 |
|
 |
 |
|
|
Forum
-> Chinuch, Education & Schooling
|
amother
Apricot
|
 Fri, Nov 20 2020, 11:19 am
| nchr wrote: | | But wouldn't that be reinforcing the bad behavior but rewarding them with me interacting with them? |
Not really...I don’t think it’s wise to put your relationship on hold because you’re mad at them. I wouldn’t use my connection with them as a reward/punishment basis.
| |
|
| Back to top |
 0
 5
|
nchr
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 11:35 am
| amother [ Apricot ] wrote: | | Not really...I don’t think it’s wise to put your relationship on hold because you’re mad at them. I wouldn’t use my connection with them as a reward/punishment basis. |
So you will talk to a tantruming or crying child and not ignore it until they speak with proper language? Or talk to a child you have punished to timeout?
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
0
|
Zehava
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 11:37 am
| nchr wrote: | | So you will talk to a tantruming or crying child and not ignore it until they speak with proper language? Or talk to a child you have punished to timeout? |
Ignoring is it’s own form of punishment called the silent treatment. It makes a person feel like they don’t matter.
So if you’re ignoring a child on top of punishing them you’re giving a double punishment.
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
7
|
|
amother
Lavender
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 11:40 am
| nchr wrote: | | So you will talk to a tantruming or crying child and not ignore it until they speak with proper language? Or talk to a child you have punished to timeout? |
In the case of the frosting, while bathing my 3-4 yo I would have said,
Chani, I am sorry I yelled at you (because in my case, I would've).I was so surprised that you smeared frosting all over yourself! And I was upset that it was such a big mess, but I still shouldn't have yelled at you.
I see that you like the squishy mushy feeling.
There's something called shaving cream that we can spray in the bath that feels nice and smushy. Maybe I'll buy it for you next week, and When you feel like you need to smish, we can do that instead. I love you
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
4
|
|
amother
Apricot
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 11:45 am
| nchr wrote: | | So you will talk to a tantruming or crying child and not ignore it until they speak with proper language? Or talk to a child you have punished to timeout? |
I work hard to make sure my kids don’t feel ignored. My mother used to give me silent treatment, and it killed me. If a child is kicking and screaming to the point that I can’t talk to them, I’ll stand up and calmly say “I’m right here when you need me/ you’re ready to talk it out.”
Even when a teenager “wants to be left alone”, they really crave the connection and attention. You don’t have to go join them while they will in their room, but a gentle knock and a hand on their shoulder, maybe a kiss on their forehead, speaks volumes and is very good for the both of you.
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
3
|
|
amother
Floralwhite
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 12:13 pm
| amother [ Goldenrod ] wrote: | Where is a good place to learn these wonderful parenting philosophies?
I feel like I naturally parent ‘gently’ but have been told numerous times that I allow my children to get away with things:( I have a house full of boys & week to find the right balance. |
Blimie heller’s course is incredible. If you have Instagram, you can follow her and gain a lot there. She also quotes and reposts other gentle parenting accounts. Of course books are great too. Unconditional parenting by alphie Cohen is great.
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
3
|
crust
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 12:21 pm
| nchr wrote: | | But wouldn't that be reinforcing the bad behavior but rewarding them with me interacting with them? |
Interacting with children is giving them a basic human need like air.
The Tomer Devorah sais that Hashem, not only is He an ארך אפים but He also gives the sinner life and He carries the sinner on his hand.
In all our interactions we try to emulate Hashem. If Hashem carries us even we've sinned, we should be able to talk to our children even they did a silly thing that is easily washable.
I do not undermine the frustration that happens when finding the children like this. I don't like the glitter in my house.
I'm explaining where I'm taking the idea that we treat children with respect even they do things that are frustrating.
Raising children= growth. We can be frustrated and still act respectfully.
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
6
|
nchr
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 12:34 pm
| crust wrote: | Interacting with children is giving them a basic human need like air.
The Tomer Devorah sais that Hashem, not only is He an ארך אפים but He also gives the sinner life and He carries the sinner on his hand.
In all our interactions we try to emulate Hashem. If Hashem carries us even we've sinned, we should be able to talk to our children even they did a silly thing that is easily washable.
I do not undermine the frustration that happens when finding the children like this. I don't like the glitter in my house.
I'm explaining where I'm taking the idea that we treat children with respect even they do things that are frustrating.
