Married DC Shalom Bayis

ora_43

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 7:11 am

amother OP wrote:

I am taking THEIR side. And the children's side. I don't understand why, whether I called it shalom bayis or mental health, people think there are sides. So not the point!!

We can't read your mind. If you say that she's neglecting her husband because she's such a perfectionist, people aren't going to know that what you really mean is that she's suffering emotionally and you want to help her.

I do think you mean well, I'm just explaining why you're getting critical/concerned responses here.

amother

Lightblue

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 7:26 am

amother OP wrote:

I am taking THEIR side. And the children's side. I don't understand why, whether I called it shalom bayis or mental health, people think there are sides. So not the point!!

Simple. People are used to it being about sides. It's very rare - or at least people think it's rare - for someone to be trying to help the family as a unit. So when you talk about an issue it's always seen as blaming and taking sides.

amother

Tuberose

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 7:59 am

Agree with you Op
there are no sides here only the "side" of the family
I once had an in law child come to me and ask me to get involved in their marriage
I felt really bad but felt it would not end well and felt anxious and terror stricken at the idea of such a process
told the in law that I would support in any way I could but that I didn't think I would be the best person to do that
the in law was very insistent and upset that I wouldn't do it
however I reasoned and davened that with time s/he would understand
and I was very careful to not say anything that could be repeated or misinterpreted
mainly just listened nonjudgementally and encouraged them to find people who could help rov, mentors...and to control that which each could control
and more like life philosophies and chizuk rather than specifics
they did find their own mentors B"H
and are in a great place B"H
took time and effort
felt my role is to love and support them together and as individuals and that that was how I could help them best b'ezras Hashem
davening saying tehilim and giving tzedaka unbeknownst to them for their health happiness and sholom bayis as well
Wishing you and everyone health happiness and true nachas from everyone
ksiva v chasima tova

amother

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 8:21 am

amother Tuberose wrote:

This is exactly what I think. I do not say things that could be "weaponized." (Sil is a sweet sweet guy but couples sometimes say awful things in the heat of an argument.) I am someone he can go to to talk and the older kids also know that they can come to me to talk.

My sisters seem to think I can wave a magic wand and fix this but sometimes all you can do is daven and support.

amother

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 8:28 am

amother NeonYellow wrote:

It sounds like she may have a little OCD? She sounds very orderly. Or maybe she is just extra rigid.

Probably more than a little. One of the older kids told me a story this week about how to surprise her mother, she dressed her two little brothers for camp. Instead of saying how wonderful she was, her mother got mad and told her she had planned for one of them to wear those pants on Tuesday, not Monday (which it was).

amother

Catmint

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 8:29 am

amother OP wrote:

But if you read through your posts here you do take his side and shared his complaints about their shalom bayis, not anything about the kids. That’s where it gets a bit uncomfortable.

amother

DarkKhaki

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 8:31 am

amother Cerise wrote:

It’s not crossing boundaries if sil approached OP about it. He’s turning to her for help as the only parent he has.

OP has a responsibility to her grandchildren. Of course she should do everything she can.

If your DD doesn’t want help, just keep supporting SIL and take good care of their kids when you can.

Can’t help someone who doesn’t want help.

It sort of it because a MIL is not the person to involve here for SB issues. If there's other health or mental issues, then that's a different story. But the one thing that the DD will need for any action is to have her mother's rock solid support to lean on. With the MIL giving the impression to take SIL's side, that is all lost.

Maybe OP should take the approach that the grandchildren are coming to her for help - and not the SIL.

amother

Starflower

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 8:31 am

giftedmom wrote:

No but I’m not so eager to talk about their flaws nor can I ever imagine so readily taking the side of a spouse and believing them over my child.

Lucky you. I’m so happy my mil believed me when I told her about the way dh was cursing at me and treating me like garbage.

