Spinoff: Start saving now

amother

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 4:45 am

mig100 wrote:

It's great to save. If u can't afford daily expenses then may be worth reconsidering..

I wanted to highlight this attitude that came up on the other thread a few times.

It is poor financial planning to say I need pizza and an Amazon budget, in addition to other things people might be buying like brand-name everything and subscriptions to who knows what, and then say you don't have what to put away for later. What are you calling daily expenses?

I work in the financial industry, and it pains me to see frum people who rack up debt and then need to shift from gemach to gemach and end up with nothing for the future.

We all need to live according to what we can afford, and that includes putting some money away for emergencies and retirement.

If you spend now for things that are not really essential, what will you live on later?

amother

Turquoise

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 4:52 am

amother OP wrote:

And if one can not do that? And is only spending on essentials? What then?
We live month to month and are not able to put anything away. Its very painful.

amother

Garnet

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 4:54 am

100%!!
Pizza shocked me on that budget. And for $250 a month!
Amazon too - gotta specify what if it's so high.

Honesty it's hard to wrap my head around that 300k isn't doable.
We make less than half. We survive. It's tight. No extras and usually need clothing for ultra cheap or Gemach and theres nothing wrong with that. Perfectly nice clothing if you know how to look.

Even when I have 'extra' money, I'm super careful how I spend it.

My furniture is mostly free and super nice. We went a while without furniture because we couldn't afford and little by little we get more when a good option comes up on local free group

amother

Navy

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 4:55 am

amother Turquoise wrote:

And if one can not do that? And is only spending on essentials? What then?
We live month to month and are not able to put anything away. It’s very painful.

That is indeed difficult and I am sorry for your situation Turquoise. However, I don’t think OP was addressing someone in your position. OP was saying that people who feel they need takeaway, buy subscriptions, buy frequently on Amazon but then also have debt and need to use Gemachim, could instead be saving.

amother

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 5:01 am

amother Navy wrote:

Yes, that's why I asked what you're calling daily expenses.

If you are surviving on what are really essentials right now, then no, you shouldn't be saving.

However, if you can get a free appointment with mesila or other organization that helps budget, maybe you can see why you're in this situation and if there's a way out.

amother

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 5:04 am

And I'm also not criticizing the OP of the other thread. I'm the poster who said her 401k is essential, and it will give her millionaire status when she retires. That's not necessarily enough to live for several decades as a retiree, but if invested properly, she can live off of the passive income. She is doing the right thing by making that a priority and looking for other things to cut. I hope other people follow her lead.

amother

Candycane

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 7:26 am

amother OP wrote:

MESILAH/RSK ARE NOT FREE NOT FREE NOT FREE
THEY CHARGE $600 OR MORE TO SEE THEM

CAPS BECAUSE I'M MAD THAT WHEN I FINALLY MUSTERED UP THE COURAGE TO GO - AFTER I BARED MY SOUL I FOUND OUT ABOUT THE CHARGE

amother

Daffodil

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 8:24 am

Disclaimer: I haven't tried supporting a family on 40K and no government handouts or food boxes. But I started a savings account when I was in grade school and never stopped, saving allowance (I got enough to buy a chocolate bar or popsicle once a week), bday and Chanukah gifts, babysitting money, bottle deposits, tips for delivering MM, everything. I've always made it a point to live within my means even when those means were tight. I'd rather do without than be in debt. If I can't afford it I don't buy it, affording meaning not that I don't have the money for it but I don't want to spend that much on it. We do without many things some people consider a necessity, like cleaning help, vacations, late fashion clothes, eating out more than a few times a year-- and then it's usually pizza--and living in a "good" neighborhood. When things were tight I saved less but always saved something, even if it was $10 a week. So when we get hit with an unexpected bill of several thousand dollars, we can pay it. I'm shocked to read about people who make triple what I did who can't make ends meet.

amother

Brass

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 9:32 am

amother Turquoise wrote:

And if one can not do that? And is only spending on essentials? What then?
We live month to month and are not able to put anything away. Its very painful.

I've been there.
I always made sure there was a line item on my budget for savings even if it was $20 a month.
It's a mindset.
For reference - The only dairy I was able to afford at the time was milk. I would splurge on a big pack of cheese from Costco every so often.
Paying your future self is worth it.
Having an emergency fund when something crops up is priceless.

BH my finances are in a much better place.

amother

Viola

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 9:48 am

I think what a lot of people, especially young couples, dont realize is that small things add up.

Example: buy lunch for $15 x3 times a week will add up to over $2,000 a year on takeout lunch
If someone buys $15 lunch x4 times a week will add up to closer to $3,000 a year

If you send out your sheitel to be washed and set every other month you spend $240 a year, if you have 2 sheitels you spend almost $500 year

If your husband and sons go to barber for haircut, at $20 haircut every 6 weeks = $200 year/person

Anything you can do yourself but pay for the convenience I consider a luxury...
For example
Cutlets already cut into strips or cubes
Peeled garlic, peeled corn, diced fruit etc
Ready cleaned chicken

amother

Maroon

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 10:08 am

amother Viola wrote:

If you are both working full time, paying for those extra things can be seen as a work expense (not for taxes, but your mindset).

amother

Viola

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 10:15 am

amother Maroon wrote:

If you are both working full time, paying for those extra things can be seen as a work expense (not for taxes, but your mindset).

Right. For those bringing a big parnassah. But all around me are young kollel families who pay for so many extras that they dont even realize it adds up so much.
My expenses are rent, utilities, car insurance, gas, tolls (rare occasion), groceries, childcare, twice a year buying clothing for children, mikva.

Many young couples also have cleaning help, eating out, take out, gifts, vacation, wash n sets, haircuts, manicures, clothing each season etc

amother

Springgreen

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 10:17 am

amother Viola wrote:

I think what a lot of people, especially older couples, that when there is no way to make it make sense financially and all you see in the future is a hole that gets bigger even after scrimping and pushing yourself to the limit that people don't even try.

For ex - someone that has an income that bought them a house and covered their expenses plus had extra for savings when they were 25 cannot imagine the exhaustion of what young couples feel today.

amother

Viola

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 10:19 am

amother Springgreen wrote:

Did you mean young couples in your first sentence?

amother

Amaryllis

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 10:24 am

Even with being on the Tomchei Shabbos list, and basically that being 90% of our food for the week, and not spending money on any kind of subscriptions, or any kind of luxuries it’s difficult to make ends meet on $73k before taxes. That’s with both of us working full-time.

Financial counseling is what we’re seeking but we’re not even sure what else they would have us trim.

amother

Viola

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 10:29 am

amother Amaryllis wrote:

What size family?

amother

Stonewash

Fri, Jul 28 2023, 10:31 am

amother Amaryllis wrote:

I think the goal would be to increase your income more than lowering your expenses. Are you purposely keeping your income low so you can be on government programs? 73k isn’t a lot for two full time jobs, you can do better than that with some effort and research.

Sending hugs. Financial problems are so so stressful.