"Not Testing"/"Don't Test"

SixOfWands

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 11:44 am

amother [ White ] wrote:

My doctor told me not to test my children.

If my child is sick. Keep them home. Get myself tested and then quarantine my own family based on my test.

This is for a few reasons

1. To keep the child's class from being shutdown for 2 weeks.

2. Because a person can test positive with inactive cells for up to 3 months. And if that happens my child can be out of school for 3 months GD forbid.

So yes test. But test the person that is least likely to creat longer term fallout issues.

So the people in contact with your kids don't know that she has covid, and that they might as well. They keep going to school, to the store, to the playground, to shul, potentially infecting other people. Dozens of people, or more, get sick, some very sick. But HURRAH, school isn't closed!

keym

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 11:50 am

SixOfWands wrote:

Because the first boy who has covid may be asymptomatic, but the 4th boy he gives it to could become very ill. Had the first boy been isolated, that would not have happened.

I disagree.
Its like a family.
If one has 10 children, and one gets sick, it's assumed that all of them will get sick. Some possibly more or less severe.
In March/April when people weren't going anywhere or exposing anyone, if a family had one child sick, they didn't necessarily quarantine from all the rest of the children in the family. (Especially if there's only one bathroom) The whole family stayed inside together.

SixOfWands

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 11:59 am

keym wrote:

The recommendation was that the sick person isolate from the rest of the family, having food left at the door, and using a dedicated bathroom if possible. We did isolate from the kids at home, and when it was clear that they didn't have it, they went elsewhere.

keym

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 12:06 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

Ok. I don't necessarily agree.
Especially for a child under 8?10? Or multiple children. Isolating may not be possible.
My point being that this capsule quarantine is not necessarily irresponsible and wrong.
Especially as Southern Bubby wrote either uppost or in a different post, contrasting this system with the college protocol of sending positive students home to recuperate in their hometown- bringing home the virus to their families and community.
There is something to be said for locking the door of dorms- no in or out.
But yes, a sick student should recuperate separately, but all other students are presumed exposed.

PinkFridge

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 12:25 pm

Blessing1 wrote:

I had all symptoms. My Dr told me that I don't need to test, I should just assume I have covid and quarantine for 2 weeks. If you quarantine when feeling sick, there's no need to test.

If you had symptoms, it's recommended to go for a certain amount of time without fever (fever that's reduced with medication doesn't count), and also symptoms. Which might be longer. Or not.

southernbubby

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 12:45 pm

In many frum communities, huge families live in very small apartments so that an infected person would have nowhere to go. Some countries, where much of the population lives like this, recognized this as an issue and opened quarantine hotels to isolate the sick people from those who are healthy.
I think that if mobile units with testers could go to homes with a presumed case, and test everyone in the house, that could result in more tests being performed. A school or work absence would trigger a visit from the mobile unit. Of course, schools and work places would have to be assured that they wouldn't be penalized unfairly.

amother

Mauve

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 1:22 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

That is the ideal way to do it, both to avoid more people becoming sick, and also to keep the quarantine time as short as possible.

With my family the sick person isolated to enable the rest of the family to end their quarantine sooner (14 days from the last contact with the sick person). This would have been VERY difficult in a small apartment or if the sick person had required care.

Quarantining as a family would be a minimum of 24 days from the time symptoms started or from the positive test if asymptomatic, assuming no one else becomes sick.
The person who tested positive originally would be able get on with his life after ten days though.

amother

Forestgreen

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 2:52 pm

I found this on the Facebook page of someone with some common friends, he said it was an ad in Stamford Hill. The translation was posted with the photo.

Attention: as it is known, the government have taken a strong look at our area of Stamford Hill, and also the media have already come to visit our area to find what they have been allowed to find, and want to put us back in lockdown.