ChassidishMommy

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 8:49 am

Just want to chime in here to say that I'm amazed at you, OP. This must be excruciatingly painful, yet you seem to have your priorities very straight and are so well balanced. There is no perfect reaction to such a situation, but I think yours is very close.
Your authenticity came through to me from your first post. The fact that your grandkids know they could turn to you says a lot about who you are. And it doesn't seem like OP is getting involved in the SB, just being a listening ear and trying to give practical help (which was unfortunately refused).

ChassidishMommy

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 8:56 am

giftedmom wrote:

No but I’m not so eager to talk about their flaws nor can I ever imagine so readily taking the side of a spouse and believing them over my child.

Um, it doesn't seem like the dd expressed a different side.
And unconditional love doesn't equal head in the sand. It means you love your child no matter what, and even if they are struggling and in the wrong, it doesn't make a dent in you feelings towards them. You always stand by them, support them, and give in whichever way you can, whatever they need at the place they are in, even while acknowledging they may be out of bounds.

amother

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 9:00 am

ChassidishMommy wrote:

YES. Exactly. Support means doing what they need.

amother

Lightpink

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 10:02 am

SIL can go for therapy by himself. He doesn’t have to wait for dd to get on board.

I would talk with your dd and say I’m concerned because you seem very stressed. What can I do to help?

Can you go over there regularly and help with the kids and the cleaning? ETA I know dd has refused help in the past, but can you go anyway? As long as sil and the eineklach want you there.

Would money help your dd feel less stressed? Could somebody help cover cleaning ladies or takeout for a while to take some of the load off her?

I feel terrible for everyone in this situation. IyH Hashem will turn the situation around and give you a yeshua.

ChassidishMommy

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 10:11 am

amother OP wrote:

YES. Exactly. Support means doing what they need.

I think your dd built herself a pseudo-identity in her teens based on her achievements. When she was stripped of that, she was left identitiless and forged a new one on her house management skills. You might be able to give subtle messages that we could only hope would penetrate.
"It's amazing how well you run your home, dd. I mean, you're amazing anyways, just for being you, and you don't need to do anything to prove it."
If you think you may have inadverdently condtributed to this self-image, try to subtly rectify it. "Your kids are just precious! you know, when I was your age I used to admire my kids for their talents and accomplishments. I now realize how wrong that was. External attributes may come and go, but it's a child's beautiful neshama that gives them their everlasting value."

B'Syata D'Shmya

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 10:24 am

amother OP wrote:

She says she is too busy. She doesn't see her friends either. She had a significant birthday a couple of years ago and I really pushed her to have lunch with me and she talked for weeks about how this messed up her schedule.

These years will pass and things will eventually get easier although probably harder before easier. She sounds like an A-type personality who has to excel at everything and feel like a winner. Its hard for her to take a break or hand the reins over to someone else temporarily.

In any event I would not get involved. Let them deal with this problem together.
Consider telling dear SIL that you would love to help but they will have to get through this together.

You stand to lose both of them if you interfere.

amother

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 10:24 am

ChassidishMommy wrote:

I hope she knows I feel that way but like a lot of mothers I probably don't say it enough. Thank you.

small bean

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 10:24 am

B'Siyata DiShamaya wrote:

7 children? No wonder DD has no time for her husband. Let him cut her some slack and understand she is overwhelmed. Start there and see where it takes them.

I think this is wrong- I have 9 children and make time for my husband and he makes time for me. My marriage is a priority in my life.

B'Syata D'Shmya

Mon, Sep 11 2023, 10:28 am

amother Green wrote:

I think she needs a psychiatrist and a therapist.
Why doesn't she accept the help she clearly needs?
Sil is a victim. Looks like he's trying and reaching out for help. It doesn't sound like he's the problem.
Can you take care of the kids and let them go away for a week end?
Are you able to pay for cleaning lady or cleaning service once a week?

All this from having heard only one side who isnt even a side.

The OP? The SIL whose side we dont know, for all we know, the MIL OP has misunderstood. BUt you decided he is a victim. One who brought 7 children into this world and is complaining that his wife isnt attentive enough to him....
The DD? Who has no idea we are talking about her but you decided she needs a psychiatrist????