Growing up, was Tisha Bav miserable or inspiring?

amother

Dahlia

Sun, Aug 07 2022, 3:46 pm

We just sat around a lot on the floor or went out for a walk or went grocery shopping or played with friends. We usually went to Aicha at night. I don’t remember doing much. We definitely did not watch anything. In camp, they used to make a fake holocaust room, where the staff were the nazis telling us what to do. It was a little creepy.

amother

Moonstone

Sun, Aug 07 2022, 3:53 pm

We never did anything for tisha bav growing up. My parents became morr frum when I was young and I don't think they ever understood fast days and their meaning. I dont think either of my parents fasted and they definitely didn't say anything to us about needing to fast.I realized this wasn't the norm when my best friend when to sleepaway camp and came back telling me all about tisha bav there (my parents never let me go to any camp). I only started fasting when I was in 11th grade and I went to visit a friend for a few weeks in the summer. It completely changed my life.

zaq

Sun, Aug 07 2022, 3:54 pm

amother [ Salmon ] wrote:

I don't get it....how were the endings happy if the survivors were dealing with finding out about the probable deaths of their loved ones and being left totally homeless and usually alone....?

Because they survived and in most cases rebuilt their lives. "Happy" is a relative term.

mochamix18

Sun, Aug 07 2022, 4:02 pm

shabbatiscoming wrote:

I went to Moshava IO for a few years.

We used to watch Operation Thunderbolt on Tisha B’Av at Ramah too. Actually I was 11 my first Tisha B’Av that I fasted (10 my first YK). Since my experience was camp, it was a beautiful and inspiring one. The oldest kids in camp would make paths with candles from the חדר אוכל to the בית עם. They would be singing softly sad songs like Ani Maamin and Eli Eli by Channah Senesh. Then we would sit on the floor of the בית עם back to back with candles and listen as different people chanted the different פרקים of איכה.

amother

Mulberry

Sun, Aug 07 2022, 5:29 pm

I went to sleep away camp for many years and found eicha and kinnos in camp very meaningful, whatever I understood of it at least. I would never have gotten that at home. I am so thankful for that. I don't think my kids get it as much since they don't go to sleep away camp (we are in Israel), but I do encourage them to go hear eicha and watch the chofetz chaim heritage foundation movie if they want.

naturalmom5

Sun, Aug 07 2022, 6:59 pm

Its funny because I was just thinking this morning
that when I was little I went to camps that were Conservative.

When I was home for the summer, I went to a Conservative shul for T Bav.
In camp we watched Garden of Finzo Continis
or other Holocaust movies

The Shuls had inspirational speakers
When I became frum, all the Shuls I went to, you had to sit on floor in a decrepit Ezra’s nashim and look at a kinos book that I couldn’t read and fast all day. It was awful .
Today I see there are so many wonderful programs to watch. I’m happy the frum world finally caught up to my childhood

amother

Olive

Sun, Aug 07 2022, 7:01 pm

amother [ Salmon ] wrote:

I don't get it....how were the endings happy if the survivors were dealing with finding out about the probable deaths of their loved ones and being left totally homeless and usually alone....?

Don’t try to understand the mind of a a man suffering from religious ocd please.

He’d also call up the CCHF and complain that their tisha bav videos were too enjoyable because of the Acapella music of Rochel Mevakah.

BrisketBoss

Sun, Aug 07 2022, 7:03 pm

amother [ Nemesia ] wrote:

That’s astonishing natural mom. We grew up conservative and never heard of tisha b”av.

I also did and never heard of it. But my mom has memories of observing it at Jewish (not frum) sleepaway camp. I guess if it were part of the school year then I would have learned about it.

amother

Olive

Sun, Aug 07 2022, 7:07 pm

zaq wrote:

Quite. Rather like Rabbi Akiva laughing to see a fox wandering on the site of the Kodesh Kodashim: proof of hope for the future. Am Yisrael Chai.

Not at all.

You can’t be happy when your whole world is gone. Liberation came too late for them. It was a bitter liberation, nothing joyful about it at all. When they had kids they remembered all the children that were killed. They never felt happy after that again.

