Help for women with financially irresponsible husbands

Log in / Sign Up

List of Forums + New Post Recipe Box Usergroups Following My Posts Bookmarks

Private Messages Advanced Search Rules New User Guide FAQ Advertise Contact Us

Forum -> Household Management -> Finances

Previous 1 2 3 4 5 Next

View latest: 24h 48h 72h

amother

Mon, Dec 20 2021, 2:14 pm

amother [ Arcticblue ] wrote:

I had a similar situation about a year ago. I also knew for a while that I should open my own acct and not give him access to it but I wasn't ready to believe it. And then I got a large unexpected payment that we needed desperately for basics and he used it all without telling me. I immediately opened my own account.

He's furious but it's his own fault. He showed me so many times that I can't trust him with our money, but he doesn't want to believe it.

Thank you for sharing that

I'm like you. Knowing he's not trustworthy but always hoping things will get better and work out somehow.

amother

Midnight

Mon, Dec 20 2021, 2:26 pm

Dearest OP

As someone who understands you too well I unfortunately gained the right to respond to this thread.
Im not on IMA often but I guess it was meant to be that I chanced upon this thread today.

My situation is quite similar and I did a double take when I read your thread. I have never met another wife of a tzedaka addict, and sometimes I feel like I must be the only human struggling with this.

Here are a few things I have done to protect myself and family, perhaps you will find some tips helpful to you.

#1 I try to internalize that this isn't a financial issue this is an addiction at worst or terrible disfunction at best, and dragging my husband to mesila, therapy and who knows where else wont help (btdt). Just like with any other addiction they need to reach rock bottom and realize they need help or else.

#2 I try to get support from trusted friends and family members even if it means divulging my dirty secrets. But most of all I get support from a therapist. (this is crucial, I hope you find somebody to support you)

#3 The only way I am able to survive this is by completely separating my finances and giving him ZERO control. I work, and put all the money into bank accounts that he has no access to. Everything is on my name and I pay all the bills. I locked all accounts in the local grocery, fruit store meat store and have requested that no account be opened under the house tel # or my cell phone. (he has opened accounts under his cell # but then they badger him, not me.)

#4 All our documents (my kids and mine) are locked away in a safe out of the house.

He calls me abusive and controlling and yes I often need to remind myself that I need to do this for my kids survival and mine. Yes I live with guilt and wish things were different.

This is far from an easy undertaking, but personally I was threatened with eviction had the heat shut.... one time too many. This way is the better of two evils IMO.
It took me getting to rock bottom to realize that if I rely on him we will live in the streets literally.

Ill just add, that my husband works and earns a respectable sum of money of which NONE of it makes its way home, and as far as I know hes at least $150k in debt. He claims its for tzedaka but who knows; I certainly find it easier not to.

BH Hashem has been good to me. He has always been on my side, as he will be on yours.

And if you aren't in this situation I kindly ask you in the theme of op not to make suggestions along the line of reading books like "surrendered wife". Please understand we want nothing more than to surrender but Hashem has a different path for us.
Taking less responsibility, doesn't work 100% of the time. It works in healthy relationships, with healthy people.
OP I wish I had better advice on how to make it work in a way that builds a marriage, but I dont. Either way I wish you much Hatzlacha and strength. As you can see you are not alone, and I hope that brings you some measure of comfort.

loveraizy

Mon, Dec 20 2021, 2:31 pm

amother [ OP ] wrote:

It's not something I have koach to write out.

We used to have a very good ruv my husband trusted and he saved us many times.
He passed away from COVID last year.
I don't have anyone else.

where do you live , I may be able to refer you to someone

amother

Midnight

Mon, Dec 20 2021, 2:34 pm

amother [ Daphne ] wrote:

I grew up in a household like this. My father took zero responsibility for the finances, spent lavishly, and didn't work. My mother cried constantly and was beside herself. She couldn't function and it was so traumatic for us kids. She had a high earning job but it was spent before it even hit the bank. People would bang our door down to collect on their loans. Gemachs and credit cards were maxed out. The IRS sent threatening letters. Our house foreclosed and utilities were shut down.

One day something snapped. I don't know what but she made a 180 change.

