunity until she gets the shot beats my grandmother's miscarriage when she caught rubella while pregnant and then another one the following year from the virus still getting in her system

nchr

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 9:54 am

amother [ Brunette ] wrote:

back it up. show me it doesnt shed. its a LIVE virus for heaven sake, just like the others you mentioned. Immune compromised arent supposed to be around or receive the vaccine.

Yes, immune compromised household contacts are ADVISED to get the MMR to protect sick individuals. Please go read through other threads where I linked the peer reviewed studies. We have tested blood of those recently infected, etc. The only component that potentially sheds is the rubella. Just because it is live does not mean it sheds. If measles would shed, there would be thousands of annual cases and we'd probably need a 50-60% immunization rate to concur herd immunity (as was the case with OPV when it was used).

nchr

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 9:56 am

Natural immunity is not passed through breastmilk. It's from the womb and lasts for about 6 months, as is the case with vaccinated mothers, although it is true that the passive immunity from naturally infected mothers is stronger. I've posted studied on that as well. You do know that thousands of babies in Africa who are solely breastfed and whose mothers had natural measles get the measles.

nchr

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 9:58 am

amother [ Ginger ] wrote:

Over 30 percent of the measles cases in the Disneyland outbreak were found to be vaccine strain.

There is a Navy ship out at Sea now that cannot dock because there is a major mumps outbreak among the passengers who are all fully vaccinated.

Mumps vaccine is only about 80-85% effective. The Disneyland outbreak was traced to the Phillipines. Saying something that is untrue does not suddenly make it true.

amother

Hotpink

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 9:59 am

nchr wrote:

I believe that one of the goals of the OPV was actually intended to shed and give a weakened infection to those who came in contact to boost the reach of the vaccine to wipe out epidemics. They still use it in places of epidemics as a way of getting more people immune faster because it's weaker than the full blown infection

amother

Ginger

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 10:22 am

nchr wrote:

Mumps vaccine is only about 80-85% effective. The Disneyland outbreak was traced to the Phillipines. Saying something that is untrue does not suddenly make it true.

Yeah I agree
What in my post is untrue?

southernbubby

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 10:32 am

Brunette, it doesn't pay for me to research on this phone, that which has been said many times. I don't know even how to copy and paste on the phone despite other posters sending the instructions via pm and I have slow internet in this apartment because there is no WiFi access for this side of the street! Yes there are scary things that can happen from vaccines, good things that can happen from vaccines and grey areas where there are disorders that because the origin is unknown, it's convenient to blame vaccines.
It may be that innocent anti-vaxers are harmed by the actions of a small number of careless people but that is exactly how fear gets started.
I do feel that children should be offered the choice to vaccinate at an earlier age and there are doctors who tell teens that at age 16, (depending on the state law) they can receive Gardasil without parental consent and I feel that this is fair.

southernbubby

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 10:38 am

amother [ Brunette ] wrote:

It would be great if you could post sources. SSPE can't be blamed on measles but cancers and autoimmune disorders that develop years later can?
Also, we can't go back in time, even if the measles vaccine was a huge mistake. Pregnant women and babies are vulnerable and blaming society for vaccinating doesn't protect them one bit.

southernbubby

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 10:48 am

I just looked up SSPE and it is caused by the measles virus and the incidence declined after the measles vaccine became widely used. It also appears that .7/million of those who get the measles vaccine develop SSPE. Is that what you are referring to?

amother

Ginger

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 12:24 pm

nchr wrote:

You said that the Disneyland outbreak was caused by the vaccine. It was not.

Nowhere did I say the outbreak was caused by the vaccine. I wrote that the vaccine strain was found in many cases-it was curculating.
Also one thing I've noticed on imamother is that people tend to think there is one cause and one effect to things. That is not usually the case.

amother

Apricot

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 12:29 pm

amother [ Ginger ] wrote:

that reads like cause and effect.

southernbubby

Mon, Jul 08 2019, 1:36 pm

Again I tried to copy and paste and it doesn't work Banging head

If someone can post it, The Atlantic that was posted today, has a super interesting article about how the DIY ,self help, individualism , of the 70's grew into the anti-vax movement of today.
Trigger warnings for anti-vaxers, the article is neither supportive or flattering.