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amother

Wed, Oct 04 2023, 11:30 pm

amother Babypink wrote:

Do you miss the freedom from not keeping tznius and kashrus? Those are the two things that are hardest for me.

Not tznius (I had/have plenty of struggles but tznius comes pretty easy for me) but kosher mostly for convenience. I love to travel so it’s hard to plan around food and I also live out of town now with only a few kosher restaurants so it’s not always super convenient or easy (or tasty!).

amother

Honeysuckle

Wed, Oct 04 2023, 11:41 pm

Can you please write a column? I think this story would be very refreshing and a teaching opportunity for the community

amother

Honeysuckle

Wed, Oct 04 2023, 11:42 pm

One big question I find has no easy answer is people going through a similar experience have no way to come back to since you're not interested many times to rejoin the community they left

op you what are your thoughts on that

amother

Thu, Oct 05 2023, 6:51 am

amother Almond wrote:

I'm curious what made you come back?

Where you the type that would take part in groups that bash orthodox Jews? (it's ok if yes, I'm just wondering if there are every "those" kind of really angry people that make their way back)

What kind of frum lifestyle do you live now and what did you grow up with?

What's your advice for struggling teens? Adults? (I actually currently struggle with yiddishkeit)

I was part of those groups. There’s a lot of anger and hurt that comes with leaving. Loosing family and friends, how some people are treated. These otd groups can be genuinely helpful to some people who are struggling with loneliness and other hardships after leaving. A lot of the bashing comes from pain and a feeling of not being validated. But sometimes the anger can feed into each other it and it can become unhealthy.

I grew up very yeshivish - definitely more modern now.
I watch tv now and listen to secular music, go to shows, have internet obviously.

My advice to struggling teens would be not to make permanent decisions based on temporary feelings. Really think about what kid of adult you want to be - how you want to live and find someone similar to that Maybe it’s not a parent but a teacher, or a friend’s parent, a neighbor or a cousin. Figure out what path you need to be on to become like them.

For struggling adults. Any relationship has ups and downs, ebbs and flows. Do you feel any ups in your relationship with H’
or is it all downs? If there are ups hold them close and figure out what needs be done to have more. If there are no ups think about why. Are you going through something hard? Is it questions of emunah? Frustration with the community? Frustration with frum life (as we cook our millionth meal of the month). Was there ever a time you felt inspired and if so is there something you can do to get back to that place?

I don’t know if that’s good advice because ultimately everyone’s struggle is unique - but I think struggling sometimes might
be good because it means you are thinking and actively choosing to do what you are doing instead of just being a robot and doing it because it’s what you’ve always done.

amother

Thu, Oct 05 2023, 7:11 am

amother Burgundy wrote:

Did you "come back" to the same community or did you go more to the "left" when you returned to yiddishket?
This has been my own personal observation and of course not based on anything- but I find it is easier for a boy/young man to return than a woman but again just my personal observation.
If I understood you correctly- you didn't leave cuz you were in pain - more that you were a deeply feeling person and the double standards sort of killed it for you and you threw out the baby with the bathwater?

I’m definitely part of a more modern community than I grew up in. The double standards did bother me but also because so much of what we do is because because we rely on our rebbeim and their rebbeim before them and before them and so on - so when I saw so much human flaw in the community it made me doubt the whole process of putting my trust in people. And I was in pain because it wasn’t normal to question these basic things so I felt alone. And when I took one foot off the derech to ask or explore I was basically pushed off the rest of the way by family and community. (Not that I’m not taking full responsibility for my actions, but I do think if I had a “wider” derech to walk down I wouldn’t have gone so far off.)

amother

Dill

Thu, Oct 05 2023, 7:51 am

amother OP wrote:

It sounds like you already did something amazing. I think showing the beauty in frumkeit as much as you can by example and your own love for it. You can’t expect him to come back or try to be mekarev him (I was definitely very tuned into this and hated the feeling). I do know people who stopped believing because of the same reasons but love the lifestyle so much that they stay. I always think in order to be frum you have to either 1) really love it or 2) really believe it. Ideally it’s both of course but there are plenty of people that fall into one category or the other… or some people who sort of love it and sort of believe and that’s enough for them