She filed bankruptcy and got on a payment plan for back taxes. She froze her credit and all the kids credit. She hid all our important documents at a friend's house. She opened a new account in just her name and used a friend's address so no documentation came to our house. From that account she would pay rent for our apartment after the house foreclosed, food, clothing, utilities. Because she had a good job we were ok for basics even on one salary and paying backtaxes. Any creditors who weren't taken care of by the bankruptcy and all tuition and tzedakah requests were directed to my father.

The yelling and craziness went through the roof when he realized he was cut off. He threw things, broke things, yelled, cursed, threatened for months. I don't know where my mother got the strength but she just would cry and say she wishes she had the money but the IRS took everything. It was a lie but it was the right thing to do. Eventually he directed his shenanigans to other people since she was a dried out resource.

It's certainly not perfect. Their credit is still destroyed and they lost the house and some gemachs and schools never will get paid but at least we lived like semi menchen and had what to eat.

My mother also made sure that every one of us knew her story so we wouldn't fall into this trap.

I hope this is helpful for you. Even though it's not my husband, I did grow up with this and know how hard it is.

Thank you for sharing your story. It gave me strength.

amother

Mon, Dec 20 2021, 2:44 pm

amother [ Midnight ] wrote:

Dearest OP

As someone who understands you too well I unfortunately gained the right to respond to this thread.
Im not on IMA often but I guess it was meant to be that I chanced upon this thread today.

My situation is quite similar and I did a double take when I read your thread. I have never met another wife of a tzedaka addict, and sometimes I feel like I must be the only human struggling with this.

Here are a few things I have done to protect myself and family, perhaps you will find some tips helpful to you.

#1 I try to internalize that this isn't a financial issue this is an addiction at worst or terrible disfunction at best, and dragging my husband to mesila, therapy and who knows where else wont help (btdt). Just like with any other addiction they need to reach rock bottom and realize they need help or else.

#2 I try to get support from trusted friends and family members even if it means divulging my dirty secrets. But most of all I get support from a therapist. (this is crucial, I hope you find somebody to support you)

#3 The only way I am able to survive this is by completely separating my finances and giving him ZERO control. I work, and put all the money into bank accounts that he has no access to. Everything is on my name and I pay all the bills. I locked all accounts in the local grocery, fruit store meat store and have requested that no account be opened under the house tel # or my cell phone. (he has opened accounts under his cell # but then they badger him, not me.)

#4 All our documents (my kids and mine) are locked away in a safe out of the house.

He calls me abusive and controlling and yes I often need to remind myself that I need to do this for my kids survival and mine. Yes I live with guilt and wish things were different.

This is far from an easy undertaking, but personally I was threatened with eviction had the heat shut.... one time too many. This way is the better of two evils IMO.
It took me getting to rock bottom to realize that if I rely on him we will live in the streets literally. (I will never forget the day I reached rock bottom. I had to show up in court, for an eviction threat and beg the judge to give us more time. My husband didnt come of course, buy my newborn one week old baby did, we shlepped with the train and sat in court with a bunch of soon to be homeless people.... It was an awful period of my life, and taking full financial responsibility is easier for me than living in fear of not being able to feed your kids.)

Ill just add, that my husband works and earns a respectable sum of money of which NONE of it makes its way home, and as far as I know hes at least $150k in debt. He claims its for tzedaka but who knows; I certainly find it easier not to.

BH Hashem has been good to me. He has always been on my side, as he will be on yours.

And if you aren't in this situation I kindly ask you in the theme of op not to make suggestions along the line of reading books like "surrendered wife". Please understand we want nothing more than to surrender but Hashem has a different path for us.
Taking less responsibility, doesn't work 100% of the time. It works in healthy relationships, with healthy people.
OP I wish I had better advice on how to make it work in a way that builds a marriage, but I dont. Either way I wish you much Hatzlacha and strength. As you can see you are not alone, and I hope that brings you some measure of comfort.

Thank you so much for sharing your story.

It does give me strength.

I did hit rock bottom in the sense of knowing that he isn't going to get better and I cannot simply work harder to bring in more money. I have reached my physical and mental limit and I need to start respecting myself.

