Materialistic child

amother

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 6:17 pm

One of my children wants every cool thing he sees. My other children are not like this, so I don't think it's our home or community, I think it's just the way he is. I believe we strike a good balance between letting our kids have a few nice things but not getting everything they want. We live in a pretty mixed community, so while they definitely have classmates that have everything, they also have classmates that have very little and classmates somewhere in the middle (and we are definitely in the middle).

When he accompanies me on errands, he has to be reminded we're here to get the things on my list, if you want to come along, there is no begging or whining for stuff you see that you want. And he will generally be good about it, but I can see the chalishing in his eyes and the internal struggle as we pass by the toys. He LOVES finding opportunities to earn money to buy himself stuff. When catalogues arrive in the mail he flips through them and finds stuff he wants. His birthday is very soon (turning 10) and he just handed me a looong list of things he wants. He even pointed to one thing and said "this one is the most expensive, so if you get me that, I understand you won't get anything else".

He understands that money is not unlimited (we bh are comfortable, but we're not millionaires, so money is definitely finite) and he understands about wants vs needs. He doesn't tantrum or get angry and upset when we tell him he can't have something, just is visibly disappointed and somewhat whiny and will often start thinking up a way to earn money for it. But just the way he's always looking at stuff stuff stuff, wants so much, etc it bothers me. I wonder if there's more I should be doing to curb his impulses. On the other hand, I am impressed by how industrious and enterprising he is, and yes, he does have good self control as he doesn't get angry when denied something he really wants, just mildly annoying. Any ideas?

amother

Brunette

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 6:30 pm

Different people are created differently. Some people have a natural affinity for material things. Some people are naturally good at living with very little.
To people like that, the concept of pas bmelech tochal and being non materialistic comes naturally. They can’t imagine why people are so shallow and over indulgent. They can’t understand because they were created with a different tafkid and that’s not their purpose in life.
Now other people were created with a natural proclivity to materialism. These things speak to them, and they are extremely drawn to many of these surface qualities. Channeled properly, this proclivity can lead to tremendous tochen and deep pnimius. But of course, it’s a life long avoda. Just like everyone has their own avoda
Don’t denigrate someone’s natural tendencies, that can lead to resentment and self flagellation, which does not lead to proper growth.
Instead, compliment them! Say “wow, you have great taste! I wish we could do that, but it’s not something I think our family needs now”
By living in your environment, where you don’t have those materialistic desires, they will pick up before long which priorities are ideal.
But keep in mind, they can live a beautiful life glorifying Hashem through this world. Given their natural tendencies, that’s most likely what they’re supposed to do!

NechaMom

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 6:34 pm

amother Brunette wrote:

This is such a beautiful positive post!

amother

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 6:47 pm

amother Petunia wrote:

Is there an element of anxiety or obsessiveness behind all this wanting? Is that what's bothering you OP? Or am I off the mark?
Adhd types can also be like this, always looking for the next dopamine fix.

Very interesting! He is diagnosed with both adhd and anxiety. I had no idea this could be related. Makes sense now.

Brunette, thank you! I think you are right. Imamother heated discussions about materialism/entitlement/spoiled kids are probably getting to me head. Thank you for explaining how it's not necessarily a bad thing!

amother

Petunia

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 8:12 pm

amother OP wrote:

It can be triggering as a parent to see our kids gripped by impulses and compulsions. Feels a little like their brains are being hijacked and they’re not really in the drivers seat.

But it does help to look at it as a brain wiring issue rather than a moral flaw.

mommy3b2c

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 8:32 pm

I have a son like this . The way to help is not to make him feel bad about it, and not to make him feel desperate . I understand that you can’t buy him everything, but I would come up with ways for him to earn things . Give him as many chores as possible with a reward system for doing them and explain to him why. Let him know that you understand that so many things are important to him but it doesn’t make sense to just get tons of things just because , so you are setting up a way for him to earn all those extras . Make sure he understands it’s not a punishment but rather you understand his need and it’s important to you because it’s important to him so you are figuring out a way to make it work without “spoiling “ him.

The main thing is not to shame him or look down on him for this need . Let him know that it’s something special about him and just needs to be used in the proper way. Making him feel bad about it will make this need much stronger .

amother

Turquoise

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 9:11 pm

I have oh about 7 kids like this. Except some don’t want to work for it, so yours has a huge plus. I tried to teach my kids the value of money but they’re ADD and have impulse control issues. And they felt deprived. So those who became adults racked up huge credit card bills. It’s so rough. And if they buy something, it must be the best. And if they want it, it must be now.

I will pay for the things they want, within reason. If it’s a particular brand, etc., they pay the difference. I try not to get as stressed with my younger kids. I tell them I would really love to buy all that for them, but unfortunately I don’t have the funds. I try to hear them out and validate their feelings. I’m doing better with the younger ones.

amother

Foxglove

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 9:24 pm

amother Brunette wrote:

I thought its the opposite. the deep people dont need materialistic things?

amother

Brunette

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 9:28 pm

amother Foxglove wrote:

I thought its the opposite. the deep people dont need materialistic things?

