Someone who keeps asking for tzedakah

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Forum -> Judaism -> Halachic Questions and Discussions

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malky800

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 1:17 pm

I am a rebbetzin in a small community

There is a family that is struggling financially. The father doesn't have a high paying job, the mother babysits.
I happen to be privy to information that every yomtov they get money from ani irchei, which I am sure vets them carefully.

The mother is very fragile emotionally also and she tells me she needed to get away for a bit so she flew on vacation somewhere for a few days her kids over chanuka.

I am sure some person paid for her trip.
Possibly her husband's friend who takes good care of them if they ask.

Now she comes to me and tells me she can't pay me 50$ for the monthly carpool that I take her kids to school, can I fagin this month?

I understand the situation that sometimes even poor people need a break. But I can't get past that she owes me money while she took a vacation. Take care of what you owe and then I'll be more than happy you got a break.

( this is not a one time story. This happens multiple times a year)

I'm sure this deserves a double take story in the mishpacha. How else can I just get myself to accept and get past this?

chestnut

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 1:20 pm

If her vacation was paid for, how does it affect her not being able to afford the carpool?
If she didn't go on this vacation and came to you asking for a carpool break, you'd have no problem letting it go?

carnation

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 1:26 pm

Someone may have offered her to pay her for vacation. So she took it as she desperately needed it. That person didn't offer to pay for carpool.. even if that person gave her a trip around the world for 30 days and paid all her expenses on the trip she still does have the money for carpool..

Last edited by carnation on Sun, Dec 17 2023, 7:59 pm; edited 1 time in total

justmarried:)

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 1:28 pm

I think this is a tough spot you are in. Nothing to do w her vacation tho... She keeps on asking for you to do her a service for free. is it hard for you? can you and do you want to consider it a chesed or it it going to make you resentful? can you stop taking her kids? its really up to you how you want to look at it and how you want to respond.

justmarried:)

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 1:30 pm

carnation wrote:

Someone may have to her and offered to pay her for vacation. So she took it as she desperately needed it. That person didn't offer to pay for carpool.. even if that person gave her a trip around the world for 30 days and paid all her expenses on the trip she still does have the money for carpool..

ok so her kids can stay home or she can take them but you cant expect someone to do a service for you without payment. People see where they can cut corners and take favors if you keep on saying yes she will continue not keep not having money to pay you

Cheiny

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 1:34 pm

malky800 wrote:

Can you just consider that part of your maaser obligation? I had an issue once also with someone I was regularly giving tzedaka to who took vacations and lived above their means. A Rov I spoke to said that someone who becomes an Ani is supposed to be supported according to the financial level they previously lived on,,, so no one should look at what they’re spending their tzedaka money on… a bit hard to understand and swallow but that is what the Torah says.

In your case, you say the mom has emotional issues so she probably needed the vacation for her mental health…

missknowitall

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 1:38 pm

Stop driving the carpool until she pays

justmarried:)

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 1:38 pm

missknowitall wrote:

Stop driving the carpool until she pays

If she wants to continue as a chessed she can

tree of life

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 2:03 pm

Tell her that u apologize you need the money to pay bills you don't mind if she pays u late but needs to pay
Otherwise the arrangements has to stop
Sorry to be blunt some people no how to take advantage
Talking from experience sadly Can't Believe It

writeread

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 2:11 pm

If you normally give maaser, count this towards your maaser payments.

zaq

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 2:26 pm

Consider the $50 she owes you to be $50 you gave to tzedaka.

tree of life

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 2:31 pm

writeread wrote:

If you normally give maaser, count this towards your maaser payments.

Why does it always have to fall on kindness of others
Sometimes we can feel we have been taken advantage of

gande

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 2:38 pm

Tell her she can pay you next month. Because if next month she has an extra $50 she will spend it.
I know such people it’s not rare. At least she’s working cause the one I l ow isnt.

giftedmom

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 3:05 pm

There’s a lot of identifying info in your post

BatyaEsther

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 3:25 pm

I would tell her that you understand money is tight, but you have expenses and count on that income. Ask her when she can pay you. Take the money from your maaser and pay it back when (and if) she pays you.
The trip is irrelevant assuming she didn’t use her cash which is now not available to pay you. Not driving her kids will probably put her in a bad place and punish the kids. BUT I completely understand the frustration with people who think their are so entitled and everyone needs to covers for them and they have no accountability.

I think you need to be sensitive yet firm.

cbg

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 3:28 pm

Let it go with a happy heart and HASHEM will pay you back 1mil x more, I guarantee it.
But the secret is with a happy heart

carnation

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 3:50 pm

cbg wrote:

Let it go with a happy heart and HASHEM will pay you back 1mil x more, I guarantee it.
But the secret is with a happy heart

THIS!!!

How do some of you not fear trying to hold back OP from giving tzedaka to this woman? Let's close our eyes and imagine c"v we were mentally ill.. we had no money to pay for carpool.. we cry all day thinking what will be? How will I pay? Finally we take the courage to say we just can't.. do you realize the tears this woman will shed when she finds OP not willing to help? We are all Hashems children. If you were the mother and watched your adult children deal with each other like that. How would you react?

notshanarishona

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 3:53 pm

It shouldn’t be about that she took a vacation. If you can afford to, both physically and emotionally, do chesed for this person, great! It’s probably a big mitzvah. If you can’t do it without being resentful then I wouldn’t do it.

Also,
If this person is on this site, she will be mortified. You really need to go another with so many identifying details.

zaq

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 4:21 pm

notshanarishona wrote:

If OP gave true details, the poor woman may have been identifiable even if OP had been anonymous. But maybe OP already changed enough details to make the women unidentifiable while still adequately presenting her dilemma.

In any case, it seems to me that OP isn't asking for justification for ceasing to help this woman; she's davka asking for help reframing the situation so that she can continue doing so without resentment.

URHL

Sun, Dec 17 2023, 4:32 pm

are you driving to their schools anyways, going majorly out of your way?
if not, I would reframe as a chessed. it's all in the attitude.

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