S/O Bathroom Usage - So disappointed in our teachers

notshanarishona

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:03 pm

amother OP wrote:

You may have taught for many years and that doesn’t excuse or or make it right that 20% of the time you don’t allow the students to go to the bathroom. Have rachmanus as a teacher and let the girls go 100% of the time. I believe a teacher will have to give a din v’chesbon for not allowing a student to go. It’s wrong and nothing you are teaching trumps a basic human need.
This isn’t about parents getting emotional. It’s about teachers making poor and unkind choices.

I have never had a student have an accident because I didn’t let them go. I am a reasonable person and know my students. I can also tell (depending on the age) when a student really needs to go . Give us a little bit of credit.
Students are not being tortured or deprived in my classroom, if anything the opposite (I tend to error on the side of leniency).

It’s not about trumping a human need, it’s about having some parts of the lesson that all the kids need to be in the classroom for and then we break off into groups or individual work where they can go.
Plenty of us grew up with large families with 1 bathroom. Learning to wait is part of life.again, kids know the structure and expectations of my classroom from day 1. They know when they walk in, now you have 5 minutes to go to the bathroom, and then you need to be in the room for the next 15-20 minutes barring an emergency.

amother

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:05 pm

amother Azure wrote:

I guess I don't really get why everyone is getting so emotionally worked up about this. As adults we don't drop everything the first moment we feel an urge to go. We can wait. If you can't wait at all from first needing the toilet, I would suggest seeing a dr. People should be able to hold off for some time.
Incontinence is a medical issue.
I think most reasonable teachers are saying that we don't stop girls going when they need to, we just encourage them to only go if they really need. The majority of people can wait 1 hour or so to go to the bathroom. Without having any sort of system, the teaching would fall apart.
I personally have used the hall pass system where I have a lanyard hanging by the classroom door and if you need to go, you take the lanyard. If someone else needs to go, they have to wait for the first girl to come back. Most people can usually wait those few minutes until the first girl returns. If the first girl is taking too long, I will make a judgement call on allowing the second girl to go. I know in the younger grades they have multiple lanyards so that a few girls can go at a time.
I think it's a great lifeskill to teach students that you don't have to go to the toilet the first instance. And the reality of life as a parent is that I'm lucky if I get 2 minutes to get to the toilet.
I'm not trying to stop students going to the toilet, I'm just trying to ensure I have some students left in my class to teach.

This post is so triggering. It’s a terrible life skill to teach that you should hold it in. Why isn’t this common sense. If your students are leaving your class then you as a teacher need to figure out why. That should be completely unrelated to using the bathroom. Please allow your students to go to the bathroom as needed.

amother

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:08 pm

internationalma wrote:

So I’m not reading all the replies . BUT
I am a high school teacher and I can tell you that students have enough break to go to the bathroom not during lesson time.
As a teacher you often have a pattern of students who “really need” the bathroom . Teachers have an incredible hard time teaching while students are in and out of a classroom ( even when no one leaves it’s often difficult) . How often do you use the bathroom??
If your healthy you should be able to manage to sit in class until break.
I also know that girls can get their periods ect and really need to leave but as a teacher you can tell those that go and come back straight away vs those that go to chat in the bathroom.
As a matter of fact the principal in the school I work in, often reminds the teachers the non bathroom breaks during lessons .
If your child needs a little break often for some health reason , you should talk to the school to let them of her condition.

They don’t have enough time by the breaks. The responses from some teachers are maddening. Teachers have rachmanus and flexibility.
Please read this thread.

amother

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:12 pm

notshanarishona wrote:

Listen, we went back and forth a bunch of times and I’m finding your responses very out of touch with the seichel needed to understand. It’s not just a matter of accidents, if your causing a student to suffer then that’s on you. Whether they suffer emotionally or actually physically, any teacher who causes that will have to answer for it one day.

Sometimes even though we are so experienced for many years we need to pivot and be humbled by others experiences and gain a sensitivity and understanding that we didn’t have 20 years prior.

If you understand, you understand; but I don’t think continuing to go back and forth will be doing much. All I can recommend is to reread the thread in a few weeks so you can gain the rachmanus necessary to reevaluate your position.

