Separate glasses for meat and dairy?

shabbatiscoming

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 3:00 am

amother [ Babypink ] wrote:

We have two sets of glasses. I know this is not halacha but we were taught that it is preferred. I'm quite sure my great grandparents in Poland never dreamed of 2 sets of glasses.

My question though is if you use one set for both, how do you wash them? Only in cold water? Only by hand? How does that work? I assume you can't rinse out the milk and stick into dairy dishwasher and next day use it while eating a burger? Or can you?

Also, does the allowance of glasses for meat and dairy extend to items used for very hot things? Glass mugs for tea? Glass bowls for chicken soup and ice cream?

This must be a new trend, and thats all. I mean, as you said your grandmother had one. I grew up with one as did most families I knew.
Its a trend now to take on more stringencies, but I dont know about preferred.

Rappel

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 3:12 am

I grew up with separate sets of glasses - Ashkenazi.

We now have one set - Sephardi.

We keep any other glass/corelle dishes otherwise seperate. (Yalkut Yosef says undamaged corelle has the status of glass.) it would be very weird for me to consider a dish interchangeable; I don't know why I view them differently than a drinking glass. But it makes it easier to keep track.

LovesHashem

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 3:48 am

I’ve never heard of having one set.

That being said as of now I would feel very uncomfortable eating in a home with one set.

I’m very curious to learn more about this though. What makes glass different?
If you have glass plates can you use them interchangeably? Can you use other types of cups interchangeably?

Can I get some actual halchic sources on this? Does anyone in this thread consider themselves yeahivish or chareidi?

I don’t understand the glasses get dirty. Why are they allowed to be used? Children get food all over them. If you are having chicken wings or hand food they definitely get very dirty.

Rappel

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 4:07 am

LovesHashem wrote:

Glass doesn't absorb bliyot. The Shulchan Aruch is quite clear.

https://www.toraland.org.il/%D.....7%9D/

The shittah I grew up with (mostly based on the Mishna Berura) adds a stringency to keep glass completely separate, so that you'll never mix up anything dirty. Many Ashkenazim hold thus. However, you'll find that if you did accidentally mix meat and milk in a glass, your Rav will invariably tell you that the glass is kosher, and should just be cleaned thoroughly.

Sephardim are split, mostly along the lines of SA versus Rambam. Rambam held that because glass is sourced in sand, it has the status of pottery, and it isn't kasherable at all. Teimanim, Iraqim, and anyone whom follows the Ben Ish Hai holds thus.

Shulchan Aruch- based shittot, including the Yalkut Yosef, are consistent that glass does not absorb. They never introduced the stringency of seperate dishes, so you'll see many Sephardic households have one set of drinking glasses, which they wash thoroughly before putting them away. Some prefer to have seperate glasses, but that is an individual matter, not a kehillah one.

LovesHashem

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 4:11 am

Rappel wrote:

So flash dishes can be used for both too?

Rappel

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 4:14 am

LovesHashem wrote:

So flash dishes can be used for both too?

Yes, if they are completely clean, and if your shittah doesn't have an extra stringency for separation.

I personally don't feel comfortable with using glass bowls for both, but that's me, not halacha. It's just too confusing for me, and I often put away food in dishes, so they don't get washed right away like drinking glasses do. I don't want to lose track.

LovesHashem

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 5:03 am

Rappel wrote:

I hear - I just asked my husband and he says that cooking in glassware can't be used as a kli rishon. Like you can't make lasagna, and wash it and make something meat in there in the oven....

shabbatiscoming

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 5:29 am

LovesHashem wrote:

I hear - I just asked my husband and he says that cooking in glassware can't be used as a kli rishon. Like you can't make lasagna, and wash it and make something meat in there in the oven....

Right, cooking cant be for both basari and chalavi in the same glass didh. But glasses to drink from is fine. This is how we grew up in an ashkenazi community. And how we do it now.
I actually never knew anyone held that two sets of glasses were needed. You learn domething new every day Smile

LovesHashem

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 6:12 am

shabbatiscoming wrote:

My DH says this is how Ashkenazim pasken today - we don't pasken like the shulchan aruch.

Rappel

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 6:26 am

LovesHashem wrote:

I hear - I just asked my husband and he says that cooking in glassware can't be used as a kli rishon. Like you can't make lasagna, and wash it and make something meat in there in the oven....

That again comes from the argument - pyrex has the status of כלי חרס, or אינו בולע? There are shittot both ways.

Not a thorough source, but at least it touches on the points:

http://halachayomit.co.il/he/d.....D=154

For myself: AFAIK, the YY puts pyrex under the glass category. But I would never dare cross the two, because I'm not such a great balabuste. LOL

my cookware always has something burnt on, no matter how well I clean it. Anyway, the very idea gives me the heebie-jeebies.

Rappel

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 6:45 am

Upon further reflection:

If I had a larger kitchen, I think I would have seperate glasses too. Halacha is halacha, but if you have the space, it's just practical. and as a poster upthread said, glasses are cheap these days.

But right now we have a galley kitchen with one sink, and a DS who really likes working in there, so for my sanity and practicality we've made it a meat kitchen with disposable/dairy options. If DH ever makes me a dairy coffee, then we wash the glass in the shower, which makes it almost not worth the bother.

LovesHashem

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 7:37 am

Rappel wrote:

Wow. How do you live like this? No wonder you don't have separate glasses. We have a large kitchen, two large sinks, so much storage.

amother

White

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 7:53 am

My father (who is a chemical engineer) always said that glass now isn't just glass, and that can be a problem, especially since you don't get an ingredient list. On a practical level, we never had glasses for milchigs- only fleishigs. Milchigs, we use(d) disposable or nice plastic cups, because our daily use of them has to be very durable.

amother

Linen

Fri, Jun 19 2020, 8:03 am

Rappel wrote:

Until we got separate glasses, for washing simplicity, I drank my ice coffee from mugs.

Of course now we use disposable everything because I don’t have time or energy to wash dishes