Neighbor has a backyard camp

Blessing1

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 5:13 pm

shabbatiscoming wrote:

Im sorry but you did not say anything about a rav. You said that it was outright assur, full stop.

Yes it's assur and everyone knows that.
I thought it's self understood that when a frum jew has a sheila, they ask a Rav. I didn't think I need to spell that out to a frum women.
There's nothing to be proud of "living a whole other Judaism that we do" by minding what other people do and wanting to report others.

amother

Pink

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 5:32 pm

I used to live in an apartment and the upstairs neighbor had a group of 4 year old boys on my head!! I davened hard and chasdei hashem she didn't fill up the following years ...

amother

Purple

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 5:36 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

I'm assuming you are a jewish women and you follow the torah. I assume that you know that it's assur for a jew to report a jew.
It is absolutely none of your business if someone is doing something illegal. A Jew that says that another jew "better be reported" and is thinking about reporting another jew, especially when it's not about pekuach nefesh, is a Rasha.
Hashem is the judge, not you or me.

How can you call someone a rasha just for thinking about reporting? Really uncalled for and yes we do have room in halacha to report for things that aren't pikuach nefesh.

What bothers me personally is the amount of times in this thread you reiterate that unfortunately op can't report on frum Jews. That's not for you to say. It's for her Rav to determine. To me it read " and in case anyone here was thinking reporting is an option let me say ten times it isn't so that no one even thinks about asking a Rav"

Sorry OP, really inconsiderate of these neighbors I do hope something gets worked out.

shabbatiscoming

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 5:36 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

Im not trying to be proud or anything like that. Ive been on this site a LONG time. It still surprises me how differently so msny frum jews practice yiddishkeit so differently. Thats all.

amother

Hotpink

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:02 pm

OP, maybe you can get noise canceling headphones.

I live in a building on the marina.
View is beautiful, but
The yacht workers blast music at night
City says they are allowed to until 12 pm
I like to go to sleep early, before 10.

It’s annoying but if there is nothing you can do
then try to find a viable solution

pause

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:06 pm

It is assur to report, but one may get a heter in a specific situation to do so. Just like many other hanhagos that are assur for a frum yid, but allowances are made on an individual basis. So blessing1 didn't say anything wrong.

Still every frum yid should know that even if something is assur, but they personally are having difficulty abiding by the halacha, they should talk to an understanding Rav about it, and they might be surprised by how helpful a Rav can be, whether with advice, a change in perspective, a leniency, etc.

amother

Pink

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:08 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

OP said the noise is bothering her.
Everyone is entitled to make noise in their backyard during the daytime. If it's an illegal daycare, it's non of OP's business.

Meshuga. No one’s entitled to make excess noise in their backyard. You can’t set off fireworks, you can’t host a petting zoo, and you’re not entitled to your illegal daycare either. A normal family makes far less noise than a full- fledged day amp (with the exception of course of a family of 10 boys stuck at home during corona)

amother

Khaki

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:16 pm

I'm just curious as to your stance on reporting a Jew.
Does it matter if s/he is Frum or all Jews?
What if it is child abuse?
Elder abuse?
If the elder abuse is physical or financial?
What if the person is stealing?
If they are stealing from a company? Individuals? Or yatom and almanas?
What if the person is stealing from a company like boni olam or tomchi Shabbos ?
What if the person is a rapist? What if you know they are a rapist but didn't rape you? What if the Frum rapist rapes only non-Jewish women?
Or is a pediphile, or molestor or is non-violent and works in a school? Is it ok if you know this but it is a secular school and not a Yeshiva? What if children are being endangered?
What if a/he brakes into your home?
What if you are unable to reach your rav in a timely fashion?

If people would just conduct themselves properly, we wouldn't have all these questions.

amother

Cerise

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:18 pm

was not picturing a "full fledged camp" of 100s of kids
a backyard camp as I know is like what 10 kids?

yes it would be great if the illegal and dangerous fireworks were shut down

AYLOR

Blessing1

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:21 pm

amother [ Purple ] wrote:

What bothers me personally is that when someone posts about an issue or complaint about others, so many posters right away say "report them" as if it's not a big deal and something that's allowed to be done. There are usually other solutions besides for reporting.
I think we all know that if we feel like if there's something we absolutely must report, we need to ask a sheila.

amother

Purple

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:32 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

You make a lot of assumptions about what "we all know." It seemed condescending at best when you kept going on about the issur.

Op was clearly asking how to handle the situation and telling her moving is an option but not mentioning the possibility of asking a shaila is a bit extreme.

amother

Silver

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:33 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

And the noise is driving me crazy. There are about 20-30 kids and they are outside all day making a racket. Even more when they go swimming.
How much noise is normal? At what point can I say something?

Is she licensed? If not ask a rov about reporting her if she doesn’t agree to make changes.

Blessing1

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:35 pm

amother [ Purple ] wrote:

You make a lot of assumptions about what "we all know." It seemed condescending at best when you kept going on about the issur.

Op was clearly asking how to handle the situation and telling her to moving is an option but not mentioning the possibility of asking a shaila is a bit extreme.

I wasn't the one to bring up reporting. Frantic Frummie said that she can report, so I answered her that it's assur to report. Frantic Frummie didn't say she can ask a sheila about reporting, she just said that she can report.

amother

Purple

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:36 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

It's equally as assur to run an illegal day camp. Dina demalchusa dina.

Shabbat is coming should be proud. Proud that she understands the tremendous scope of halacha and the myriad of possibilities.

Blessing1

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:40 pm

amother [ Purple ] wrote:

It's equally as assur to run an illegal day camp. Dina demalchusa dina.

Shabbat is coming should be proud. Proud that she understands the tremendous scope of halacha and the myriad of possibilities.

Yes, it's assur to run an illegal daycamp, but it's none of my business if my neighbor is doing something assur.
Just like it's none of my business that my neighbor has government programs illegally or running a business illegally. 2 wrongs don't make a right.
Everyone is in charge of their own actions.

amother

Purple

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:44 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

Of course it's your business. We are all responsible for each other.

amother

Khaki

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:47 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

I'm so curious, is it none of your business if your neighbor is a rapist, as long as he doesn't rape you?

amother

Purple

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:49 pm

amother [ Khaki ] wrote:

I'm so curious, is it none of your business if your neighbor is a rapist, as long as he doesn't rape you?

According to blessings logic it's her business even if he rapes her because well what can you do you can't report a Jew. The noise affects OP that's why we are even discussing it.

shabbatiscoming

Mon, Jul 06 2020, 6:50 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

OK, we are assuming by all of your "its assur to report" that this neighbor is jewish.
Is there not a jewish idea that "kol yisrael areivim ze la ze"? That every single jew is responsible for the next jew?
Im sorry but thats just not true. We are very much responsible for every single Jew.

And that is also why, maybe not in this instance, but in other more extreme cases, where reporting MUST be done (lets go really extreme with s3xual abuse. You go straight, do not pass go, you do not collect 200 dollars, straight, to the authorities.)