Raising children= growth. We can be frustrated and still act respectfully. |
I understand. I just (apparently mistakenly) thought that silent treatment was just ignoring someone without end, but that it is fine to ignore someone if they are misbehaving. If my child is complaining, I never respond because I don't like complaining, but once s/he start speaking maturely, I respond. If my child has been punished in the corner and is asking me for water, I didn't know I should bring her/him water or say "you are being punished now." When my children are supposed to be in bed I don't communicate with them if they come out of bed, I just put them in bed. I didn't understand that is denying a basic human need. I speak to them during the day and usually, since DH and I both don't like idle conversation and prefer quiet (we have quiet seudas for example), I give each child 5 minutes to talk about what is on their minds. My kids over 6 know to make notes and bring us the notes to talk when it is their turn. When it is a siblings turn, then they need to wait until later if there is time or the next day. I hadn't realized that I need to speak to them all day.
| |
|
| Back to top |
2
1
|
Zehava
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 12:44 pm
| nchr wrote: | | I understand. I just (apparently mistakenly) thought that silent treatment was just ignoring someone without end, but that it is fine to ignore someone if they are misbehaving. If my child is complaining, I never respond because I don't like complaining, but once s/he start speaking maturely, I respond. If my child has been punished in the corner and is asking me for water, I didn't know I should bring her/him water or say "you are being punished now." When my children are supposed to be in bed I don't communicate with them if they come out of bed, I just put them in bed. I didn't understand that is denying a basic human need. I speak to them during the day and usually, since DH and I both don't like idle conversation and prefer quiet (we have quiet seudas for example), I give each child 5 minutes to talk about what is on their minds. My kids over 6 know to make notes and bring us the notes to talk when it is their turn. When it is a siblings turn, then they need to wait until later if there is time or the next day. I hadn't realized that I need to speak to them all day. |
How do your children instinctually know how to speak maturely when their brains are still so immature?
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
1
|
|
amother
Apricot
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 12:48 pm
| nchr wrote: | | I understand. I just (apparently mistakenly) thought that silent treatment was just ignoring someone without end, but that it is fine to ignore someone if they are misbehaving. If my child is complaining, I never respond because I don't like complaining, but once s/he start speaking maturely, I respond. If my child has been punished in the corner and is asking me for water, I didn't know I should bring her/him water or say "you are being punished now." When my children are supposed to be in bed I don't communicate with them if they come out of bed, I just put them in bed. I didn't understand that is denying a basic human need. I speak to them during the day and usually, since DH and I both don't like idle conversation and prefer quiet (we have quiet seudas for example), I give each child 5 minutes to talk about what is on their minds. My kids over 6 know to make notes and bring us the notes to talk when it is their turn. When it is a siblings turn, then they need to wait until later if there is time or the next day. I hadn't realized that I need to speak to them all day. |
 see? Now you learned something new!
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
4
|
|
amother
Wheat
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 12:50 pm
| nchr wrote: | | I understand. I just (apparently mistakenly) thought that silent treatment was just ignoring someone without end, but that it is fine to ignore someone if they are misbehaving. If my child is complaining, I never respond because I don't like complaining, but once s/he start speaking maturely, I respond. If my child has been punished in the corner and is asking me for water, I didn't know I should bring her/him water or say "you are being punished now." When my children are supposed to be in bed I don't communicate with them if they come out of bed, I just put them in bed. I didn't understand that is denying a basic human need. I speak to them during the day and usually, since DH and I both don't like idle conversation and prefer quiet (we have quiet seudas for example), I give each child 5 minutes to talk about what is on their minds. My kids over 6 know to make notes and bring us the notes to talk when it is their turn. When it is a siblings turn, then they need to wait until later if there is time or the next day. I hadn't realized that I need to speak to them all day. |
Wow. This is heartbreaking. I can’t imagine allowing my kids only five minutes. One time I told my non stop talker six year old that mommy needs five minutes of quiet time. After a few seconds he asked me if five minutes had passed. I told him no, but if it’s important he can tell me. He said with a slightly sad face “it’s not that important, I just love talking to you so much.”
That was tbd last time I ever put any kind of limit on his talking. If it get too much I pop my noise canceling ear buds in and make sure to cover my ears with my snood so he doesn’t realize I’m not really hearing him.
