Older woman picking on me for showing up at kiddush

amother

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 4:56 am

amother [ Melon ] wrote:

Some wont say anything, but its noticed.

I love the creepy passive voice Orwellian Big Brother "IT IS NOTICED." Having read this thread, it's likely that every shul has one angry, bitter and cantankerous grump who makes it their job to "NOTICE" everything s/he deems necessary to be "NOTICED" -- rather than just enjoying their Shabbos.

amother

Ivory

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 5:10 am

Yes Op! I think you hit the nail on the head. Why would we ever get down to that lowest possible common denominator. No thanks! Why would I or anyone give someone else that power over me? to decide what is ok or to ruin my enjoyment in the way you describe Op...as for the orwellian reference um ya since when is it up to everyone else to control everyone else blech criticism and judgement ugh
Radiate joy!

amother

Pansy

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 5:11 am

I think it's very nice for Kidd to come jfk. It develops a positive attitude toward shul.

When I do it, I try to get there for the last five minutes s of the dsvening so I can say ameins and amein yehei shmei rabba from the doorway. That way it elevates my day and time at shul.

But OP, my recommendation is to just ignore the woman, smile, and move away from her.

For the poster who wondered, fress means to pig out.

amother

Black

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 5:19 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

thanks for all the great advice.

it's quite fascinating that basically two people in this entire thread live in an alternative universe that is totally contrary to reality. this thread is really confirming to me that every shul probably does have one bitter and angry old woman sitting around judging who deserves and doesnt deserve to be at the kiddush.

others have correctly tore this post apart, but nobody pointed out that it's not "free food." people are paying for shul memberships, giving donations to the shul, sponsoring kiddush for their simchas, etc. the idea that JFK people are schnorrers taking "free food" is a really dangerous assumption. you don't know who is donating lots of money to the shul. try not to judge things you know absolutely nothing about.

I live in a community where it is fine to come JFK. But I have to say your post comes across a little strong, like this woman really hit a nerve. I wonder why.

mommy3b2c

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 5:41 am

amother [ Magenta ] wrote:

I'm not that lady, but I'll be the voice of dissent. Not that I think this woman is doing the right thing; she's not. But I'll admit to resenting people who show up JFK (just for kiddush.) If your shul doesn't accommodate babies, don't go. Unless there's a simcha and the baalei hasimcha have invited people, and the purpose is for people to wish them mazal tov, why are you coming to shul JFK? What are you accomplishing? I could understand if you came in at the tail end of mussaf because your young child can't sit quietly for much longer than Aleinu and Adon Olam, then you were in shul to daven briefly and stayed for kiddush. Fine. But shuls need worshippers to fill the seats, not people coming for kiddush. It really makes a poor impression if you never daven there and always show up for kiddush.

The fact that you think about this or care says a lot about you. And not in good way.

mommy3b2c

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 5:43 am

MrsDash wrote:

Respond by talking about something else entirely and incoherent, not acknowledging her loaded insults. Then casually walk away, even if she's talking, or more likely, speechless and confused.

For example:

"I would have arrived earlier, but I have explosive diarrhea, and we ran out of toilet paper."

P.S. I've used this line before, in real life.

I LOVE You!! ❤️💕

Lady A

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 5:46 am

amother [ Melon ] wrote:

OP - May I ask - Do you pay shul annual membership?

From what I have seen, some who dont pay membership, also bring kids for Kiddush only
Free food.

it doesnt look good.

If you want community social over food, which is very nice, why dont you host in your apt/ house shabbos afternnon get together and prepare platters/ salads for the ladies?
We would all love to join!

Host ladies w young kids your kids age? for example. Refreshments by hostess.

Host a SEUDA shlishi ,you buy the food and have a nice social?

There are some who prefer others should buy, prepare, pay, and they come to eat. (and bring other family members to join)

Some wont say anything, but its noticed.

I have seen someone who came with a backpack and packs food Kidush cakes. She is not poor. they have 2 decent salaries. she comes just in time for kidush with her kids who have no interest in shul.

What do you think people think about it?

How about contributing/paying/ sponsoring Kidush?

I am honestly wondering why OP cannot just simply go to the kiddush? Who’s business is it anyway?
Melon, are you sponsoring every kiddush? Who is deciding who’s allowed? And why does OP have to cater a meal. ‘ for ladies’?
Honestly, the busy bodies in these communities are probably not sponsoring anything anyway.

I am guessing this is a generational thing.
Older women who probably raised their children without an eruv and are bitter about it. They see younger women at shul, maybe downing a whole cracker or two and they’re wondering who on earth gave them the right! Yes, I am being sarcastic.

OP, some people are just martyrs and you don’t owe them anything.

watergirl

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 5:51 am

amother [ Magenta ] wrote:

I grew up hearing this from my father and I really thought he was right. He used to watch and comment at kiddush who had davened and who came to "schnorr". It was like a sport for him. When I had babies and my husband wanted me to join him at shul for kiddush (like all the other mothers!), I still heard my father's voice in my head calling me a schnorrer. It's a horrible thing to carry around.

Who pays that much attention to the people at kiddush to know who was in shul and who came just at the end? And why? If it makes a "poor impression" to someone if I come just at the end, then that is a person I do not care to make ANY impressions with.

OP, in your case, I am echoing what most others said here. You know this women has social skills. In your case, it seems to me like she is trying to open a door to chit chat. You can ignore her comment but reply with something totally different. So if she says to you "oh you made it just in time for cholent!" you can say "oh hi! good shabbos! Did you hear about so and so who had a baby?" or whatever.

watergirl

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 5:55 am

amother [ OP ] wrote:

THIS.

My dad is that person. And when I was a kid in his house (and embarrassingly, a teen and even a young adult until I realized how wrong he was and how mean - it took a long time to get his voice out of my head!). He is just mean and bitter and sits and watches people and notices and keeps count and score. It's a sad, sad life. He has no enjoyment. He is too occupied watching. There are people like him out there. I was one of them until I learned how BH most people are not like him. I had to re-learn.

ahuvaahuva

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 5:59 am

amother [ Magenta ] wrote:

Shul doesn't Need people. People need the shul.
The kiddush might be in some places to attract people but I would see it as providing people with a social need the same way as a melave malke.
It's not a prize for shul going. And this woman would be Wrong to disturb davening by bringing her baby. and I would rather look after my baby myself then give her to child care. But that is personal to each person's unique needs.
No need to look for ways to stamp and squash people.
How do you think Hashem feels when you tell his daughter that she should not attend the kiddush.

lamplighter

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 6:13 am

OP, the only Dan lkaf zechus for the woman I can think of is if the cultural/social norms in this place are different to other places and she thinks she's tactfully informing you that.
Then of course you may not care.
Sorry if I missed it but did you explain if you're the only one who does this or if other women with children also come just for the kiddush.

amother

Amber

Wed, Jan 12 2022, 6:34 am

amother [ Melon ] wrote:

Does your shul have extra food or is every last drop consumed? Do ppl not get to eat bec a lady showed up with her child?

Is this your opinion or the rabbis?

Shuls that I know that have communal kiddushim want ppl to come. They want to creat a sense of community and warmth.
They want to feed ppl who may not have what to eat at home (elderly, single, poor).
I’ve never heard a rabbi or board express the sentiments you have hear.