Thank you for starting this ama
I'm almost 30 but I often think about not being frum
Mainly because of infertility, I lost faith in rabbanim, my husband stopped learning and going to shul.
We definitely went down many levels.
On the other hand we both love shabbos and yom tov, we don't struggle with kosher or tsnius.
So that's what's keeping us frum...but we are missing the connection to Hashem that we had.
We struggle a lot with bitachon, especially when we see bad people prosper.

amother

Clear

Thu, Oct 05 2023, 8:33 am

It is soo kind of you to post like this, it's helping us understand whats going on with our family members!!!!!
So I have a family member who definitely dresses very modern now, & to the outside world & probably to family that they are still frum; even though they are not shomer shabbos. They still send their kids to religious schools/yeshivas.
How am I supposed to process this or understand this? Thanks so much for your help!
,

amother

Melon

Thu, Oct 05 2023, 8:58 am

Wasn't it easier not having to make Pesach?

amother

Petunia

Thu, Oct 05 2023, 6:06 pm

I found this thread really eye opening and I keep loading the page if there are any more replies.
You sound like an amazing person and as others have said, you would write an article.

amother

Canary

Thu, Oct 05 2023, 6:10 pm

amother Dill wrote:

I'm your age and x kids yet, which part affected you, what did rabbanim do? 🤔

amother

Dill

Thu, Oct 05 2023, 6:43 pm

amother Canary wrote:

I'm your age and x kids yet, which part affected you, what did rabbanim do? 🤔

Too long to get into on this thread
I don't want to derail OP

amother

Denim

Sun, Oct 29 2023, 1:09 am

I assume you got married after you came back on the derech.

How did you find a Shidduch with your past?

amother

Honeysuckle

Sun, Oct 29 2023, 1:20 am

I posted about shiduchim too. Would love to know where when how you went about shiduch

amother

Orange

Sun, Oct 29 2023, 1:29 am

amother OP wrote:

Not really to be honest. Not wearing tights is cooler but I remember even thinking sometimes, when it’s really hot it’s really hot no matter what you are wearing.

I find it interesting that others can relate to only always being tznius. I remember when I went to study at some places that weren’t orthodox I had no issue keeping tznius. I stood out like a sore thumb and I believe it’s what made them be nasty to me. In a way, I feel Hashem wanted that, since He wanted me to stay frum and not buy into not orthodox nonsense. So, that’s why he made the faculty be nasty to me and made me run far away and start talking out against it.

amother

Orange

Sun, Oct 29 2023, 1:34 am

amother Dill wrote:

Infertility can Defintely mess with a person. Are you going thru primary? I almost got a tattoo because I gave up. Bh I was expecting shortly later and ironically even non Jews it’s bad to get tatoos when pregnant.

amother

Orange

Sun, Oct 29 2023, 1:37 am

amother OP wrote:

Thank you for the encouragement! I live out of town now which makes things a lot easier for me. I don’t actually talk about it much in real life… I’ve been taking on more over the last 5 years or so. I think ppl in my community just think I’m a BT (I guess maybe I am) unless we talk and they ask about where I grew up and went to school etc… then they ask questions. I’m not in touch with any old friends so they don’t know and I’m not sure how they would feel. Family has been accepting.

Same here, they think I’m a bt because I know way too much information about the other movements that ffb don’t.

NechaMom

Sun, Oct 29 2023, 1:46 am

amother Melon wrote:

Wasn't it easier not having to make Pesach?

And Shabbos every week? And twenty or so meals for tishrei? And themes for Purim?

amother

Obsidian

Sun, Oct 29 2023, 3:58 am

amother Orange wrote:

Me too. I'm still deciding on the exact placement of my tattoo. You should start a spin off

amother

Orange

Sun, Oct 29 2023, 9:14 am

amother Obsidian wrote:

Me too. I'm still deciding on the exact placement of my tattoo. You should start a spin off

No thanks, bh I’m passed that stage with my baby. Now, I needa focus on her and don’t have money to throw out on tatoos. Plus, I’m frum and don’t want that mark on me.

amother

Trillium

Thu, Dec 14 2023, 12:53 am

Have you suffered any s*xual abuse or molestation? Is it unfortunately the main reason for so many OTD's?

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