Just knowing that this is what I need to do gives me clarity and strength.

amother

Midnight

Mon, Dec 20 2021, 2:51 pm

YES! You are worthy of respect.
Daven to Hashem, I totally and fully rely on him. I talk to him all the time, it helps me feel less alone and less burdened. AND Bh I can say he really has come through!
He can help you earn more money without putting in more hours.
Just put out there what you need, and watch doors open up.
I have found it helpful to read books on Emunah & bitochon, postive thinking and learning about having an abundant mindset.
Its Hashem who has access to all the money in the world.
And he truly has your back.

Momafewx

Mon, Dec 20 2021, 3:50 pm

I'm bracing myself because everyone gonna hate on this: try The empowered wife, Laura Doyle. It's the only approach that actually works AND restores respect and intimacy in your marriage.

amother

Mulberry

Mon, Dec 20 2021, 4:01 pm

Momafewx wrote:

I'm bracing myself because everyone gonna hate on this: try The empowered wife, Laura Doyle. It's the only approach that actually works AND restores respect and intimacy in your marriage.

I'm sure it cures addicts and addictions

amother

Daphne

Mon, Dec 20 2021, 4:20 pm

Momafewx wrote:

I'm bracing myself because everyone gonna hate on this: try The empowered wife, Laura Doyle. It's the only approach that actually works AND restores respect and intimacy in your marriage.

I actually do think that Laura Doyle has some good advice. In a normal marriage or in a marriage with a somewhat difficult or macho husband her advice can work wonders.

It does not however work in situations where the husband is an addict or abusive.

My father literally could not stop spending. He would just buy and buy. Donate and donate. Invest and invest. He had justifications and good reasons for everything. He really truly believed he made sense and was gonna make it big and my mother was the big bad witch who was stopping him from providing for his family like the millionaire that he was. He could not see the truth. It was an illness. It needed medical help. My mother couldnt provide that help but at least she was able to stop enabling him. He went and mooched off other people after she stopped but at least she protected herself and us.

amother

Midnight

Mon, Dec 20 2021, 5:01 pm

Momafewx wrote:

I'm bracing myself because everyone gonna hate on this: try The empowered wife, Laura Doyle. It's the only approach that actually works AND restores respect and intimacy in your marriage.

Wont hate on you. It is a fantastic book that has improved many marriages.
But if you tried it and it worked for you, know that you are blessed.

amother

Mon, Dec 20 2021, 5:04 pm

amother [ Midnight ] wrote:

Wont hate on you. It is a fantastic book that has improved many marriages.
But if you tried it and it worked for you, know that you are blessed.

Every system or method out there will work for some people and not for others.

Take whatever seems to work for you. But in my case, trying to give over responsibility to him in hopes that he will wake up and be an adult doesn't work. It just means everyone suffers.

I don't like it, I can scream and fight against it and refuse to accept it but that's my reality.

I surrender to Hashem. Not to anyone else.

amother

Buttercup

Tue, Dec 21 2021, 12:51 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

It's not something I have koach to write out.

But you get to the point where you give up thinking long term and just try to get through the next day or week.
When you've reached out to people but nobody can really fix it or figure out. Everyone thinks it's easy and simple. Why don't you just... People who have responsible hardworking husbands just don't get it.
Well, I want to stay married.
I want peace of mind.
I don't want screaming and fights all day.
I have a heavy load of responsibility already
So now I also have to be his mental health specialist? Run around to therapists and try to convince him to see someone?
He thinks he's a tzadik full of eminah and bituchen and I have a problem.
We used to have a very good ruv my husband trusted and he saved us many times.
He passed away from COVID last year.
I don't have anyone else.

Sorry, OP. It sounds so tough.
I'm sorry about the loss of your Rav too.

Maybe try Gam-Anon? It's a 12 step program for families of gamblers. Even if your husband is strictly not a gambler (BH!), Gam-Anon may still help you as a support network, or they may be able to direct you to an organization that's more suitable for you.

Sending you blessings for hatzlacha, financial stability and abundance, and shalom bayis and joy.

amother

Buttercup

Tue, Dec 21 2021, 1:07 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

It sounds intriguing but I don’t see links to any practical tips.