Genius

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:16 pm

amother OP wrote:

Why don’t you substitute in a school for ten days? It will be a humbling experience I can assure you of that. We can then reconvene to assess the bathroom issue.

Genius

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:27 pm

amother OP wrote:

I have taught for years and years. I have an insider view but am still passionate about this.

Hmmm. In that case I’ll agree to disagree with you. I don’t think it’s major enough a deal to get so passionate about. If a student has an emergency or looks like she has one, every sane teacher lets the girl leave. Holding in pee for forty five minutes is something many people do without a second thought. Saying it’s a human rights violation is taking this rather far.

amother

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:31 pm

Genius wrote:

It is a human rights violation. This thread is in response to your mindset. So not ok. Can't Believe It

amother

Blushpink

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:37 pm

Extremes are never good.

Having to earn 10 points in order to go to the bathroom, is quite ridiculous.

But OP, getting hysterical if a kid has to wait for 5-10 minutes, is also ridiculous.

Most teachers have reasonable systems, where they allow 1 kid at a time.

Nobody is getting UTIs if they occasionally have to hold it in for a short while. (Its actually healthy- Kegels!)

notshanarishona

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:44 pm

amother Blushpink wrote:

Thank you!
I also find it very telling how many people are anonymously disagreeing with me. If you are so passionate OP stand by your screenname.

amother

Tanzanite

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:44 pm

This whole topic is getting ridiculous.

For all those who are upset that a kid needs to earn 10 points to go to the bathroom, you don't know the system at all. The kid basically earns 40-50 points per period simply for doing what they should be. It's not hard to earn points. Spending 10 points out of 500 to go to the bathroom is so not a big deal. It just lets the girl think for a minute. Do I need to go now or can I wait 10 min till recess. Girls who need to go have no problem spending the 10 points. And that's why the points are being given. So they'll have them when needed. And this way I can allow them to go and don't need to make a judgement call on whether they really need to go or they're faking. They can make their own judgement call.

amother

Gardenia

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:45 pm

My 3rd grade daughter came home with wet underwear 3 days in a row and she goes running to the bathroom when she gets home. She said she’s only allowed to go to the bathroom 4 times a month during English and she doesn’t want to use them up. She has time by lunch and recess too but she doesn’t go during class because only 4 times a month!! I need to speak to the teacher tomorrow this is ridiculous

notshanarishona

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:46 pm

amother OP wrote:

It’s ok, I have no need to use anonymous imamother for my chinuch guidance. I communicate with all parents of my students on a regular basis. I really don’t think people are shy to tell me when they have an issue.
You are right that this thread is pointless and going in circles.

notshanarishona

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:47 pm

amother Gardenia wrote:

Agreed that 4 x a month is not sufficient.
I would expect the average student to go once - twice during class time during a 3.5 hour afternoon .

amother

Seablue

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:47 pm

I like the idea of having a hall monitor. I think it shouldn't be the responsibility of the teacher to figure out if a kid really needs to go or not. The principal or assistant principal or monitor should be dealing with that.

I used to teach. I remember in one school I taught first grade and I did bathroom time to make sure everyone got to go. It was a very small class of maybe 7 kids. The principal was mad that I was using class time.

When I taught older grades I think I just let kids go but they needed to raise their hand and tell me and I kept track of how long they were out. I did find it stressful. Teaching is such a multi tasking job that you don't need to add this pressure on top of it.

Realize that principals will tell a teacher off if too many of her students are found in the hall or shmoozing in the bathroom. I don't think it's fair to the teacher and it forces teachers to make these kinds of rules.

Also yes, many ppl are not aware of how important it is to use the bathroom when you need to. I only learned about this recently.

notshanarishona

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 7:49 pm

amother Clover wrote:

A kid who does literally everything wrong does not deserve to be denied bathroom access.

For sure not, but simultaneously it’s true that the kids who tend to make trouble/ not respect others boundaries/ who can’t be trusted alone for 5 minutes also cant be let out multiple times a day unsupervised to “go to the bathroom “. It’s a challenge, a teacher is only one person.

amother

Clover

Wed, Oct 25 2023, 8:17 pm

notshanarishona wrote:

Schools are understaffed. That is a problem. But at the end of the day, the teachers are the adults, and it's their responsibility to keep order, and they can't take it out on the kids.