Spoiled Americans | Imamother

Cheiny

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:11 am

amother OP wrote:

Lol, I'm saying this as an American!! What triggered this post: I'm at the sending to camp stage and I am going crazy from all the "requirements". Where else do kids go to beautiful grounds for a month or two and have 24/7 fun and entertainment, have tens of outfits, get packages from their parents etc etc etc. And the astronomical amount of money being spent for this ??? It's just insane.

How is that a reflection on America? Blame the community standards.

amother

Snapdragon

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:14 am

amother Crimson wrote:

I'm American, living in America, and I don't have a dishwasher.
Lots of generalizations on this thread.

Same. I live in a tiny apartment in a great American city. A dishwasher would be an amazing waste of space. Also loading and unloading a dishwasher is an amazing waste of time. I just wash the darn dishes. What's the big deal?

rainbow dash

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:15 am

amother Snapdragon wrote:

For me it's 3 loads of dishes, milky meat and parve. I have back problems standing too long. So for me 2 dishwashers are heaven sent

Highstrung

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:18 am

When I want to remind my kids how lucky and fortunate they are , I bring them the example of my DH who did not grow up in America. His father travelled once a year to America and would bring back 1 Bissli supersnack pk for each kid. My DH said that the one bag of Bissli lasted him months. He said he took one piece and would suck and nibble a tiny piece off the top and put it away. One little spiral Bissli piece lasted close to a week. That’s how much he cherished a kosher snack like that in a snack bag. In my house Bissli is not even an exiting snack, gets eaten in less than two minutes and then the kids are asking for something else.
When my DH describes him playing cars and using the plaid lines of his blanket in his bed as his roads and highways , I think we can’t even take our $20 car mat for granted . Are we spoiled? No. We are super fortunate and forget and take almost anything for granted.

amother

Lawngreen

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:30 am

Obviously you will find richer and poorer people in every country. And, of course there are many, many Americans living on a lower standard than in Europe or Israel. But, that's not the point. As a whole the middle to upper income Americans have higher standards than Israeli or European counterparts. Poorer American are probably living on lower standard than in Europe bc there's not as many benefits.

You don't really find communities outside America where it's the norm to walk around wearing jewlery totaling thousands of dollars.

You don't have summer camps for middle income families for a month, each one trying to outdo each other with what they offer. And apparently your kids have to go.

If you walk into a bakery in Europe or Israel your unlikely to be comfronted with a choice of 50 different flavors of muffins. In England you'll be lucky to have five.

Cheap food and clothes, spending on credit, massive supermarkets, supersize food are all American inventions. And this obviously effects the amount of "stuff' people have. The world is different outside America. Just compare the average size British fridge to the American models.

I'm not American but I love reading imamother.com to get a window into how Americans live their life. I don't think it's a question of being spoilt, but I do think you have turned many luxuries into necessities.

amother

Seafoam

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:37 am

amother Moonstone wrote:

Honestly, it's all relative
When I read here, it seems that the majority of British Imamothers, if they work, work in kids schools, offering them the luxury of their kids schedules.
It seems like European families go on vacations regularly - both smaller sea vacations and out of the country.

South American and South African families have a tremendous amount of household help, due to the availability.

Israeli Imas pay significantly less for education and healthcare.
Many countries have basic food price caps and maternity leave and childcare assistance or child payments that leave Americans jealous.

I think the fact that it's standard for a European family to go on a 2 week vacation every year makes them spoiled.

See, it's just what you're used to.

Good point. I remember being thrown off after I moved in July being asked where I was spending my summer. And embarrassed because I had just moved and it didn’t even occur to me that we had to get away. We caught on pretty fast though 😆 the next year we were off to Spain with the rest of them. When I said we we’re going for 5 days everyone thought I was crazy, “so short!!” Yes, so short, we work! As kids we were lucky if we went to Lancaster for 3 days….

I will say that a lot more worked work nowadays as prices continue to rise.

Tuition here (“school fees”) is very low and the glorious NHS is free. (Glorious being sarcastic.)

amother

Seafoam

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:41 am

giftedmom wrote:

Uh why on earth are you comparing London to Lakewood?
London is like Brooklyn. Anyone in Brooklyn with a pool? Lakewood is like canvey. And I’m sure many have huge houses there.

