Scared - will vaccine be required -

amother

Navy

Tue, Feb 16 2021, 2:15 am

amother [ White ] wrote:

From what I have read, there is not enough strong scientific evidence for public health officials to definitively state that those who are vaccinated can not spread the disease so it is far better to err on the side of caution.

I have read a lot about how viral load can impact whether one becomes infected and how severe the symptoms are which is why being masked in a well ventilated large space or outdoors where you pass an infected person for a short period of time is probably not going to infect you because you simply wouldn't have been in contact with enough viral particles.

There is now so much evidence that good masks worn by "spreaders" and "receivers" are almost as good as vaccines as preventing the spread of diseases. Not that I am suggesting that masks should be worn in lieu of being vaccinated but just that there are currently ways to help protect yourself and protect others just by masking and taking other precautions.

Once most people have been vaccinated, there would be statistically almost no spread among those who are vaccinated - the pandemic would have been conquered.

I got my first Moderna jab in January and am scheduled K/H for Wednesday for my second jab. And then two weeks from then I should have 95% immunity. I will continue to wear a mask because I think it is recommended and also because I think the optics of walking around without a mask are terrible and could potentially cause others who aren't vaccinated to use me as an example and feel that their being maskless is justified because others aren't.

I do think that there is going to be some form of digital passport showing vaccination status that will enable one to have access to various public forums like theaters or arenas or even simchas.

For me one difference will be that I won't feel that every move I make is potentially infectious. What if the exterior of my mask becomes contaminated and then I inadvertently touch it and then touch my eyes or face. I go crazy when I see people who are fiddling with their masks constantly Very Happy

The problem is that too many "spreaders" are anti-maskers. And the "receivers" masks don't work 100% - we need the "spreaders" to cooperate in order to prevent transmission. For the past year, they have REFUSED to cooperate.

Therefore, we need vaccines and we need laws mandating vaccines.

Had the "spreaders" cooperated a year ago, we would be out of this mess by now. Instead they caused mutations that are spreading more rapidly.

Actions have consequences.

HealthCoach

Tue, Feb 16 2021, 8:53 am

Quote:

The real problem is that Hydroxychloroquine was effective in treating corona when taken early, is much less experimental than the vaccines, and was not utilized due to politics. We do not have data on if a vaccine was even necessary.

Amarante

Tue, Feb 16 2021, 9:27 am

amother [ Navy ] wrote:

I don't disagree - just pointing out that until people are able to get vaccinated, there is increasing evidence that good masks protect the wearer and so people should make sure they are wearing the best masks they can get - and that they fit. There are devices and techniques that improve fit so there is less of a gap for the virus to sneak into LOL

It's not perfect but as the vaccine becomes available to everyone, not taking it will be a choice and if someone wants to leave themselves vulnerable to a dangerous disease which can result in death or possible long term health issues, that is their problem since they are endangering themselves.

I am all for mandating vaccines just as they mandated smallpox vaccines and other vaccines as a public health measure. Make it painful for people to choose not to be vaccinated by not permitting them access to schools and as many other places and things as is feasible to do. I think enforcing public health is a positive thing - at one time, NYC public schools required that all children provide proof they had been to a dentist every year - you had to bring in a form signed by a dentist that you had visited and then that necessary work had been completed. How many kids were saved from a lifetime of problems by this. No one objected because what responsible parent would object any more than they object to having a medical health forms submitted when you go to school.

Of course - and this is true of all people who don't vaccinate - they are also endangering vulnerable people who are not able to vaccinate because of legitimate medical conditions and for this reason I find their actions to be selfish - and yes I am judgmental about it because they are allowing their ignorance to endanger others and also relying on herd immunity in terms of thinking they or their family are protected since with widespread vaccination of any disease, it is unlikely they will personally encounter the virus.

wiki

Tue, Feb 16 2021, 10:48 am

Laiya wrote:

I will feel less nervous about the JNJ vaccine when it is approved as it does not use the mRNA technology.

Also keep in mind, nothing can be mandated before it's even approved.

So happy to hear this. I have long been wondering if my vaccine-skeptic relatives might be more willing to get Johnson & Johnson when it comes out. It's less effective of a vaccine, but it is based on much more traditional vaccine technology than Moderna and Pfizer.

If all of the "wait and see"-people and the "people who get Covid vaxes are sheeple"-people are willing to consider Johnson & Johnson, then that would be a huge victory for the world.

amother

Tue, Feb 16 2021, 10:52 am

HealthCoach wrote:

"Novavax’s subunit vaccine approach is a tried and true method for generating effective vaccines. Modern flu vaccines, HPV vaccines, and HepB vaccines all use a similar approach."

I don't think it's identical, but it is the closest to vaccines that were in use for years.

It would still be experimental because it's new, and we can't know the long term effects, but that would be my choice for my family, if opting out was not an option.

Closer than jnj?

HealthCoach

Tue, Feb 16 2021, 11:12 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q00lyd3gyy4

This video really really explains how Novovax works. Dr Mobeen Syed is in favor of all the covid vaccines and has videos of all of them. He explains why this vaccine is different, and most of people's objections to other covid vaccines do not apply to novovax (mRNA and DNA). You can check if he has a video on JNJ and AstraZeneca if you want. He mostly does these videos as the vaccines become available. Disclaimer: I got this info from my parents who watch these videos (I am not in favor of taking vaccines that did not have longer term testing)

I do have young adult children living at home who are convinced they need a vaccine, and I am much more ok with them taking this than the others.

amother

Navy

Tue, Feb 16 2021, 11:17 am

HealthCoach wrote:

There are so many problems with your post, not the least of which is the fact that hydroxychloroquine is only effective in the very first days after infection, but often not by the time a patient feels unwell; and in addition carries its own set of risks.

HealthCoach

Tue, Feb 16 2021, 11:36 am

Quote:

Yes, there would be education involved telling people that early treatment is essential. Early treatment is within first 5 days of symptoms, it doesn't include when people don't know they are sick. Perhaps there would be cases where this doesn't work, but it has been shown to be effective 84% of the time. Apparently around 2005 Fauci wrote a paper that said that hydroxychloroquine is a miracle drug, called it powerful like a vaccine, and it was now conveniently forgotton.

Countries that could not afford ventilators, hospitals, vaccines etc have a much lower death rate than us by using medications such as hydroxychloroquine.

If we would have used hydroxychloroquine, then perhaps we would now have a completely different perspective on an experimental vaccine.

southernbubby

Tue, Feb 16 2021, 6:22 pm

HealthCoach wrote:

Quote:

Do you have reliable links about HCQ in poor countries? I was afraid to try it because the virus itself put me into tachycardia.

southernbubby

Wed, Feb 17 2021, 12:28 pm

I tried to look up statistics for HCQ and Covid death rates in developing countries. Most articles written about these countries, are slanted in one way or the other and appear agenda related.

There was a study where all of the factors impacting death rates were weighed in and it appeared that HCQ given prophylactically or early in the course of the infection may have reduced death rates. There is basically a correlation in a population study rather than in actual drug trials.