Therefore we warn not to go and get tested by 'The Hackney'

In case you need to be tested, forgive us and go to a private healthcare provider - and that way you will prevent the nullification/cancellation of thousands of prayers and the Torah learning of the public.

amother

Periwinkle

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 4:26 pm

amother [ Magenta ] wrote:

I think the thought process behind it is that since the tests are not accurate, instead of testing anyone with symptoms should stay home and quarantine.
If there is a false negative they will go to school and infect others because they assume they don't have covid. If there is a false positive they will shut the school down for no reason. If it is a legitimate positive then they can just as well quarantine without the test.
Continuous testing will just cause the students to be quarantining on and off all year for no reason.

You get an award of being dan lekaf zchus. Halevai this was the reason.

amother

White

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 4:34 pm

amother [ Periwinkle ] wrote:

You get an award of being dan lekaf zchus. Halevai this was the reason.

That is the thought process. The tests are not as reliable as one would hope. And people can test positive with dead cells. So let's say they have a cold. But they had covid months earlier. Now they have to test. But they don't have covid. But they're testing positive because of dead cells.

Miri1

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 4:50 pm

amother [ White ] wrote:

According to the CDC this can happen for up to three months after a positive test. But there may still be clinical reason to test - depends on the situation.

But either way... what about everyone else? Not everyone has tested positive in the past three months, I'll bet not even 30%.

Also, this is the case with the PCR, I'm not sure if it would be the case with the antigen test (rapid). Anyone know?

(Edited to fix an inaccuracy)

Last edited by Miri1 on Wed, Sep 09 2020, 5:11 pm; edited 3 times in total

southernbubby

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 4:58 pm

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

I found this on the Facebook page of someone with some common friends, he said it was an ad in Stamford Hill. The translation was posted with the photo.

They have to hope that everyone who gets it recovers without going to the hospital because that would alert the Hackney.

amother

Chocolate

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 5:00 pm

STMommy wrote:

Because better safe than sorry?

The families I know with assumed covid cases are quarantining and kept their kids home even though it meant missing the first day of school!

SixOfWands

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 5:00 pm

Miri1 wrote:

So how about everyone else?

Also, this is the case with the PCR, I'm not sure if it would be the case with the antigen test (rapid).

AIUI, PCR is close to 100% accurate, albeit with a small number of false positives on people who have recovered. The antigen test is less accurate.

In any case, I'm having a hard time believing that a school that discourages testing is going to shut down classes where a child is symptomatic, and advocate that families quarantine.

Last edited by SixOfWands on Wed, Sep 09 2020, 5:11 pm; edited 1 time in total

Miri1

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 5:10 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

I edited my post, because there is no blanket rule not to retest, rather it is a clinical decision made by the the doctor.

https://www.cdc.gov/media/rele......html

SixOfWands

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 5:12 pm

Miri1 wrote:

I edited my post, because there is no blanket rule not to retest, rather it is a clinical decision made by the the doctor.

https://www.cdc.gov/media/rele......html

I'm not sure it matters, but I removed that line from my quote of you.

southernbubby

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 5:20 pm

SixOfWands wrote:

I talked to someone today that lives in an out of town community with a handful of shuls, schools, and frum businesses and they have strict SD and mask rules in the community as well as excluding children from school if a sibling has a cold. Basically there is no economic impact on the community if everyone stays home, doesn't include guests, or get dressed up for shul so there is no conflict between their health and their wallets.

This doesn't mean that everyone is on board with it but the official community policy is outdoor minyonim, weddings, etc which are in complete compliance with laws, ordinances and recommendations. There are always a few who don't think that the rules apply to them.

ChanieMommy

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 5:20 pm

amother [ Forestgreen ] wrote:

I found this on the Facebook page of someone with some common friends, he said it was an ad in Stamford Hill. The translation was posted with the photo.

I am shocked.
That's so antithetic to protecting life!
And how naive to think that the media looking for "metzius" would not find this "metzie"...

Also, they have strange way of transliterating "government"...

southernbubby

Wed, Sep 09 2020, 5:39 pm

ChanieMommy wrote:

It looks like whoever put it on Facebook is upset about it and wants people to know what is going on. Yiddish bulletins can be read even by people who are not community members and supporters.