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Vaccine conspiracy theory?

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Forum -> Children's Health -> Vaccinations

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amother

Gray

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:26 pm

amother [ Violet ] wrote:

My sister took it and is now hospitalized because of it. Don’t want to go into detail. But I would not get it so fast. She works in healthcare and didn’t get the virus so she went and took it. She is in the hospital now , since Shabbos with a very frightening situation and the doctors suspect it is a result of an autoimmune response to the vaccine. Doctors now advised her not to get the booster. It’s too dangerous for her.
Please say tehillim for Sarah bas Shayna

This is exactly my problem.
They don’t report these things to the public.
I’m very skeptical even though many people already took it safely.
The safety, effectiveness, etc. They’re hiding it all from us.

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amother

Lawngreen

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:28 pm

amother [ Chartreuse ] wrote:

So rude and callous! Her sister is in the hospital and you spew the term "anecdotal".

Anecdote as opposed to hard data. Which the CDC and the companies are collecting and investigating btw. There’s a vaccine check-in daily for a week after each dose and another check in a week after that. After every check in, there is a screen stating the CDC will call you if any information needs clarification.

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amother

Lawngreen

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:29 pm

amother [ Gray ] wrote:

This is exactly my problem.
They don’t report these things to the public.
I’m very skeptical even though many people already took it safely.
The safety, effectiveness, etc. They’re hiding it all from us.

The story of the doctor who died is public. This story will likely be public too.

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amother

Violet

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:30 pm

amother [ Lawngreen ] wrote:

So you mean ITP?

I guess it’s a form of ITP. Her body was not responding though to the usual treatment for ITP. Today there is a slight improvement but her hemoglobin dropped now.
This is the link to the article that discusses this topic. https://www.google.com/amp/s/w...../amp/
I’m not trying to discourage anyone from getting the vaccine . I have another sibling in healthcare who got the vaccine and he seems to be fine and is not concerned. Just stating my family’s reality right now and it made me decide not to get it if I have a choice.

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FranticFrummie

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:30 pm

amother [ Violet ] wrote:

I believe her case is being documented as there was a very similar situation in Florida with a doctor who’s body reacted the same way and he died. (It was in the news)
I will just say that she woke up Shabbos morning with blood pouring from her mouth, black and blue marks all over her body and petechiae all over her body. When she arrived to the hospital her blood platelets were at 3,000 (normal is between 150,000-450,000). It since dropped even lower. Her body was not initially responding to treatment either. Her mouth is full of blood pockets.
Im anon because her story will probably be pretty known.

Neutropenia can happen with just about any medication. There's no way to know in advance if you will have this reaction or not. Half the medications that I take every day list neutropenia as a possible, but rare, side effect.

Last edited by FranticFrummie on Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:41 pm; edited 1 time in total

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amother

Lawngreen

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:32 pm

amother [ Violet ] wrote:

I guess it’s a form of ITP. Her body was not responding though to the usual treatment for ITP. Today there is a slight improvement but her hemoglobin dropped now.
This is the link to the article that discusses this topic. https://www.google.com/amp/s/w...../amp/
I’m not trying to discourage anyone from getting the vaccine . I have another sibling in healthcare who got the vaccine and he seems to be fine and is not concerned. Just stating my family’s reality right now and it made me decide not to get it if I have a choice.

Can I ask you how many days after the vaccine she developed the symptoms?

amother

Violet

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:34 pm

amother [ Lawngreen ] wrote:

Can I ask you how many days after the vaccine she developed the symptoms?

10 days after she got the vaccine.

slimnglam

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:35 pm

I spoke to my cardiologist about it and he said although he himself got it, he would never allow his children or grandchildren to get the vaccine. That summed it up for me.

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amother

Lawngreen

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:38 pm

amother [ Violet ] wrote:

10 days after she got the vaccine.

I hope the hospital has been in touch with the CDC and the manufacturer. That sounds scary. Refuah sheleimah to her.

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amother

Oak

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:42 pm

So sorry about your sister! Refuah shleimah to her!

Ecru I totally agree with your posts it is so funny the first time I ever felt like hey did I write those!

Agree older people should get it but kids and grandkids as of now seems they can wait which they are doing as it is not available for them yet regardless
Wishing everyone health and happiness

Moshiach now!

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elsily

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:47 pm

Violet, how horrible and scary. Refuah shleimah

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amother

Chartreuse

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:50 pm

amother [ Lawngreen ] wrote:

Anecdote as opposed to hard data. Which the CDC and the companies are collecting and investigating btw. There’s a vaccine check-in daily for a week after each dose and another check in a week after that. After every check in, there is a screen stating the CDC will call you if any information needs clarification.