The houses in Manchester are very affordable but they are still small. English houses are not built like American houses. Period.

amother

Seafoam

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:42 am

amother Pink wrote:

You've got to compare like with like.
Paying less for education and healthcare doesn't raise the standard of living.
Even being on your kids schedule doesn't raise the standard of living.
It makes life way less stressful in some things but it doesn't mean that the gashmiyus is more.

I've lived in UK, Israel and USA. The standard of gashmiyus in the USA is higher. Across the board. It doesn't make Americans spoiled but it does mean that their "needs" are more.

I think Americans are also willing to work harder to keep up that level. In the UK most women would not work a high profile job if it takes her away from her children more hours even if it means she can have a higher standard of living. So they are working in schools because that is a priority for them. In the USA the salary is a higher priority than the kids schedule.

Question- would you work out of the house pay of babysitting for about £10/hour? That’s not more than $12.50. It’s a literal joke. BH I’m very lucky to work for American companies. The salaries here are laughable.

amother

Rose

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:43 am

Also, from what I see on imamother (could definitely be it's not like that irl) it seems that Americans try to keep up with the Cohens a lot. In Europe you have rich people, middle class and poor and everyone lives according to their standards. If so and so "rich" make a super fancy bar mitzva, good for them but people don't feel pressure to match that standard.

amother

Seafoam

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:44 am

giftedmom wrote:

It’s really not a fact. You’re just apparently only familiar with cities in England. The fact that you’re comparing Lakewood to London demonstrates that.

Honey, I’m very familiar with both.

It’s 100% true.

ora_43

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:49 am

amother OP wrote:

Nah I think this is more a universal thing of, everyone gets used to their own lifestyle, and part of that is starting to see the things that 'everyone' has as basic requirements.

Like, when the average person has a lot of money, camp administrators start to think in terms of what would be convenient. It would be ideal to have sneakers, boots, sandals, special shoes for water, and maybe backup sneakers, and 90% of parents can afford it, so - why not just add that to the list?

Whereas if very few parents have money the requirement would be 'wear shoes.'

amother

Leaf

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:56 am

amother Rose wrote:

This is why you can’t rely on internet posts to learn about things. It’s not a reflection of real life. All the people living according to their standards are not venting about it like the few who must keep up. And we do hade plenty of threads asking for cheap things and no mention of it having to look like what others have.

Chayalle

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 11:58 am

amother Seafoam wrote:

The houses in Manchester are very affordable but they are still small. English houses are not built like American houses. Period.

Manchester is not the entire England.
The English houses I have been to (many times) were like Flatbush homes. Smaller than Lakewood because it's the city, but no significant difference otherwise.

Chayalle

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 12:00 pm

Busybee5 wrote:

It probably is cheaper than sending a few kids to camp.

And I know many Americans who cannot afford sending a few kids to camp - and don't. They take turns sending them as late as possible, as few at a time as possible, and only for one half, taking a job the other half of the summer, with kids supplementing the cost.

amother

Smokey

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 12:09 pm

amother Alyssum wrote:

Of course this depends on where you live!

Kinder gelt in Belgium, tuition, Healthcare, daycare, paid maternity leave. We get almost nothing here. Mandatory vacation time..

We get those in Quebec too, except for tuition (the gov does give money directly to the schools, but not enough to to cover everything.)

Although the healthcare system can be disasterous at times.

amother

Seafoam

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 12:24 pm

Chayalle wrote:

Manchester is not the entire England.
The English houses I have been to (many times) were like Flatbush homes. Smaller than Lakewood because it's the city, but no significant difference otherwise.

Most people in Brooklyn:
Have AC
Have a coat closet
Have a toilet on every floor
Have a laundry room or at least in the bathroom not in the kitchen

It’s not the same.

Chayalle

Mon, Jun 19 2023, 12:30 pm

amother Seafoam wrote:

Most people in Brooklyn:
Have AC
Have a coat closet
Have a toilet on every floor
Have a laundry room or at least in the bathroom not in the kitchen

It’s not the same.

I am thinking of my in-laws house in Flatbush and my cousins in London.
Coat closet - check (both)
ac - check (both, not central but in the rooms)
toilet on every floor - check (London relatives have one on main floor, two on upper floor. That's more than my in-laws)
have a laundry room - neither, though London relatives have larger upstairs bathroom)

Yeah, it's not the same.