You would think. But the world was created zeh leumas zeh. When someone has a strong capacity for one side, they have a capacity for the other side of equal strength. Chitzonius and penimius are the complete opposites of each other.
Therefore when someone has a great capacity for materialism, their capacity for depth is equally as strong
This is true for all of our greatest strengths and weaknesses
Even more so, Hashem gave you your biggest weakness as an avoda because you can achieve such a great height in that area. Someone who isn’t drawn by materialism as much has a different zeh leumas zeh.
It’s so amazing how Hashem created us and our deepest essence!

amother

Foxglove

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 10:05 pm

amother Brunette wrote:

but the people who are busy with gashmius are called shallow? all these shallow people who only know about nice clothes and houses are really deep?

amother

Brunette

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 10:14 pm

amother Foxglove wrote:

but the people who are busy with gashmius are called shallow? all these shallow people who only know about nice clothes and houses are really deep?

Having the potential for something and actually being that thing are different.
But yes, people with the greatest capacity for materialism have the greatest capacity for depth.
Whether they work on themselves and reach their potential is up to them!!
As they say, the saddest thing is unrealized potential!
Think about it, if someone doesn’t have such a proclivity for materialism, reaching depth is not that hard. Therefore not a great accomplishment.
In order to reach our greatest heights, our work needs to be real! We have to overcome something!
The only example I gave here was chitzonius and pnimius because that’s what we’re discussing, but this is true with all middos

amother

Foxglove

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 10:18 pm

amother Brunette wrote:

Think about it, if someone doesn’t have such a proclivity for materialism, reaching depth is not that hard. Therefore not a great accomplishment.

I thought you meant previously in your post that these people who are not materialistic are not deep and the matrialistic ones are the deep ones just dont know their potential...

amother

Brunette

Tue, Aug 08 2023, 10:25 pm

amother Foxglove wrote:

No no!!!
No one is saying that only materialistic people can be deep!! Chas v shalom!
Plenty of people with other middos are extremely deep! Of course!
I do believe that with the concept of zeh leumas zeh, the potential depth of people with materialistic tendencies is that great. Meaning however great their drive for chitzonius is, THAT is how great their potential for penimius is.

It’s easy to see someone and resent them based on how they seem to act. This is another way of looking at people. Looking at their potential

It’s something I do with my own kids all the time. I have one child who acts up and is extremely silly. I know with all my heart that he has the potential to take life very seriously with great responsibility. I know that his potential is even more than my naturally responsible child!!
Is he responsible now? No! But I know he can reach levels of seriousness and responsibility that my other kids won’t be able to reach. Zeh leumas zeh. His potential is that much greater!!

amother

Foxglove

Wed, Aug 09 2023, 6:44 am

amother Brunette wrote:

hashem created some people to be silly and immature. thats just how they are.

I have a low tolerance level. anger issues. I have to work on myself daily. its exhausting. I dont think I have the capacity to be the calmest, patient person ever unless hashem heals me from my personality disorder.

amother

Melon

Wed, Aug 09 2023, 4:21 pm

One of my daughters is like this, she is 10, but has been like this since she was a toddler. We are not materialistic at all, so it is kind of confusing, but this dd is just like that we try to roll with it.

She just loves things, especially nice things. I also think that gifts is one of her main love languages - she really appreciates material possessions.

We try to channel her interest in material things towards good causes - for example: we tell her we are willing to spend more money on clothes for shabbos and yom tov because it is important to honor these special days. And she can dress beautifully for shabbos with jewelry and a stylish hairdo and a fashionable dress, but the reason is to honor shabbos and not to honor herself.

There are plenty of ways to talk about how we can use our material possessions to serve Hashem directly, or even just indirectly (wow, you have so many great toys and it is wonderful to see how nicely you share your things with your sister, you're being so nice!). Show them how they can use their possessions or cool stuff to bring out their good middos or other kinds of good qualities.

We also like to have her use her own money to buy things, if she earns it, she can decide what to buy with it, but we talk about the importance of how we spend our money. Sometimes when she asks for something or points out things she wants in magazines, we talk about where our money goes and we keep a certain amount of money for food/shelter etc and ask her what she thinks is more important. Talking about how we allocate our money in general (she doesn't need to know how much we make, just how we prioritize our spending) has also made an impression. And when she is at the store trying to decide what to buy or how much to spend, beforehand or during the trip we talk about how much of her money she wants to spend in the moment and how much she wants to have left or what else she might want to budget her money for.

We also talk about why it is important to not just try and have or wear what everyone else has just because everyone else does. About value and beauty on the inside and not just the outside. About being unique and finding our own tastes in toys and clothes, but doing so within our means and lifestyle and with good middos (money wise and religious wise (e.g., tznius clothes, books with only appropriate language)).

At any rate, we just try not to make a big deal out of it directly (like I have never told her that she is materialistic) and we do discuss how different people have different interests and different strengths, and how we each have to use them in positive ways. I view her materialism as something neutral that can be molded either way, like many traits that can go either way.. We try to work with her to mold it into something positive and hope for the best.