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Why do girls need to be tznius?
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 6:48 pm
My daughter is special needs. She’s 11 but probably on a 2.5 year old level. She wears short sleeves and short skirts, no socks/tights etc.
My father told me she should be dressing tznius.

Why though? She looks like an 8 year old and has no concept of chinuch or tznius. She would happily walk around naked if I let her.

Is there a real reason or time that she would have to start strictly being tznius?
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amother




Dodgerblue
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 6:51 pm
Speak to your Rabbi about it.
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BrisketBoss




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 6:53 pm
I would say for reasons of human dignity, giving her as much of a normal life as you can, etc. as well as the standard reasons of halacha and community practice. Special needs children abide by the laws and customs of their families because they are part of the family.

You wouldn't really let her walk around naked.
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:03 pm
BrisketBoss wrote:
I would say for reasons of human dignity, giving her as much of a normal life as you can, etc. as well as the standard reasons of halacha and community practice. Special needs children abide by the laws and customs of their families because they are part of the family.

You wouldn't really let her walk around naked.


Obviously but does she need to cover her elbows or have her skirts cover her knees.
I don’t want her to look shlumpy and she’s dressed in a dignified way but not in the standard way the 11 year olds in my community dress.
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BrisketBoss




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:05 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Obviously but does she need to cover her elbows or have her skirts cover her knees.
I don’t want her to look shlumpy and she’s dressed in a dignified way but not in the standard way the 11 year olds in my community dress.


My opinion is she should conform to community standards unless it's too much of a burden for some reason.
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amother




Eggplant
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:05 pm
Why wouldn't you want her to be dressed the other girls her age?
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amother




Red
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:07 pm
If your community doesn't expose elbows and knees for her dignity I would cover it. But it's really not required before 12 so I would start then. If it's hard to keep her knees covered put on leggings or tights under her skirts.
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GLUE




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:12 pm
amother [ Dodgerblue ] wrote:
Speak to your Rabbi about it.


This!!
Does your daughter have a problem dressing tznius? If yes then ask your Rabbi about how she should dress.
If your daughter does not have a problem dressing tznius, why not?

Do you have a problem getting her into tznius clothes? Ask your Rabbi how should dress.
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:15 pm
amother [ Eggplant ] wrote:
Why wouldn't you want her to be dressed the other girls her age?


Because I want her to look cute and when skirts cover her knees she just looks shlumpy and in the summer she would just look like a sweaty mess.
She has tons of girls offering to take care of her because she’s dressed super cute.
She doesn’t look or act like the girls her age and it’s hard to even imagine a 11 year old girl is the same age as her.
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amother




Aconite
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:15 pm
amother [ Dodgerblue ] wrote:
Speak to your Rabbi about it.


This. Talk to your Rav. In my chassidish community, not everyone dresses their special needs kids according to community standards. Many kids can't handle having too much clothing on.
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BrisketBoss




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:19 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Because I want her to look cute and when skirts cover her knees she just looks shlumpy and in the summer she would just look like a sweaty mess.
She has tons of girls offering to take care of her because she’s dressed super cute.
She doesn’t look or act like the girls her age and it’s hard to even imagine a 11 year old girl is the same age as her.


Oh, I think I see.

What about wearing cute dresses/jumpers instead of skirts?
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PinkFridge




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:23 pm
amother [ OP ] wrote:
Because I want her to look cute and when skirts cover her knees she just looks shlumpy and in the summer she would just look like a sweaty mess.
She has tons of girls offering to take care of her because she’s dressed super cute.
She doesn’t look or act like the girls her age and it’s hard to even imagine a 11 year old girl is the same age as her.


They'll still take her if she's not dressed super cute. If that's what you end up doing. Hatzlacha!
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amother




OP
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:25 pm
PinkFridge wrote:
They'll still take her if she's not dressed super cute. If that's what you end up doing. Hatzlacha!


They probably won’t 🙈 I don’t blame them- they’re high school girls but I see who gets extra care and offers. I happen to be a trendy young mother and my daughter is dressed really well but the kids that aren’t don’t get the same treatment…
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amother




Red
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:27 pm
As someone who volunteered with special kids as a teen, it wasn't about their clothing. It was about which parents and kids were easy to work with. The parents that treated the teens badly didn't get as many offers as the parents that were nice and pleasant to work with.
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amother




Pansy
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:28 pm
Please make sure she's wearing leggings under these skirts, or decent-length bike shorts in the summer. It's for her dignity. I know some special needs young women who need to wear pants. Again ask a rav about it all.

She's going to hit puberty in the next few years, most likely on schedule despite the delay of her mental development. You will need to adapt then. If she's sensory at all, you may want to start getting her used to things she will need then (including shorts or leggings or pants.) And once she starts to develop, she will need to dress a bit older. But it sounds like you have some time.

As a fellow special needs mom, I understand the benefits of a kid being cute- it can affect the level of services you get. Once my kid grew out of cute, though, I had to start dressing him age appropriate. Because if I didn't, he was treated as below his functioning level by professionals and people in general, and young people were more put off by him.
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amother




Amethyst
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:29 pm
Only someone who has a SN child can understand tis need. My mother always wanted my brother to look cute and young. He is 40 now. She makes sure his beard is shaved with short neat payos. and she will not dress him in suits or a hat.
I understand her.
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amother




Charcoal
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:35 pm
I understand you, OP. I also have a special needs child.

My son wears tzitzis, for example. Does he need it or understand it? No. Sometimes it looks shlumpy but I remind myself that there are so few mitzvos my son is capable of, isn’t it wonderful for him to have one on his record he doesn’t have to think about?

Same with tznius. It’s a freebie!
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PinkFridge




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:36 pm
amother [ Amethyst ] wrote:
Only someone who has a SN child can understand tis need. My mother always wanted my brother to look cute and young. He is 40 now. She makes sure his beard is shaved with short neat payos. and she will not dress him in suits or a hat.
I understand her.


Does he have wants?
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amother




Amethyst
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 7:41 pm
PinkFridge wrote:
Does he have wants?

He wants to stay indoors all day and watch tv or videos. But my point was that I understand OP. Sometimes sn children look more put together in certain clothing and they have enough to deal with and don’t need to look shlumpy. Also many times they can’t stand certain materials or sleeve lengths.
but let’s not continue about my brother because this is not my post.
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PinkFridge




 
 
 
 

Post Mon, Oct 18 2021, 8:20 pm
amother [ Amethyst ] wrote:
He wants to stay indoors all day and watch tv or videos. But my point was that I understand OP. Sometimes sn children look more put together in certain clothing and they have enough to deal with and don’t need to look shlumpy. Also many times they can’t stand certain materials or sleeve lengths.
but let’s not continue about my brother because this is not my post.


Got it. She's dressing him for his comfort, along with making sure he's presentable.
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