"Not Testing"/"Don't Test"

DrMom

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 7:39 am

Blessing1 wrote:

If I have strept I know it's that. But if I have all Covid symptoms and it's not strept, the right thing to do is quarantine.

The right thing to do is test so you can find out what you have and, if necessary, contact people with whom you've been in contact.

NotInNJMommy

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 7:42 am

Tzippy323 wrote:

But if you have step you don’t have to quarantine, you can treat for 24 hours with antibiotic and go back to school. This is a whole different story.

Yes, the local DOH here told our school and school nurse that for strep, this is true.

Other symptoms would require a COVID test, etc.

STMommy

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 7:43 am

Tzippy323 wrote:

Just plain idiotic. I was told, by a Frum medical professional, DO NOT TEST! If we test, the results are reported and yeshivas and Bais Yaakovs will have to quarantine, shut their doors for a period of time, or c”vsh close down for most of the year. So a sick child, with symptoms but no conclusive diagnosis, is sent back to school with a “cold”. Now, that whole class, plus the teacher/rebbe/morah has been exposed. But by all means, don’t ask don’t tell. And if others get sick, or bring it home to at risk parents and grandparents and siblings and those with compromised immune systems, well, it is all in HaShem’s hands. I though it was our obligation to take care of our guf. Didn’t we learn that somewhere?

This is exactly what is driving me crazy.

STMommy

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 7:44 am

NotInNJMommy wrote:

Yes, the local DOH here told our school and school nurse that for strep, this is true.

Other symptoms would require a COVID test, etc.

My own children go to a school with no nurse. I am not a qualified medical professional and they have no access to one at school. My only recourse is to take them to the doctor. For all these people saying "no test" or don't test" what that also means is that when they have symptoms, they are not seeing a medical professional because any normal doctor would do a COVID test upon any possible symptoms. They are guessing whether their child's symptoms are COVID or not. When my own child had a cold I ran her straight to the pediatrician and she only had to quarantine for 2 days till we got the negative result. What stupidity to not bring her to the doctor and make her quarantine for 2 weeks for nothing.

NotInNJMommy

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 7:44 am

STMommy wrote:

This is exactly what is driving me crazy.

Me too. BH Our OOT school (NY) is requiring COVID tests, reporting, etc.

It may be difficult, but iyh it won't be because families are prudent in their behaviors both at school and outside of school.

NotInNJMommy

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 7:48 am

STMommy wrote:

We don't have a full time nurse. A nurse is assigned by the school district to oversee all medical forms, etc. and compliance with DOH, etc. for all matters, including this, and she officially works part time in this private school and some of the public schools. (It's also fortunate that she is a parent of children at our school and extremely yekkish, but reasonable/informed.) I just spoke with the nurse to understand that if a child has a positive strep test, does antibiotics, etc., do they still need to get a COVID test? Her answer after consulting with the head nurse in the school district and local DOH was no additional COVID test would be needed for positive strep.

No one would be tested at school. They would be required to go to the dr and possibly get a COVID test (which wouldn't be at the drs. office anyways).

Miri1

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 7:50 am

[quote="Blessing1"]I had all symptoms. My Dr told me that I don't need to test, I should just assume I have covid and quarantine for 2 weeks. If you quarantine when feeling sick, there's no need to test.[/quote

What about the people you had contact with while contagious?

If you didn't actually have Covid, why should they quarantine?
And it would be unethical not to tell someone if you did have it.

If this wouldn't affect others I can understand though why someone might not bother testing.

Blessing1

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 7:51 am

DrMom wrote:

The right thing to do is test so you can find out what you have and, if necessary, contact people with whom you've been in contact.

The tests are so inaccurate. People with no symptoms test positive and people sick in bed with all symptoms test negative. This is why quarantine & masks are important. As soon as I felt sick I let the people I had been together with know. You should do this regardless of testing.

Blessing1

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 7:53 am

[quote="Miri1"]

Blessing1 wrote:

I had all symptoms. My Dr told me that I don't need to test, I should just assume I have covid and quarantine for 2 weeks. If you quarantine when feeling sick, there's no need to test.[/quote

What about the people you had contact with while contagious?

If you didn't actually have Covid, why should they quarantine?
And it would be unethical not to tell someone if you did have it.

If this wouldn't affect others I can understand though why someone might not bother testing.

This is part of why we shut down in March.
I let everyone I had been together with know that I'm sick.

