Was it worth it? Getting a degree

amother

Khaki

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 1:04 pm

amother OP wrote:

I prefer not to say my field, but its considered a good field. The salary is for full time. Babysitters in my area charge 8-12 an hour. The less hours you use them, the more they charge an hour.

If they're charging that much, I'm assuming the ratio is lower than 11 kids for one Morah. And they may have expenses that you don't realize. Assistants, renting a space (even if they babysit in the home, they are using that space for the babies so that costs money as well), supplies, subs.... it really adds up. Don't assume they are making that much, most are not.

amother

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 1:05 pm

amother Ecru wrote:

I don't think this is a simple question.

In general, if one gets a Masters or other advanced degree (or even a degree) is will prepare one for a job that is more fulfilling than baby sitting.

In general the "professional" job will often have other benefits including better corporate benefits.

Whatever the salary is, presumably there is potential for growth so your starting salary is just the start and there is growth potential.

Often a degree or advanced degree opens up other doors in related fields

Obviously one considers how well paying certain fields are and balances that with whether one would enjoy those fields. You couldn't pay me enough to be a CPA but I do have an interest and aptitude for a well paying career that requires an advance degree.

Do you really want to be a babysitter for the rest of your life? Not much room for advancement - generally no benefits. Seems pretty short range to me

Very true, you make some great points. I guess I'm just frustrated over the really high taxes, the years and money I put into my degree. I think I was just expecting more.

amother

Ecru

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 1:09 pm

amother OP wrote:

Very true, you make some great points. I guess I'm just frustrated over the really high taxes, the years and money I put into my degree. I think I was just expecting more.

If you are just starting out after getting the degree, the "reward" part of the cost/benefit analysis wouldn't be apparent but you will be working for the rest of your life - so 30 or 40 years.

Over the course of time, the degree will pay off both financially and in terms of job satisfaction.

You never know where life will bring you. For example, my cousin studied to be an RN and got a Masters. She didn't really enjoy nursing but got a very high paying satisfying job in a company that deals with medical issues.

Another friend got a Masters in Public Health and rose to the top of a health system where she specializes in breast cancer issues - not medically but administratively.

Not saying these should be followed but just pointing out that their career paths weren't rigidly set the day they graduated

amother

Poinsettia

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 1:52 pm

amother OP wrote:

After I pay taxes compared to a babysitter working off the books the take home salary isn't that different.

Sure, you can lie amd cheat and steal from the government to try get more money. You could also rob banks and make money. I don't see why either of these are viable sources of income for a frum woman.

Stay the course. It sounds like you're on a good path. It can rake time to move past the starting salary range.

amother

NeonPink

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 2:12 pm

amother Emerald wrote:

im a SLP and have a MS in speech-language pathology.
I often think its a waste of time and I should have done sheitals or babysitting.

We struggle every month and we never have enough leftovers for "extras"

Its important to evaluate a degree before going for it. If there are too many people in one community going for the same degree that will significantly undercut the salaries. This is what's happening in our communities. The women are all choosing degrees within a few select fields. This results in an oversaturated market, which brings downs the value of the degree along with the salaries.

amother

Tangerine

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 2:13 pm

Hashem_Yaazor wrote:

I can't tell you whether your degree is worth it or not.

But it definitely is worth it to live a yashar life. Working off the books is illegal.

(Cross posted with broom)

This. I never have and would never want to work off the books.

My degree is also very worth it, because in addition to a good salary, my job has generous benefits (I.e. health insurance, paid vacations, paid sick days etc.), and I’m Iy”H looking forward to retiring with a good pension that will eliminate the need for me to work till the day I die or go on government programs/tzedakah etc. Working as a babysitter or sheitel macher would not afford me these benefits.

ETA: I worked extremely hard for my degree, but B”H it has paid off.

amother

NeonPink

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 2:17 pm

amother OP wrote:

After I pay taxes compared to a babysitter working off the books the take home salary isn't that different.

There are so many other points to consider besides this:

1 - Legality: legal versus illegal behaviors
2 - Time: the value of a degree often kicks in down the road as you climb the ladder
3 - Satisfaction: doing something that you're passionate about
4 - Job Benefits: this provides significant value
5 - Social Security: you're paying in to your SS value later in life (if the program will survive till then)

And like anything else - do your research before jumping into anything. Not all degrees offer the same returns. Check out the benefits for the degree that you're interested in before going ahead with it.

imaima

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 2:21 pm

amother OP wrote:

Sometimes I wonder if it was worth getting a degree? I recently finished my masters degree and started working. The salary is okay, but not great. I think working off the books as a babysitter would pay the same or more. Anyone else feel the same? Do you think it was worth getting a degree? I hope this is just a new grad issue and that it gets better.

Would you really want to work as a baby sittee though? Regardless of the pay. There is also quality of life while you work

amother

Emerald

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 2:27 pm

amother NeonPink wrote:

Im not BY type I dont think working with only jews is what I want to do long term. I applied for DOE job and Im on a waiting list for years already...

I didnt know any other SLPs, I just liked language and thought Id be a good therapist so I went for it.
Everyone told me how much money id make etc.

