No idea what do do!

amother

Seagreen

Sun, May 09 2021, 10:52 am

amother [ Periwinkle ] wrote:

While we are on the subject, do we ever know about the sanitary conditions in food establishments?
We assume that they are as clean as we are at home, but it's not necessarily true. Afaik, the hashgacha only checks for kashrus, not cleanliness

Yes and no.
Hashgacha won't necessarily check that pots/utensils are properly cleaned and employees are practicing proper sanitary protocols but they do care and check about bugs and rodents.

amother

Gray

Sun, May 09 2021, 11:05 am

Don't food establishments need to have periodic inspections by the Board of Health?
And it's not so simple to run a food business out of your home, you need inspections, a license, all sorts of health and safety regulations.
A situation like OP is describing sounds like it either not a legal business, or will be closed down at the next inspection. It's not a great job to be working for a business in either of those scenarios. OP, I'd recommend looking for another job ASAP.

DrMom

Sun, May 09 2021, 11:51 am

amother [ Seagreen ] wrote:

Yes and no.
Hashgacha won't necessarily check that pots/utensils are properly cleaned and employees are practicing proper sanitary protocols but they do care and check about bugs and rodents.

How are bugs and rodents not a kashrut issue?

Some mehadrin restaurants do not allow strawberries or broccoli because they claim you can't adequately check them for bugs, so how can it not be an issue for bugs to be crawling around the place where food is prepared?

Yuck.

amother

Seagreen

Sun, May 09 2021, 12:20 pm

DrMom wrote:

I specifically said they do check for bugs and rodents.

amother

Blue

Sun, May 09 2021, 12:55 pm

I once returned a loaf of bread to a bakery when I found a squished roach on the underside of the loaf.
I'm sure roaches are more common than anyone cares to believe, but a conscientious and resonsible owner would be using an exterminator, not pretending they're harmless.

amother

Copper

Sun, May 09 2021, 1:01 pm

I was waiting for a ride in front of a closed bakery once night. I saw mice running all around!! Lot of them! Although the bakery was not in my neighborhood, I had eaten food from there many times.As far as I know, baking was not done on premises, they brought in fresh bakery items each day to sell.

ora_43

Sun, May 09 2021, 1:03 pm

JMHO, I think I'd:

1. immediately start looking for another job. This is not a professional place, and the disgusting kitchen is sure to be just the tip of the iceberg. From what you say, your boss is already disrespecting you - ignoring your concerns about the dishes, getting mad at you for not wanting his kids underfoot (!!), just in general not treating you with professional respect. It just doesn't sound like a good place for you to be.

(I'm not saying you should quit. Stay, take the desperately needed money, and flee the second you're able.)

2. in the meantime, can you take responsibility for handling some cleanliness issues? Could you maybe boil water to deal with grease on dishes, spray for roaches, things like that? It shouldn't be your responsibility, but it might feel better, in terms of your own professional pride, than just watching the disaster unfold.

3. if you don't think you'd get fired for it, I would try one very blunt "I'm afraid that when there's a safety inspection, we're going to fail because of X, Y and Z issues." But if he wouldn't take it well, you don't owe him any additional warnings.

4. in the meantime, for the love of all that is good, do not recommend this place to anyone. I mean yeah, ask a rav about the wording, but don't give your friends the go-ahead to eat food that's come in contact with dirty dishes, cockroaches, and sick children.

amother

Sun, May 09 2021, 1:55 pm

ora_43, thank you for articulating what I've been thinking over the past few days.

I am for sure trying to find a new job right now.

My problem is myself. I care too much about being professional and doing the right thing. I can't just sit by and say "Oh well, it's not my business." I've been trying to keep my mouth shut, but it's not easy. It goes against my nature.

It's not like I want to be the boss, I just want to take pride in my work, even if I'm only a lowly sous chef.

amother

Copper

Sun, May 09 2021, 2:02 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

You deserve to work in better conditions. He’ll probably have his kids bread the chicken when you leave... not too many people would be happy working like that.
In my city, they only give a hechsher to a home business if they have a separate kitchen, not the family kitchen.

amother

Slategray

Sun, May 09 2021, 2:12 pm

amother [ Copper ] wrote:

In my city, they only give a hechsher to a home business if they have a separate kitchen, not the family kitchen.

In my city, too. I thought that was pretty standard. I mean, I knew someone who had a bakery at home, but it was in her basement, completely separate & she could only use it for her business if she wanted to get a hechsher. I don't know of anyone who has a formal business run out of their kitchen, both because of licensing regulations as well as having a hechsher.