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
8
|
|
amother
Saddlebrown
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 12:53 pm
| nchr wrote: | | I understand. I just (apparently mistakenly) thought that silent treatment was just ignoring someone without end, but that it is fine to ignore someone if they are misbehaving. If my child is complaining, I never respond because I don't like complaining, but once s/he start speaking maturely, I respond. If my child has been punished in the corner and is asking me for water, I didn't know I should bring her/him water or say "you are being punished now." When my children are supposed to be in bed I don't communicate with them if they come out of bed, I just put them in bed. I didn't understand that is denying a basic human need. I speak to them during the day and usually, since DH and I both don't like idle conversation and prefer quiet (we have quiet seudas for example), I give each child 5 minutes to talk about what is on their minds. My kids over 6 know to make notes and bring us the notes to talk when it is their turn. When it is a siblings turn, then they need to wait until later if there is time or the next day. I hadn't realized that I need to speak to them all day. |
Fascinating. My greatest source of pride is how much my children talk. And how they can talk to anyone. Anyone. An elderly person. Our rav. A baby. The cleaning lady.
I remember my son once breaking a platter accidentally. And I said " I really did love that platter. But I do love you more"
Next time that happened with another child he told the child "don't worry imma loves you more"
Or the time my son froze during the Chanukah show and afterward he told his morah "there were so many face looking at me. I couldn't sing." He was 3! BH
How else will you know them? If not to talk. Even when things are rough. Even when feelings are big. Especially then.
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
9
|
peacenine
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 12:56 pm
Thanks to this thread I started listening to Janet Lansbury's podcasts. I am trying to implement some of her conceps.
Today my 5yo dd was playing with one toy and my 2yo dd wanted to play with her. Dd5 didn't let her touch anything and dd2 got upset. I validated dd2 feelings and didn't comment on dd5s actions. 2 minutes later dd2 happily went to the next toy and started playing. Dd5 took away a part of the toy dd2 was getting busy with and again I validated dd2 feelings. Dd2 went to color with markers and all was good for a couple of minutes. Now dd5 wanted markets and dd2 didnt want to share. I validated dd5 and explained that she cannot grab away something that someone else is playing with you have to ask nicely. She said she can't ask nicely and I validated that it's hard to ask nicely sometimes. We discussed it for a few minutes and then dd2 offered her 2 markers. They both went on to coloring happily
I also realized that dd2 was ready for her nap and dd5 needed lunch.
Being that I'm only doing this a couple of days would love insight from more experienced gentle parenting moms. Am I implementing those concepts correctly? Anything I should do differently?
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
1
|
precious
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 12:58 pm
| nchr wrote: | | I understand. I just (apparently mistakenly) thought that silent treatment was just ignoring someone without end, but that it is fine to ignore someone if they are misbehaving. If my child is complaining, I never respond because I don't like complaining, but once s/he start speaking maturely, I respond. If my child has been punished in the corner and is asking me for water, I didn't know I should bring her/him water or say "you are being punished now." When my children are supposed to be in bed I don't communicate with them if they come out of bed, I just put them in bed. I didn't understand that is denying a basic human need. I speak to them during the day and usually, since DH and I both don't like idle conversation and prefer quiet (we have quiet seudas for example), I give each child 5 minutes to talk about what is on their minds. My kids over 6 know to make notes and bring us the notes to talk when it is their turn. When it is a siblings turn, then they need to wait until later if there is time or the next day. I hadn't realized that I need to speak to them all day. |
Wow. Do they speak to each other throughout the day?
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
4
|
|
amother
Gray
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 1:00 pm
| nchr wrote: | | I understand. I just (apparently mistakenly) thought that silent treatment was just ignoring someone without end, but that it is fine to ignore someone if they are misbehaving. If my child is complaining, I never respond because I don't like complaining, but once s/he start speaking maturely, I respond. If my child has been punished in the corner and is asking me for water, I didn't know I should bring her/him water or say "you are being punished now." When my children are supposed to be in bed I don't communicate with them if they come out of bed, I just put them in bed. I didn't understand that is denying a basic human need. I speak to them during the day and usually, since DH and I both don't like idle conversation and prefer quiet (we have quiet seudas for example), I give each child 5 minutes to talk about what is on their minds. My kids over 6 know to make notes and bring us the notes to talk when it is their turn. When it is a siblings turn, then they need to wait until later if there is time or the next day. I hadn't realized that I need to speak to them all day. |
Please, please don't do this.
Children need to talk and be heard. Imagine someone did this to their friend or spouse?
What happens when a child has something to tell you out of those 5 minutes?
