How to determine who gets a free package

cookiewriter

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 7:36 pm

Hi. I run a gemach. We give something out for babies for free. Value about $300. (Although we do not pay $300- we get wholesale or cheaper)
When we started the gemach we were told in order to determine if someone is “poor enough” we should call a rav as a reference. However it’s intensely uncomfortable for the families, many don’t want to have a rav knowing their private business or don’t have a rav who knows their financial situation. It’s uncomfortable and annoying for us to have to bother rabbanim, sometimes calling multiple times to get through. And many speak yiddish only, which we do not.
Bh we have grown immensely and are giving out many packages. I personally stopped asking for rav number. I ask the caller
“Is the family financially needy”
And I feel like if they’re lying it’s on them. between them and Hashem
If someone is asking for help, I assume they need it.
But other ppl who run this gemach feel like
Some ppl think Gemach is for anyone who needs and ppl are just going to take advantage of us even if they can well afford the items we give out.
And because we were told originally a psak to ask a rav if they’re really poor we are obligated to continue doing so?

However it’s no longer feasible we cannot call rabbanim every day we don’t have the time!

Please advise

Thisisnotmyreal

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 8:23 pm

I remember being a first time mom with a ton of expenses from the birth and supplies. $3000 on the birth and I don't remember what happened postpartum but it was a lot (I wasn't so involved in the finances at that point more on what I needed). Anything at that point would have been helpful, we weren't doing so well then either. A gemach that lends out, I would have been much more comfortable taking from than a brand new item no one is expecting back. It depends on how much I need it and if it would be worthwhile to have around for future babies.

Having a baby is expensive. I don't think anyone calling you is well off. But there's a huge grey area of poor.

amother

Nemesia

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 8:50 pm

cookiewriter wrote:

Your attitude is wrong. If you’re not willing to do any research to determine whose more needy and deserving then you will have ppl getting who shouldn’t be getting. That’s on you,

amother

DarkMagenta

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 9:04 pm

amother [ Stoneblue ] wrote:

Is there any way to include in the package a set of info about the Gemach/ organization etc and… envelope for donations?
So people who might not “qualify” and know that will donate

I think that's a great idea!
Sometimes new mothers are very overwhelmed and just getting a ready made package is a tremendous help. If mother is out of commission and father have to go shopping it doesn't end so well! LOL

If they could afford to pay some of it or even the whole thing is a win-win.
Include an envelope that says how much the package cost and that it's intended for needy families.
Offer sponsorship opportunities. A nicely written letter could do it.

amother

DarkMagenta

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 9:07 pm

amother [ Nemesia ] wrote:

Yes! If you’re not willing, you shouldn’t be involved in this.

I disagree.
How does it make sense to not participate in a huge chessed because she doesn't want to spend hours on the phone calling very often unreachable rabbanim that may or may not know family's financial status?

amother

Apricot

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 9:13 pm

amother [ Saddlebrown ] wrote:

If you still want to vet people, you can ask for a letter from a rav, or have a quick form for a rav to fill out. No details needed, just that Rav so and so, phone number xxx-xxxx says that they need your services.

I agree with this. Have them sign a form that says applying for assistance at time of need. Name and number of rabbi who knows your situation. You can keep the form on file and you won't need to call the rav, because people will feel uncomfortable submitting if they really don't need it.

cupcake123

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 9:14 pm

Depends what the item is. If it's something people usually get themselves let's say a crib I think you can assume anyone calling a gemach for a crib is needy.
However some items let's say a baby swing people might not NEED per sey and might want to try from gemach or a bris outfit is another common thing even non needy people may use a gemach for.
I think asking the person point blank if they're needy is embarrassing and not nice.
Tizku limitzvos!

amother

Forsythia

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 9:17 pm

Imo it's probably embarrassing for people who are actually struggling to have to get their rav to vouch for that. If you make it clear it's for those in need I think that's enough. People who are well off and still take charity probably have some other issues. I don't think you should have to police that.

amother

Jean

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 9:27 pm

I come from a poorer background. Trust me if someone is asking they usually need it. I have relatives that took their babies home in the opposite gender clothes/blankets because they legit don't have money to buy a new one.
My aunt had another girl after 10 years and the baby was brought home in a blue blanket. Not because she didn't have time because she simply doesn't have the money.

If they don't need it, they have to give to a din vcheshbon for stealing! Their issue!!
Thank you for doing your avodas hakodesh

cookiewriter

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 9:37 pm

amother [ Jean ] wrote:

Thank you for saying this.

cookiewriter

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 9:39 pm

amother [ Nemesia ] wrote:

Your attitude is wrong. If you’re not willing to do any research to determine whose more needy and deserving then you will have ppl getting who shouldn’t be getting. That’s on you,

This was kind
Of hurtful. Wow. Here I am giving my time and money for needy new moms (and yes it’s something they really need. Not an “extra” like a swing)
And I’m supposed to also Investigate if they’re lying or
Not?
Every single time a meshulach comes to your door or holds out their hand at the kosel do you ask for proof?

happyone

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 10:42 pm

If someone is lowering their dignity to reach out to a gmach for help please don't make it harder by asking for a rav to confirm financial status. If they are taking advantage they have bigger issues than the 300 dollar package. Kol.hakavod to you. If you have a link I'd love to donate towards this mitzva.

amother

Celeste

Mon, Jul 11 2022, 10:50 pm

cookiewriter wrote:

I will call the rav back. But before that I want to know what people think. Is $300 something I need to dig into peoples financial backgrounds for? Is it my problem if someone is lying and just wants a free package

Totally agree with you. If someone is reaching out they probably need it and are probably not emotionally up to someone nitpicking their finances and life story for a bit of assistance. Their not asking for a million dollars.
Btdt