Is elitism more prevalent in the frum community than elsewhe

amother

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 3:34 pm

I've noticed on this site as well as in the real life frum world, the usage of expressions that seem to imply elitism. Some examples are "top, top person", "well known family", "prominent person in the community" ....
Even in the threads where people talk about a problem they're having, they will start with "no-one would ever dream that I'm having problems but"
It grates my nerves!! For those of you who use these expressions, I really want to know this: What gives you the notion that you are "more special" than the rest of the hoi polloi? Seriously? I'm very curious!

And just by the way, I'm not speaking out of bitterness or envy. I actually have some really known relatives and I could easily use the choshuv name dropping while talking about my family's yichus if I chose to. But I don't, because a. I don't think it makes me more special than anyone else - we're all descendants of Avraham and Sara and b. it's rude.
Rant over. Thank you!

Learning

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 4:43 pm

naturalmom5 wrote:

OP... dont let it bother you...

50+ years of life experience has taught me that the really arrogant ones

ALWAYS ALWAYS GET WHATS COMING TO THEM

I didn’t see that 😢 but it will come to them in shamayim

allthingsblue

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 4:48 pm

Expressions like that grate on my nerves too. I know many "great, prominent" people who also have serious shortcomings (don't we all!) and anytime I read an article lauding a prominent personality who sounds so perfect in so many areas, I remind myself that the article is only highlighting the best qualities of this person, who surely has many not-as-good qualities as well (so I shouldn't judge myself or Dh in comparison with these great people, because no one is perfect and everyone needs to do their best).
Top boy is one phrase that really gets me. Top in what? If it ain't in middos, it ain't top, in my opinion.

amother

Smokey

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 4:52 pm

Learning wrote:

I didn’t see that 😢 but it will come to them in shamayim

I'm with you...and I'd rather see it here, personally. It doesn't make me feel better to know they'll be punished later. I'd rather they be punished now and rewarded later.

FranticFrummie

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 5:04 pm

allthingsblue wrote:

You said it, sister! Thumbs Up

I raised DD by the motto "Don't judge people by what they look like, don't even judge them by what they say. Judge them by what they DO." Appearances are deceiving, and words can lie, but actions speak for themselves.

amother

Lilac

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 6:17 pm

It's all over.
My husband's friend told him how people in their elite (non-jewish) neighborhood would choose their friends based on income, and which college their kids got into. If your kid didn't get into the right school or you didn't have the right car or the right income your next door neighbor or the one right across wouldn't even bother looking your way.

watergirl

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 6:33 pm

hodeez wrote:

I think all secluded groups experience this. I'm sure the Amish, devout Mormons, and the like have their own hierarchy within the community.

In our kehillas, its not a hierarchy. Its gaiiva.

amother

Honeydew

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 6:37 pm

In Islam there is hardly a hierarchy amongst the people other than the ruling class.
At the same time women, slaves and non-Islam have no status or #*!## status.

There is a book by by Bernard Lewis called "What went wrong?" on the Islamic countries as it is today
describing their dynamics.

https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/.....48393

For the rest of the world, unless you are considered socially awkward or were raised with great morals people naturally think in terms of hierarchy.

WATCH A VIDEO OF GRADE SCHOOL CHILDREN AND YOU SHALL SEE THEY SIZE EACH OTHER UP TO SEE WHO IS THE NERD, WHOSE IN BETWEEN AND WHO ARE THE CLASS QUEEN.

human nature!!!

amother

Honeydew

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 6:39 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

thanks for bringing this up.
I think more shidduchim would be made if people would have less hierarchy or gaava as one poster put it.

Rappel

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 7:04 pm

amother [ Honeydew ] wrote:

In Islam there is hardly a hierarchy amongst the people other than the ruling class.

Nah. Not that all Muslims are Arabs, but have you ever attended an Arab Muslim pre-wedding party? There is tons of status in that society attached to how much money you spent on something.
Definite elitism based on wealth.

Same thing in the Jewish world - you'll absolutely find cultural pockets of elitism which have nothing to do with real Judaism, but which present through religion.

OP, I know what you mean, and it disgusted me growing up. I think every society probably has its own value system of "better vs. not," but where I live now, I don't feel or hear it, and it's a relief.

The religious rat race was definitely born out of some level of extremism, and will continue thus, I think. I think it's a self-correcting system, though, generationally speaking, so I'm not that worried.

watergirl

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 7:09 pm

trixx wrote:

Have you read Harry Potter? Every society has its purebloods and its mudbloods.

I am disgusted to think that someone would look at a fellow Yid, a beloved child of HKBH, and see a mudblood.

SuperWify

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 7:10 pm

trixx wrote:

Have you read Harry Potter? Every society has its purebloods and its mudbloods.

This. Well put.

And I think our society puts an emphasis on respecting those better then us (is- our rabbis teachers and leaders) so that Torah won’t get forgotten. I will say, however, some people unfortunately let it get to their heads Sad

SuperWify

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 7:12 pm

watergirl wrote:

I am disgusted to think that someone would look at a fellow Yid, a beloved child of HKBH, and see a mudblood.

I didn’t take her words to mean that. I think she was saying some people think they are better then others because of their yichus, birth ect.

dancingqueen

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 7:13 pm

amother [ Apricot ] wrote:

Ha. As a 'not American' figured these posts about "top doctors" was an American thing. New lingo for me.

No I think it’s an in-town yeshivish/Chassidish thing.

watergirl

Thu, Feb 27 2020, 7:22 pm

SuperWify wrote:

I didn’t take her words to mean that. I think she was saying some people think they are better then others because of their yichus, birth ect.

Right. And that gaiiva is disgusting.