12 step programs are amazing! You won't find easy simple fixes, but you'll find valuable solutions and a support network of people dealing with the same issue who can offer experience, strength, and hope (as they say in 12 step programs). I did not explore the site, but if there are links for meetings I strongly encourage you to attend the meetings. 12 step programs start with surrender to Gd and build on that. It sounds from your posts that you've already started in this direction. This may be a very good fit for you.

amother

Hyacinth

Tue, Dec 21 2021, 2:30 am

Momafewx wrote:

I'm bracing myself because everyone gonna hate on this: try The empowered wife, Laura Doyle. It's the only approach that actually works AND restores respect and intimacy in your marriage.

This book IS NOT FOR ADDICTION. This book is not meant for couples dealing with addiction, financial abuse etc. If he was "a little irresponsible" or not frugal enough then maybe. But she should not enable his addiction by surrendering the finances to him!
Would you give a heroin addict free reign to your money? It's an addiction just the same.

amother

Firethorn

Tue, Dec 21 2021, 2:52 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Now that I'm in a bit of a better place I want to share what precipitated this thread.

About 2 months ago I got a large bonus from work. It could have really helped us and served as a cushion for the rest of the year. I knew in the back of my mind that leaving it in the checking account was not a good idea and I had to figure out what to do with it. It was on my to do list but I just wasn't ready to deal with it.

And then I woke up one morning and it was all gone. Our account was below zero. And of course he was unwilling to accept any responsibility or accountability. He blamed me because I bought new dining chairs (only 10% of the money, and we needed new chairs for years.)

I have not even looked at the bank statement to see where all the money went. I can't bring myself to.

I'm going to take more control from this point on but I still feel so stupid for not doing this earlier before the money was gone. I knew it would happen and just wasn't ready to take action.

I'm trying not to dwell on it or look backwards. Looking back is like falling into a huge black hole.

Are you me? can we be friends, this is literally the story of my life!

And I'm getting more and more scared reading through this thread

amother

Firethorn

Tue, Dec 21 2021, 2:54 am

amother [ Arcticblue ] wrote:

Yes, yes and yes!!! This happened too many times to count

Teomima

Tue, Dec 21 2021, 3:11 am

My dh used to get into huge debts. I kept my own account, paid all the bills including utilities and mortgage, off my account, so no matter what dh got himself in to at least we wouldn't be cold, homeless, or hungry. It meant I had to work more than I wanted but it's what had to be done.

But from what I can understand things are different for you, OP. I'm sorry, I don't know who can help you if he's not willing to curb his spending.

Aurora

Tue, Dec 21 2021, 9:07 am

I am, thank God, in a different situation.

However, what you are describing is not "irresponsible", it is financial abuse - using money as a way of being controlling. And yes,he should absolutely change, especially if you wish to avoid eviction and all other kinds of problems. Unfortunately, I don't see him getting better in this regard.

You deserve better.

Project SARAH helps with abuse. Please give them a try? 973-777-7638 ext. 643

amother

Junglegreen

Tue, Dec 21 2021, 9:43 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

Yeah, these are exactly the type of unhelpful comments ppl tend to get if they post on I'ma about these problems.

That's why I really need a specialist to talk to who understands how to navigate these situations.

OP, I know the advice to take control of the money (take away credit cards, open your own account and transfer money) feels unhelpful, and you're thinking - I wish it were that easy.

But as someone who has btdt (not tzedakah, it was something else) I can say that it's the only thing that's going to work. As hard as it is, you MUST have full control of the money. Even if he cries, kicks and screams, it's too bad. And believe me, you can't imagine how many years I tried to run away from this truth. I even tried the Empowered Wife (it was called The Surrendered Wife then) because I so badly wanted for it to work. Well, we just finished paying off the last of his debt last year, with our stimulus money. This was from 10 years ago, so it took a while. This is why, ladies, PLEASE DON'T recommend this book to those of us in this situation. It may work in a tiny percentage, but it's just not worth the risk. I'm really angry that we got into this deep financial hole, and it took too many years to get out. Don't do this to yourself.

amother

Anemone

Tue, Dec 21 2021, 11:07 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

This has been my approach and it works. I have my money go to a separate account. My husband is responsible for rent. I'm responsible for utilities, tuition, and insurance. Everything else is split. He knows that I cover my responsibilities and he was forced to grow up a little and learn how to cover his. b"H by him it was mostly a complete lack of understanding how the world works and I was able to drill it into him.

Page 4 of 5

Previous 1 2 3 4 5 Next