Whats with the lace tops?

amother

Firebrick

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 11:12 am

There are many torah sources stating that the reason for the mitzvah of hair covering is because of "pritzus degavra" which means the hair if a married woman is pritzus to men, since hair is the main beauty if a woman, after marriage it needs to be covered and reserved for her husband only. Because it's really forbidden for a man to look at a married woman she needs this extra level of tznius to ensure that men dont look at her inappropriately
That's the point of the head covering.
If it was about looking married women could just wear a ring or a sign on their head that they are married.
"Saar bieisha erva"- means that the hair of a married woman is considered erva, erva means a body part that can cause attraction to a man.

azn722

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 11:40 am

watergirl wrote:

I'm thinking OP is wondering if this is allowed because she is intrigued and if it is allowed, she would like one for herself.

OP, if you are interested in this type of sheitel, please ask your LOR.

If you are wondering if this woman was in fact wearing a sheitel, I would just direct your thoughts elsewhere. One can never lose out by thinking kindly.

I was all prepped with a snarky reply to OP but you taught me something about “Dan l’kaf chov” as well as “hocheach tochiach”- two principles mentioned in hilchos lashon hara which I obviously need to work on Silent

Unfortunately being sarcastic comes way too easy for me and I’m trying to kick the habit. So thank you for such a gentle yet direct reply

Cheiny

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 12:48 pm

azn722 wrote:

Unfortunately being sarcastic comes way too easy for me and I’m trying to kick the habit. So thank you for such a gentle yet direct reply

I admire your attitude. I’m sure Hashem does too. 🙂

amother

Purple

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 12:59 pm

1ofbillions wrote:

Seriously? This is what you’re worrying about? 🤦‍♀️

Mind your own business. If you want to make the world a better place, work on your middos. Leave everyone else alone.

Omg the offensiveness 🙄

Op didn’t say she walked up to the woman and confronted her.
She’s merely starting a discussion about something that is bothering her.

amother

Cerise

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 1:04 pm

itsmeima wrote:

I wear a wig to cover MY hair. Not to let you know that I'm covering my hair!

I don't know how to say this and not sound judgemental, but I'm very curious, what's the difference between your hair and your neighbors hair? I'm not allowed to wear my hair so I'll wear my neighbors hair and she will wear my hair and we'll put it on a lace top so it will look like it's growing out of my scalp

SixOfWands

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 1:32 pm

amother [ Cerise ] wrote:

If you're looking for logic, you're not going to get it. This is not a mitzvah that you can parse out and make sense of. Nothing magically mysteriously happens to a woman's hair under the chuppah to make men more aware of it.

The rabbis have said you have to cover your head. Or your hair, depending on your rabbi. Ergo, you cover it.

If this were logical, you could only use the hair of an unmarried woman. Or ALL wigs would he assur.
But as I said, its not logical.

So do what you think is appropriate, in consultation with your rabbi. If you don't want to wear a wig, don't. (FTR, I don't. I wear mostly berets. But every time a thread like this comes up, I want one. I just can't afford it.)

PeanutMama

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 1:40 pm

amother [ Olive ] wrote:

According to some opinions your head covering is to show you are a married woman.
So yeah, ****if you can't tell it's a sheitel that would defeat the purpose.****

I’m of this opinion too. I do wear wigs but only the ones with a part not from lace. It does not have lace at all. Maybe a regular wig cap. But it does have a part.
Women claim that lace front wigs empower them as a Jewish married woman, that they help them love the mitzvah of head covering more, feels more “them” etc

I’d understand if a divorced woman wore one or if a woman with hair loss issues (alopecia, trichotillomania, cancer) wore it for shiduch prospects and maybe to feel good but actual married women? Eeeeeeeeehhhhhhhhh. Not so much. Like above poster said I’m of the opinion hair must be covered with a noticeable cover. Not saying everyone should walk around with a pot or a very cheap shiny wig, yes we supposed to do mitzvos with happiness. Maybe lace top is their way of doing kisui rosh besimcha. If it makes them happy, okay! I won’t attack anyone for it tho or try to change them cuz that’s not in me. Kisui rosh is HARD.

I admit I do look questionably at the kids who call their sisters “mommy” 🙈

It is confusing, but eh.

What will happen to those who DONT want to wear lace tops and every shaitel macher only has this type of wig? Thats partly my main fear since more and more people are wearing them today.

Last edited by PeanutMama on Fri, Apr 02 2021, 1:43 pm; edited 1 time in total

SixOfWands

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 1:41 pm

amother [ Firebrick ] wrote:

There is a reason why many frum women are now wearing tichels:)
It does a great job upgrading modesty and declaring to the world that I'm a religious married woman and off limits.