Well, there are no benefits, no health insurance, no pension, no vacation days, no paid sick days. Every agency is like this. Im not trained in feeding or in doing MBS/FEES to work in a rehab center. My options are extremely limited.

amother

Obsidian

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 2:36 pm

Im a babysitter.
On the books.
I'm Lakewood.
5 kids (legal amount as per NJ law).
$9/hour 9:15-3:15, 12:15 on Friday.
I average $1200 a week pre taxes

1) taxes as a self-employed individual are very high, even though I can legally deduct certain household expenses.
2) finding a sub for 2 hours for a chumash party is insane. If I can find one, I pay my full hourly rate to the sub, even though I still have expenses and food and equipment for that day so I come at a loss.
3) no insurance. My options are various marketplace insurances which are not good. I'm on the books so make too much for JerseyCare.
4) no paid maternity leave. In fact I have to pay all my income plus to cover the sub and expenses so I lose our
5) I don't get paid for Yom Tov.

The job was practical and convenient when I had babies. I was able to stay home with my babies and watch others also, nurse ft. But now my babies are all in elementary school, I'm over 40 and I have absolutely no experience or qualifications in anything else.

amother

Melon

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 2:42 pm

amother Emerald wrote:

You think you would have made the same amount per hour babysitting?

Doing shaitels comes along with working late hours, annoying customers, and you don't get paid a set amount. Can be great but it's not for everyone.

amother

Mauve

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 2:51 pm

Dosent it pay off though, to be able to be home with ur kids when they were little then to have to go out and have a career which usually ends up taking up lots of time spending with the kids when they're so little. We're meant to be raising our kids, our husband's r meant to go to work, that's exactly what our "punishments" were from Adam and chavas sins!

Not that it's black and white but if ur choosing between working at home to be able to be home with ur child, or going into a field and being a business women, my outlook is that even if ur a 40 yr old women, or whatever age and don't have a profession of some sort, u shld be a proud mom and the most rewarding accomplishment is knowing that u were able to be home and there for ur babies/little ones.

Yes, women these days wld need to work so there's half day jobs and even full day and isn't necessarily a career and wld take up most of womens duties at home and being there for the kids. For me, in my opinion, it isn't worth the career and paying for full time babysitters and nannys , I'd rather get 9-3 job if need be, or half day if possible or yes, do babysitting so I can be there for my kids.

I'm sure there r moms that have professions and r there for their kids, and that's amazing , but normally takes up alot of time and energy so hired help is needed and to say that ur older women now and don't have a profession cuz u wanted to be home with the kids when they were little is defeating its purpose!! So yes u shld feel very accomplished abt that!

amother

Garnet

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 2:55 pm

I have a MS degree. My salary is not amazing and B”H we are not a single income family. I have very decent benefits, a great work life balance and I don’t work to hard.
I have no doubt I could make more if I worked harder and hustled - in my field, or make this much working very hard without a degree.
I am very content. I feel like I put the effort in to get the degree and now I can have a very pleasant work situation.

amother

Obsidian

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 2:57 pm

amother Mauve wrote:

Except I have tuitions to pay, chasunas and bar mitzvahs to make, teenagers and their more expensive needs to cover.
I've hit the absolute absolute max that I can legally make, and I'm stuck at 50k a year with no options for more. And im getting older and less able to continue.
If I move to an office job, I'll have to start at the very bottom like a seminary girl. 40 hours a week.
It's hard financially.

amother

DarkCyan

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 3:06 pm

amother Melon wrote:

Lol. I'm a therapist and I work late hours. I don't make enough working during the day, so I work evenings and Sundays. Plus, there is tons of paperwork to do in the evenings.
And you bet I deal with annoying customers (aka clients and parents).
And I don't make a set amount either.
And it took 4 hard years of school to get to this "wonderful" point and tens of thousands in student loans. and there is minimal growth potential.

The prices of therapy graduate programs have gone up insanely over the past few years, and salaries have not risen to match that (whether you work in school or healthcare serving). It simply isn't worth it anymore to take out such exorbitant loans.
It always amazes me how there are some posters on this site are dead set on insisting that therapy is so worthwhile. It's OK to admit that while it was a nice option for those who graduated HS 15-20 years ago, it simply is not as worthwhile anymore.
There are also so many more options than there were 20 years ago. one small example (and there are many more but I don't have time to post)- I saw advertised recently a cyber security 2 year masters program that costs 25 k. While a masters program for therapy is minimum 85k. And which one do you think has a higher starting salary and average salary?

amother

Khaki

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 3:11 pm

amother Mauve wrote:

I did the same.

I babysat when my children were little because I wanted to be home with my babies. I started college at 42 and I bh have a degree now, but I'm going to say it was very, very hard and I'm not sure I recommend it. Also. Babysitting is really hard as well. Anybody who thinks it's not a "real" career has never tried it!

I don't know what the answer is and I'm still waiting for someone to come up with it...

The ideal is, I think, for moms to stay home and fathers to work and bring home enough money to live on.... I wish this had happened to me but it didnt, and I suspect I'm not the only one.

amother

Mauve

Sun, Nov 27 2022, 3:16 pm

I here u, yes I'm sure financially it's hard but as u see having a degree or career isn't the answer to it all and making most money. There r pros and cons to it all but as long as ur doing urs, and ur husband is working too, then there's so much u can do. (Davening always works:)

Us a Jewish ppl we need to do ours and know when working overtime/night hrs and women who have children at home, we need to know when to cut the line. For me thats considered more then hishtadlus already. What's the point, taking away from being with our kids, which is what we live for so ya. Money is in hands of hashem. He has planned everyones incomes in beginning of yr already, no point in overtime working and taking up family time or for men-learning time. Dosent work that way.

It is very very hard these days cuz so many expenses and prices everywhere don't stop going up, as long as ur doing urs, and spendining on necessities and not going overboard, gotta trust and daven!! My opinion! Smile