Miri1

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 7:56 am

Blessing1 wrote:

I had all symptoms. My Dr told me that I don't need to test, I should just assume I have covid and quarantine for 2 weeks. If you quarantine when feeling sick, there's no need to test.

But why 14 days??!
The accepted isolation time is 10 days as long as you're on the mend and fever free by day 9 .

It's 14 days for others from the last time they had close contact with you during those 10 days.

Miri1

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 8:05 am

Blessing1 wrote:

In my opinion, that's not an excuse for not testing.

Informing people but not coming up with the pertinent information doesn't help anyone who has a bunch of kids to send to school. True there are a significant number of false negatives, and a much smaller number of false positives, but the benefits outweigh the risks, for the most part.

I think the chances of a false positive would be collateral damage when compared to the chaos that would ensue if you don't test (obviously depending on whether you've had close contacts during the two days before being sick).

And of course there are situations where this might not be the case, such as a closed pod, or if the whole town is in lockdown anyway. Which is why extrapolations don't really work with covid- there are so many variables (case counts, behaviors and their risk level, family size etc.)

(edited for accuracy)

Last edited by Miri1 on Thu, Sep 10 2020, 8:05 am; edited 3 times in total

Blessing1

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 8:08 am

Miri1 wrote:

In my oppinion, that's not an excuse for not testing.

Informing people but not coming up with the pertinent information doesn't help anyone who has a bunch of kids to send to school. True there are a significant number of false negatives, and a much smaller number of false positives, but the benefits outweigh the risks, for the most part.

The CDC doesn't recommend testing for anyone who had a positive in the last three months, so if you're not in that category, I think the chances of a false positive would be collateral damage when compared to the chaos that would ensue if you don't test (obviously depending on whether you've had close contacts during the two days before being sick).

And of course there are situations where this might not be the case, such as a closed pod, or if the whole town is in lockdown anyway. Which is why extrapolations don't really work work with covid- there are so many variables (case counts, behaviors and their risk level, family size etc.)

I was sick back in March, I went to the Doctor and they said they don't test. So that's what I did. There was anyways a lockdown, so I don't think it would matter much if I tested.

Miri1

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 8:12 am

Blessing1 wrote:

I was sick back in March, I went to the Doctor and they said they don't test. So that's what I did. There was anyways a lockdown, so I don't think it would matter much if I tested.

Well that was my point.
You can't extrapolate from what a doctor told you in March when there was limited testing and a lockdown, to what we should do now.

Now we have ample testing, we have rapid and PCR (and the PCR can even identify if it is a different virus that you have).
And we are trying to make school work, so people have a very practical need to know what the most likely cause of illness is.

I can't believe your doctor would tell you the same thing today.

Miri1

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 8:17 am

Now I realize it was in March, it makes perfect sense.
I did the same. I had a lousy cold, and we all went nowhere for a long time (and I never did get antibodies so I probably didn't have it, but we did what we had to do).

But now there is a lot at stake, we want schools to stay open, and we don't people getting sick.

amother

Chocolate

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 8:25 am

In my community, the local doctors don't test. They base their diagnosis on symptoms only, and instruct patients and their families to quarantine accordingly. Why cripple an entire community due to false positive tests, or let the virus roam freely when a patient gets a false negative?

STMommy

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 8:34 am

amother [ Chocolate ] wrote:

Do they instruct their patients to call all the people they've had contact with recently to say they might have COVID? Do you think you would voluntarily go into 10-14 day quarantine if someone you had contact with yesterday told you they might have COVID? Will a place of employment allow someone to quarantine without penalty with no positive test anywhere done by anyone to substantiate the need? Will a school close a classroom if a student maybe had COVID? I'm sorry but this all sounds ridiculous.

amother [ Chocolate ] wrote:

Why cripple an entire community due to false positive tests?

Because better safe than sorry?

SixOfWands

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 8:39 am

keym wrote:

If I understood the peak about not testing.
It was a specific situation of enclosed pods. 20 boys dorming locked down together. Not going home, not going anywhere for at least 8 weeks. The yeshiva would have their needs delivered to them. The maggid shiur would give the shiur on a porch behind plexiglass.
So what purpose would testing those boys accomplish if they have no or very mild symptoms.
The argument about camp, just in true lockdown style. No coming, no going, no exposure.

Because the first boy who has covid may be asymptomatic, but the 4th boy he gives it to could become very ill. Had the first boy been isolated, that would not have happened.