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
6
|
nchr
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 1:06 pm
| precious wrote: | | Wow. Do they speak to each other throughout the day? |
Yes, we talk during the day. I just mean that they have a 5 minute designated time. DH and I are both not big talkers IRL. Our seudas are pretty quiet, but so were my childhood seudas and his as well. I think it is more of a nature. None of my children seem to need more, which is probably why another poster has a different reality with her children. DH and I also write notes to discuss important things with each other when we have a chance.
| |
|
| Back to top |
1
1
|
|
amother
OP
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 1:08 pm
| nchr wrote: | | I understand. I just (apparently mistakenly) thought that silent treatment was just ignoring someone without end, but that it is fine to ignore someone if they are misbehaving. If my child is complaining, I never respond because I don't like complaining, but once s/he start speaking maturely, I respond. If my child has been punished in the corner and is asking me for water, I didn't know I should bring her/him water or say "you are being punished now." When my children are supposed to be in bed I don't communicate with them if they come out of bed, I just put them in bed. I didn't understand that is denying a basic human need. I speak to them during the day and usually, since DH and I both don't like idle conversation and prefer quiet (we have quiet seudas for example), I give each child 5 minutes to talk about what is on their minds. My kids over 6 know to make notes and bring us the notes to talk when it is their turn. When it is a siblings turn, then they need to wait until later if there is time or the next day. I hadn't realized that I need to speak to them all day. |
 
You might not like hugs but you need them.
There is idle talk and then there is nonessential talk.
I see nonessential talk as so important even if it's not addressing an immediate issue. It allows people to get to know each other, to share and process ideas, to learn to relate to each other.
If you limit talk, you limit a relationship.
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
7
|
crust
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 1:13 pm
| nchr wrote: | | I understand. I just (apparently mistakenly) thought that silent treatment was just ignoring someone without end, but that it is fine to ignore someone if they are misbehaving. If my child is complaining, I never respond because I don't like complaining, but once s/he start speaking maturely, I respond. If my child has been punished in the corner and is asking me for water, I didn't know I should bring her/him water or say "you are being punished now." When my children are supposed to be in bed I don't communicate with them if they come out of bed, I just put them in bed. I didn't understand that is denying a basic human need. I speak to them during the day and usually, since DH and I both don't like idle conversation and prefer quiet (we have quiet seudas for example), I give each child 5 minutes to talk about what is on their minds. My kids over 6 know to make notes and bring us the notes to talk when it is their turn. When it is a siblings turn, then they need to wait until later if there is time or the next day. I hadn't realized that I need to speak to them all day. |
There's a lot of awareness in your post.
If we do something wrong, can we still talk to Hashem?
I understand a parent who, when watching a grown child on a downward spiral becomes mute or speechless.
I'm trying to think if I have ever heard this to be called an effective method of discipline.
All I can think of is that Shlomo Hamelech says עת לדבר ועת...
Or another thing comes to mind-
It says וידם אהרן- when the two sons of Aharon Hakohen died Aharon was so prepelxed he couldn't speak. There are a lot of pshatim on this but what we see that there is a time when people, even great people, are speechless.
The mishna also says סיג לחכמה שתיקה. But that's being silent.
Being silent is a good thing in chinuch. Ignoring is different. Ignoring is actively invalidating a human beings existence. It is not the same thing as being silent.
Ignoring a child as a form of punishment is a very painful thing and I have not heard it to be a Torah'dige thing.
If anyone has a source I would appreciate.
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
4
|
|
amother
Lilac
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 1:17 pm
|
One of The worst thing my dad ever did to me was silent treatment. Almost worse than all the other abuse.
| |
|
| Back to top |
1
3
|
Rachel Shira
|
Fri, Nov 20 2020, 1:40 pm
|
Nchr, I’m not saying there’s anything wrong with your quiet style. I’m pretty quiet myself and I’m sure your kids are used to it. But just to give you an idea of another parenting style, or maybe lifestyle, I find it natural to narrate my day to my (little) kids, ask them questions and have discussions about what we’re doing, ask for their opinions, sing songs, and teach them things. I think it gives them a rich vocabulary and understanding of language in addition to being a great way to connect with them and learn about them. I also think it’s important for kids to know that you’re really interested in what they have to say even when they’re young, and that it will hopefully translate to them coming to you to discuss important things when they’re older too.
| |
|
| Back to top |
0
8
|
|
Imamother may earn commission when you use our links to make a purchase.
© 2024 Imamother.com - All rights reserved
|  |
 |
|
 |
|
|
