S/O OTD and insular community

amother

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 1:52 pm

I did not want to derail the other thread, but I’m curious what relatives the OTD teen stays with? Do they stay with “not frum” family(ie MO - I am MO, and I consider myself frum, I am by no means saying that MO is not frum), do they stay with Grandparents who don’t have kids at home, aunts who live in a different community and it is now a chessed instead of a poor reflection?
I’m curious and trying to understand how the system works?
Not judging the wonderful person who takes them in. (Definitely not judging, I think whoever it is is awesome, but maybe judging the system where people feel forced to kick their kids out for wearing jeans)

amother

Cyan

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:00 pm

I have a relative who paid someone money to take in his child. Another chassidish family with no children home. His son never knew he paid them, just thought he was kicked out. He paid rabonim and therapists to help the child as well. Paid for his wedding without anyone knowing. It worked out. All of the younger children stayed the way my relative wanted and this one son became frummer than when he was thrown out (but not as frum as his parents), is chassidish just follows a different derech. He doesn't speak to his son but knows he is keeping the Torah and feels it is a success.

Zehava

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:06 pm

amother [ Cyan ] wrote:

I have a relative who paid someone money to take in his child. Another chassidish family with no children home. His son never knew he paid them, just thought he was kicked out. He paid rabonim and therapists to help the child as well. Paid for his wedding without anyone knowing. It worked out. All of the younger children stayed the way my relative wanted and this one son became frummer, is chassidish just follows a different derech. He doesn't speak to his son but knows he is keeping the Torah and feels it is a success.

Exhibit A on traumatizing your child for life on the altar of religion. Shameful and disgusting.

amother

Antiquewhite

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:09 pm

amother [ Cyan ] wrote:

I have a relative who paid someone money to take in his child. Another chassidish family with no children home. His son never knew he paid them, just thought he was kicked out. He paid rabonim and therapists to help the child as well. Paid for his wedding without anyone knowing. It worked out. All of the younger children stayed the way my relative wanted and this one son became frummer, is chassidish just follows a different derech. He doesn't speak to his son but knows he is keeping the Torah and feels it is a success.

How is this a positive thing? Why couldn't he have a relationship with his child? This is not a success in my book.

amother

Cyan

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:10 pm

amother [ Antiquewhite ] wrote:

How is this a positive thing? Why couldn't he have a relationship with his child? This is not a success in my book.

Because the child is not as frum as he wants and follows a different derech and he didn't want it to impact his other children. But he still grew up to stay frum and has a family. That's a success for some when he was at risk of not before.

Stars

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:11 pm

amother [ Cyan ] wrote:

I have a relative who paid someone money to take in his child. Another chassidish family with no children home. His son never knew he paid them, just thought he was kicked out. He paid rabonim and therapists to help the child as well. Paid for his wedding without anyone knowing. It worked out. All of the younger children stayed the way my relative wanted and this one son became frummer, is chassidish just follows a different derech. He doesn't speak to his son but knows he is keeping the Torah and feels it is a success.

Why doesn’t he speak to his son? How is that considered successful?

amother

Cyan

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:12 pm

Stars wrote:

Why doesn’t he speak to his son? How is that considered successful?

That's the cost of him keeping his son frum. His son doesn't know how he paid for him to stay by people, paid for his therapy and chasuna and paid for him to get his first job.

amother

Antiquewhite

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:13 pm

amother [ Cyan ] wrote:

It definitely impacted his other children.

And that this child stayed frum is in spite of his father's actions, not due to his actions.

This is so disturbing and painful to read.

imorethanamother

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:22 pm

Wow. He’s still frum. He’s chassidishe. Just follows a “different derech”? Are we back in the 1800s? He’s satmar instead of gerrer?

How strict are this man’s standards that he won’t talk to his son for the rest of his life?

Zehava

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:24 pm

amother [ Cyan ] wrote:

It’s that twisted view of “success” that has resulted in generations of suffering. It goes against the basic instincts of being a parent.

Zehava

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:25 pm

imorethanamother wrote:

Oh the 1800s were gold compared to this. In the 1800s you were happy if your child kept shabbos and knew how to read Hebrew.

Stars

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:27 pm

amother [ Cyan ] wrote:

That's the cost of him keeping his son frum. His son doesn't know how he paid for him to stay by people, paid for his therapy and chasuna and paid for him to get his first job.

That is so twisted.

amother

Chambray

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:28 pm

Zehava wrote:

Exhibit A on traumatizing your child for life on the altar of religion. Shameful and disgusting.

Your judgement is uncalled for. May you never know such pain. You have young kids. Daven that you are never faced with this. It’s all easy to talk in theory, when it’s your own child it’s not as simple.

May we all see nachas from our children

tp3

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:28 pm

amother [ Cyan ] wrote:

Why couldn't he tell him he's covering his expenses?
Why make him feel like he's kicked out?
Sorry I'm not relating to this.

imorethanamother

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:31 pm

Zehava wrote:

It’s that twisted view of “success” that has resulted in generations of suffering. It goes against the basic instincts of being a parent.

I would guess that the mother likely doesn’t agree with this approach. The whole family might be held hostage by the father’s intransigent behavior. I guess at least the father was willing to try and help behind the scenes - I really want to be dan lekaf zechus here, but these prevailing attitudes make me so very sad.

Zehava

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:33 pm

amother [ Chambray ] wrote:

It’s very simple. Extremely.
Let me explain it in extremely simple terms.
You chose to have a child. You don’t, at any point get to decide that the person you helped create is no longer your child. You don’t get to throw money at the problem and absolve yourself of a relationship.
Your child comes before your specific brand of religion or your view of how they should keep it.
If you cannot commit to that, do the world a favor and keep it in your pants.
That is all.
I’d be happy for you to check in with me in any number of years to test my “theories”.
I daven that I see nachas from myself as a parent. I daven that I succeed in being the parent my children deserve.

amother

Pear

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:33 pm

amother [ Chambray ] wrote:

But you yourself don’t have a child like this, so why are you on this thread? I do, and I find this behavior gross. And your “theory” about throwing kids out for the good of… I don’t know. You? Maybe your definition of nachas is different than ours.

amother

Antiquewhite

Sun, Nov 28 2021, 2:34 pm

amother [ Chambray ] wrote:

No. I have teens and adult children. One is OTD and another chose a different path of yiddishkeit. It is very simple. This is not what being a parent is about. This is all about himself and his ego and has nothing to do with Hashem or his son.