No.

(1) It doesn't "upgrade" modesty. It accomplishes the mitzvah in a different way.

(2) In fact, I could argue that it DECREASES modesty as it calls attention to the woman, particularly in places where most women don't wear headscarves.

(3) Frum men shouldn't be prowling for women in any case. And non-frum men have no clue why you're wearing a tichel.

You can be proud of YOUR decision as to how to cover, without belittling those who made a different decision.

amother

Jade

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 1:41 pm

amother [ Cerise ] wrote:

It doesn't sound judgemental just ignorant!

There is no difference between your hair and your neighbors hair ON each of your head. Your hair on your head is considered ervah.

But if your neighbor grows her hair and you grow your hair because your the same color and you cut it and swap it to make wigs there's no issue. That's what human hair wigs are. Other people's hair.

It's only issue when it's your OWN hair growing out of your head.

There is nothing wrong with the scenario you presented

PeanutMama

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 1:46 pm

amother [ Firebrick ] wrote:

There is a reason why many frum women are now wearing tichels:)
It does a great job upgrading modesty and declaring to the world that I'm a religious married woman and off limits.

YES. I’ve heard many rabbanim say tichels are best way to cover our heads.

I’m not at that level yet.

I know someone from our shul who upgraded to a tichel as a zechus for something and she does it happily.

But it hits different when you CHOOSE to cover with a tichel and not like be forced into it.

SixOfWands

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 1:49 pm

Hashem_n_Farfel wrote:

I’m of this opinion too. I do wear wigs but only the ones with a part not from lace. It does not have lace at all. Maybe a regular wig cap. But it does have a part.

Some women claim that lace front wigs empower them as a Jewish married woman, that they help them love the mitzvah of head covering more, etc

I’d understand if a divorced woman wore one or if a woman with hair loss issues (alopecia, trichotillomania, cancer) wore it for shiduch prospects and maybe to feel good but actual married women? Eeeeeeeeehhhhhhhhh. Not so much. Like above poster said I’m of the opinion hair must be covered with a noticeable cover. Not saying everyone should walk around with a pot or a very cheap shiny wig, yes we supposed to do mitzvos with happiness. Maybe lace top is their way of doing kisui rosh besimcha. If it makes them happy, okay! I won’t attack anyone for it tho or try to change them cuz that’s not in me.

I admit I do look questionably at the kids who call their sisters “mommy” 🙈

It is confusing, but eh.

What will happen to those who DONT want to wear lace tops and every shaitel macher only has this type of wig? Thats partly my main fear since more and more people are wearing them today.

WADR, that sounded like an attack to me.

Many many years ago, before I was married, or religious, before "lace top" wigs were a glimmer in their inventor's eyes, I had a temp job. One of my colleagues was a recent graduate who didn't know a lot of Jews, and had certainly never met many religious ones. He told me about attending the wedding of a religious classmate. Before the wedding, she had thin, mousy hair. After the wedding, though, she looked amazing. He had no clue whatsoever that it was a wig, or why she was wearing it. Early 90s, so probably a wig just like yours. So if your point of differentiation is that all of those "Eeeeeeeeehhhhhhhhh" people wear lacetops, while you don't, well, fact is that to a huge portion of the world, you're "Eeeeeeeeehhhhhhhhh" unless you're wearing a straw broom on your head.

amother

Jade

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 1:49 pm

Hashem_n_Farfel wrote:

But there are just as many Rabbanim (or more?!) That don't hold that tichels are the best way to cover our heads.

SixOfWands

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 1:55 pm

Hashem_n_Farfel wrote:

AIUI, the Lubavitcher Rebbe held that married women should wear wigs, not tichels.

I hardly think that he's recommending a "lower level," or that his recommendations require an "upgrade." And while I'm rather obviously not Chabad, I figure he's a big enough rabbi that we can all feel good in our decisions.

PeanutMama

Fri, Apr 02 2021, 2:26 pm

Sorry. I guess I’m being misunderstood.
Language barrier I guess.
When I say eh usually I mean I don’t care what people do. I say ehh a lot lol.

Also I looked up wigs in the 90s.....my wig does not look like that!! It has a white/beige part, you can adjust the wig where you want the part to be, to the left, right, middle. Kinda looks like a scalp. I don’t know so much about wig as to what type they are but it’s not a wig that looks extremely wiggy.

If people find joy wearing the same wig I do, okay! If not, okay! There are many many options. A woman can choose what to cover her head with. Not like I’m pointing a gun to her head and saying wear that or else!