My son broke another boys glasses out of anger

amother

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 9:38 am

My 9 year old son has a few diagnoses and in general has an anger/impulsivity issue.
He broke another boys glasses in school because the boy didn’t let him play during recess with the class. (After a few days of him not being allowed to play this happened)
Of course we reimbursed the parents right away for the replacement but I’m not sure how much to make my son pay for it
He gets no allowance and in general doesn’t have a lot of money (think $100 saved over many years from Chanukah and birthday)
The replacement costed $50

watergirl

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 9:41 am

Why is it up to this boy to allow or not allow your son to play during recess? And why was the teachers not watching to prevent this from happening (not the glasses - the playground dynamic)?

As for how he should pay, how about assigning a dollar amount to various household jobs, and he will have to do jobs until it ads up to $50. So setting the table = $4, etc.

amother

Beige

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 9:44 am

What is standing out to me, is that you said that the other boy was not letting him play with the class. It sounds like he is being bullied.
Clearly there need to be repercussions for breaking the other boys glasses, as violence is never the answer, but I'm so tired of us blaming the victims when they try to stand up (unsuccessfully) for themselves.

If that is indeed the case, please be careful, as the last thing he may need is feeling like you don't have his back.

Chayalle

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 9:45 am

Did you fully investigate the incident and get all the details about how this happened?

I remember when a mother called my mother, irate and furious, telling my mother that my brother broke her son's glasses, and my parents had better pay. My mother calmly told the woman she will speak to my brother and get the facts, and be in touch. It turned out the boy was trying to punch my brother, my brother put up his hands in self-defense and knocked the boy's glasses off by accident.

My parents didn't pay.

Your son is a katan l'halacha. It's not clear that you are obligated to pay. And yes, I'd want to know where the Rebbe is, and why a boy is tormenting your son, and what they are doing about it.

mha3484

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 9:47 am

Ill be the dissenter. I think for a kid with multiple diagnosises and impulse control issues, making him pay wont change his brain chemistry and wont teach him to not do it again. I have a 9 year old with fairly severe ADHD and that kind of punishment does not teach the lesson that I want it to. His brain is lagging behind his peers. For us, a combo of meds, therapy and using the book the explosive child have helped him a lot more then punishment.

Does your son get therapy? Is he medicated? I think your best off working on how to manage his feelings of anger when things dont work out how he wants so it does not happen again.

amother

Blonde

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 9:49 am

I'm sorry. But no. Just no.

He is 9. 9!!

Repeatedly he was not allowed to play. Yeah maybe he has issues, but sounds like the other guy does too, you know? Why is he allowed to be mean and then "oh poor boy" when a hurt child strikes back. Yes, he shouldn't have done it, but there is blame on more than one side.

Its nice that you paid for the glasses. Now you go do battle and stick up for YOUR child and what was done to him!! This is NOT all his fault. Ooooh, this makes me mad.

clowny

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 9:51 am

Chayalle wrote:

This.

SixOfWands

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 9:54 am

As others have said, talk to your son about what happened, without judgment. Maybe, as others suggested, he was being bullied, in which case you need to ask for a meeting with the school and with the other parent -- you've paid, but you need to ensure that the overall issue isn't glossed over.

Nevertheless, I'd make him "pay," but not with money. There's all kinds of opportunities for chesed at this time of year -- paying it forward to make up for a "bad deed." He can help shovel an elderly neighbor's steps, or clean off their car in the snow. Help a younger sibling with reading, or play with them to let you rest on Shabbat. Give him an opportunity to do good.

And, of course, speak to his therapist about how to handle this.

amother

Ecru

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 9:58 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

You don't want the lesson to be "we don't break other kids glasses because it costs money to replace" - and at 9 his concept of the value of money is rather abstract.

So my vote is - take no money from your son.

FranticFrummie

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 10:00 am

I'll take the other side. Maybe OP's son is unpleasant to be around, has poor social skills, and generally annoys the other kids. Maybe he plays too roughly, or too loudly, or is too bossy in the game.

I believe that kids should have the right to choose who they play with, if it's free play. If it's an organized sports team, that's one thing, but general recess play is another.

If OP's son was more fun to be with, he'd have his own friends to play with, and there wouldn't be an issue in the first place.

I really, really hate it when schools "force friendships". It almost never works. You can't like everyone all the time.

mha3484

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 10:02 am

FranticFrummie wrote:

This is actually my son in many ways but its gotten a lot better. FF you said this much better then I could have. I kept thinking about how I can phrase it and then you commented.

ShishKabob

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 10:05 am

FranticFrummie wrote:

I don't like this post, to me it seems like blaming the victim.
Although, I must say, that ff you always have such a nice way of expressing yourself usually in a non judgemental way.

eileengray

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 10:11 am

ShishKabob wrote:

I don't like this post, to me it seems like blaming the victim.
Although, I must say, that ff you always have such a nice way of expressing yourself usually in a non judgemental way.

Why do people automatically assume that OP's son is a victim? All we know about this situation is that OP's son broke a boy's glasses after the boy refused to let him play. We don't have the full story here.

ShishKabob

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 10:11 am

eileengray wrote:

The same way it's being assumed that he is socially inept.

SixOfWands

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 10:14 am

FranticFrummie wrote:

No, you can't force friendships. But you also can't tolerate bullying and excluding kids. That's why OP needs to look into what is going on.

eileengray

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 10:16 am

ShishKabob wrote:

The same way it's being assumed that he is socially inept.

That's not an assumption, OP mentioned in her post that her son has anger/impulsivity issues.

amother

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 10:18 am

Thank you all for replying. This is exactly the discussion I'm having with my husband, he thinks he should pay fully and I don't see the point.
I don't think it will actually make a difference to his behavior. He is in a small school with only 12 boys in the class, they all play together during recess and refused to let him play. He has a lot of difficulty socially, controlling etc so what exactly should we do? he goes to therapy to learn better behaviors, but with his diagnoses its not so simple. Teachers are there but during recess they only react, even though I have begged the school to do preventative measures..
My heart breaks for him and I dont want to take away his money but my husband thinks its necessary consequence

ShishKabob

Wed, Nov 13 2019, 10:19 am

eileengray wrote:

That's not an assumption, OP mentioned in her post that her son has anger/impulsivity issues.