Using "anecdotal" is the same as invalidating her experience. That is the science of psychology.

Healthy health care workers don't mysteriously lose almost all their platelets mysteriously after a vaccine and it was just spontaneous coincidence.

Anecdotal scientifically only happens because of mathematics and rounding numbers. You will need to wait for the data to be aggregated to get "validation" for her.

Just like you do not say all the kidney failure, heart attacks, strokes etc from covid are anecdotal or coincidental or you have to wait for the scientists to prove it, it would be really kind and human to not call the vaccine reactions anecdotal.

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imasinger

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 7:59 pm

Anecdotal doesn't mean negation.

Violet, I think everyone here recognizes that what happened to your sister is scary and real. She should have a refuah sheleima.

My ex SIL, a cancer survivor with multiple risks, is now fighting for her life with Covid. Her experience is scary and real too.

What we have to do is understand the reasons behind the scary stories, the greater odds, and weigh the risks.

I know several epidemiologists in the US and EY, and they all say the vaccine is a lifesaver. I will absolutely get it. By the time they get around to people the age of my children, I hope we will have concrete and clear data about possible fertility risks. If they continue to be as minimal as they are now, I'll encourage my children to get it, too. But there's time.

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amother

Lawngreen

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 8:14 pm

amother [ Chartreuse ] wrote:

Using "anecdotal" is the same as invalidating her experience. That is the science of psychology.

Healthy health care workers don't mysteriously lose almost all their platelets mysteriously after a vaccine and it was just spontaneous coincidence.

Anecdotal scientifically only happens because of mathematics and rounding numbers. You will need to wait for the data to be aggregated to get "validation" for her.

Just like you do not say all the kidney failure, heart attacks, strokes etc from covid are anecdotal or coincidental or you have to wait for the scientists to prove it, it would be really kind and human to not call the vaccine reactions anecdotal.

No. Anecdote doesn’t mean invalidating her experience. It means the case needs to be researched to determine causation. For instance, the case of the doctor who died is still being investigated and as of now cannot be used for proof for anything. The experience for her was most certainly scary, but the reason the poster posted it is to connect it with the vaccine administration. That has not been determined if it is still being investigated. The connection between covid and strokes and heart attacks has already been established in the literature.

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amother

Violet

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 8:20 pm

amother [ Lawngreen ] wrote:

No. Anecdote doesn’t mean invalidating her experience. It means the case needs to be researched to determine causation. For instance, the case of the doctor who died is still being investigated and as of now cannot be used for proof for anything. The experience for her was most certainly scary, but the reason the poster posted it is to connect it with the vaccine administration. That has not been determined if it is still being investigated. The connection between covid and strokes and heart attacks has already been established in the literature.

I agree. The doctors themselves can’t say for sure yet, that this was the cause. But they ruled out everything else already and therefore they assume based on the fact that she had the vaccine and began symptoms 10 days afterward that this is an autoimmune response to the vaccine. But it’s too early in the game to be 100% sure.

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amother

Black

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 8:25 pm

amother [ Khaki ] wrote:

If you’re concerned about fertility, you should talk to your OB. Most here in the US are recommending it.

not for pregnant women. asked my ob today

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elsily

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 8:26 pm

Unfortunately covid-19 can cause ITP. This hematology group (American Society of Hematology) actually still recommends the covid vaccine for patients who have stable ITP.
https://www.hematology.org/cov.....d-itp

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amother

Khaki

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 8:27 pm

amother [ Black ] wrote:

not for pregnant women. asked my ob today

Yes, for pregnant women. The medical org for OBGYN has a statement about it.

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amother

Violet

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 8:28 pm

elsily wrote:

Unfortunately covid-19 can cause ITP. This hematology group (American Society of Hematology) actually still recommends the covid vaccine for patients who have stable ITP.
https://www.hematology.org/cov.....d-itp

Yes. That’s what my brother told me. He said that there are more cases so far with Covid causing low platelets than the vaccine so far. So it’s a hard decision to make.

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amother

Lawngreen

Tue, Jan 12 2021, 8:34 pm

elsily wrote:

Unfortunately covid-19 can cause ITP. This hematology group (American Society of Hematology) actually still recommends the covid vaccine for patients who have stable ITP.
https://www.hematology.org/cov.....d-itp

I’ve had several covid patients lately with severe thrombocytopenia requiring multiple transfusions. We ruled out heparin induced (HIT) and other causes.

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