We are still suffering three generations later. There is nothing happy about the holocaust of its aftermath.

Sadly my parents suffer from religious ocd and it’s comes out to us children in a form of sick abuse. Yes, I read the mishpacha this week and I greatly relate. I ask my rav every little thing because I never know what is Halacha and what is the ocd part of it.

When I asked him if I can read about the holocaust he couldn’t understand the question. It’s a direct result of the churban.

Happy to hear I can read holocaust books today. Sarcasm. It’s the most bitter thing that has occurred to our people since the churban and learning more about it today drives a hole of pain so deep into my heart.

naturalmom5

Sun, Aug 07 2022, 7:13 pm

BrisketBoss wrote:

I also did and never heard of it. But my mom has memories of observing it at Jewish (not frum) sleepaway camp. I guess if it were part of the school year then I would have learned about it.

Maybe Conservative in the 60s, was a lot more traditional than it was in the 80s/90s

amother

Eggplant

Sun, Aug 07 2022, 8:47 pm

Went to Camp Ramah-Conservative Movement’s flagship camp for most of the 80’s through the early 90’s.

We would go very quietly with flashlights to the basketball court at night and sit on the floor, the entire camp, each bunk in a circle around a candle. Then there were volunteers from the oldest division (or two?) who would read Eicha for the whole camp. We would then go back to our bunks and go to bed. In the morning:
Older kid optional kinnot, optional speakers. A lot of quiet time. Optional movie-it was always Raid on Enttebbe/Operation Thunderbolt. Dinning room was open all day (tea room style)- nobody was forced to fast-do what feels right for you.
At 5:30 or so… see below, whole camp met up.

Younger division was structured. Meals as scheduled and you needed a note from your parents if you were under 11 and wanted to fast. I remember activities including escape from Russia (they had stations all over camp and you needed to accomplish goals- which they made arbitrary and random to get your visa stamped). Had learning sessions. Made plays about Kamtza and Bar Kamtza. Built the kotel out of the hard trunks and wrote notes to put in the kotel, and had some rest time.

At 5:30 (maybe it was 6:00 or 6:30?) The whole camp got back together and we had communal Mincha, a shuir/story with a mashal and then a kumzitz until Maariv/havdala and then we would all go to the dining room for dinner.

While I have issues with the camp, I believe they did 9Av well.

mochamix18

Mon, Aug 08 2022, 3:08 am

amother [ Nemesia ] wrote:

That’s astonishing natural mom. We grew up conservative and never heard of tisha b”av.

Really? We even learned about Tisha B’Av in non denominational JCC day camp 🤷‍♀️. It seems camp might be the determining factor here and also which part of the spectrum of conservative Judaism you grew up in before becoming frum.

mochamix18

Mon, Aug 08 2022, 3:11 am

amother [ Eggplant ] wrote:

Went to Camp Ramah-Conservative Movement’s flagship camp for most of the 80’s through the early 90’s.

We would go very quietly with flashlights to the basketball court at night and sit on the floor, the entire camp, each bunk in a circle around a candle. Then there were volunteers from the oldest division (or two?) who would read Eicha for the whole camp. We would then go back to our bunks and go to bed. In the morning:
Older kid optional kinnot, optional speakers. A lot of quiet time. Optional movie-it was always Raid on Enttebbe/Operation Thunderbolt. Dinning room was open all day (yea room style)- nobody was forced to fast-do what feels right for you.
At 5:30 or so… see below whole camp met up.

Younger division was structured. Meals as scheduled and you needed a note from your parents if you were under 11 and wanted to fast. I remember activities including escape from Russia (they had stations all over camp and you needed to accomplish goals- which they made arbitrary and random to get your visa stamped). Had learning sessions. Made plays about Kamtza and Bar Kamtza. Built the kotel out of the hard trunks and wrote notes to put in the kotel, and had some rest time.

At 5:30 (maybe it was 6:00 or 6:30?) The Who camp got back together and we had communal Mincha, a shuir/story with a mashal and then a kumzitz until Maariv/havdala and then we would all go to the dining room for dinner.

While I have issues with the camp, I believe they did 9Av well.

Ramah Wisconsin? Read what I wrote way above 😁