Students getting picked with the same girls over and over ag

amother

Sun, Dec 24 2023, 6:38 pm

The girls have many opportunities to work in pairs or small groups for siyums and fun projects through out the year. They also have a lot of that in the afternoon too. And some girls are landing with the same girls all the time.

two girls are very close friends I choose them as partners, or if a girls sits next to girl and their friendly and work well together in class. choose. I'm finding with certain girls I'm running out of names to pair certain girls with. Some girls are just more well liked and friendly with everyone. Some girls are landing with the same girls all the time. The kids get so excited to be with their friends and girls they like. Also the real point is to learn in a fun way with the kids sharing ideas and work. Im not intrested in being overly involved or for major politics to erup But I can't help thinking that maybe I'll see some positive growth if I close my eyes and randomly put partners together. Have any of you experienced teachers here see your students gain from a real mash up?

amother

Molasses

Sun, Dec 24 2023, 7:09 pm

I'm a teacher.
Either I choose random partners, or
Partners based on proximity, or
Partners based on skill level sometimes homogenous, sometimes heterogeneous, or
They choose their own

Absolutely do not pair based on friends, definitely not consistently.

I do try to note which girls don't work well together (like absolutely positively don't work well together) and try not to pair them.

A girl who is difficult socially or academically I try to partner with patient, friendly girls, preferably as a trio, so no one is stuck just with her

amother

Molasses

Sun, Dec 24 2023, 7:13 pm

And this speech should be given before starting random partners

that you expect mentschlichkeit and middos even if it's not your best friend.

That you expect a smile, never a sigh, when you call the partner's name.

That if a girl ever has a real issue with a partner or feels like she's getting paired with her too frequently etc, to come to discuss it with you privately at another time, like recess or lunch.

Edited to add
And that partners aren't permanent. You will keep switching them up.

amother

Mocha

Sun, Dec 24 2023, 7:37 pm

amother Molasses wrote:

What kinds of real reasons?
Meanness? Lack of smarts or ability? Socially off?

Because I'll give different ideas

2 kids who bully certain other kids (including each other), 2 kids who are so weak they really can't contribute to the work so their partners do the brunt of it (certain kids actually like this, others are really mean about it). 2 kids who work really well with anyone except each other- every time it's tried they both end up in tears and no one is sure why. A pair who's parents are convinced the other child is bullying theirs and won't let them work together. And a pair of twins who we try not to put together for obvious reasons. And there are only 18 girls in the class.

notshanarishona

Sun, Dec 24 2023, 7:47 pm

amother Mocha wrote:

Really weak kids I would either speak to partners beforehand and discreetly lower the expectations or have an aid/ shadow helping their group to even it out.
Someone who bullies others I would either put with a kid who can hold her own or by herself.

amother

Molasses

Sun, Dec 24 2023, 7:49 pm

amother Mocha wrote:

1) 2 kids who bully certain other kids (including each other),
2) 2 kids who are so weak they really can't contribute to the work so their partners do the brunt of it (certain kids actually like this, others are really mean about it).
3) 2 kids who work really well with anyone except each other- every time it's tried they both end up in tears and no one is sure why.
4) A pair who's parents are convinced the other child is bullying theirs and won't let them work together.
5) And a pair of twins who we try not to put together for obvious reasons.
And there are only 18 girls in the class.

For a lot of these the solution is to make a group of 3-4, not 2. I'm just not going to repeat that over and over Smile

Im.numbering your post

1) work on bullying! Tell the parents it is happening and the kids need help.
They need therapy. Does your school have an effective social worker?
You're, right, partner with those who won't be bullied.

2) kids who are so weak- ideally you put them together and you're the third person in the group. Its an extra tutoring session. You focus on them.
Or put them with the gentle, caring girls who will be nice to them.

3) you have 18 girls. The 2 who constantly don't do well together, try to keep away from each other and have them work with the other 17. but its not the end of the world if they are paired together randomly here or there.
Also, ask them at a calm moment why it isn't working out. They subconsciously know why, but they might not be able to express why.

4) okay, so generally keep them apart if their parents asked.
(IS there bullying? What do YOU think? Why yes Nd why not?)

5) nisht geferlach if twins randomly end up together.

amother

Mocha

Sun, Dec 24 2023, 7:52 pm

notshanarishona wrote:

I can't speak to the partner and say "your partner is an idiot, so just do half the project". Sometimes I do put them with another kid who gets modifications and they both assume the modified project is because of them, but then the medium low kid isn't learning as much as she can from the project- she could really thrive if she was with the right partner. I don't have aids/shadows even with a kid who can't read. Welcome to small school living.
So again, those 2 kids can only work with a pool of 5 kids.

And I do know which kids are ok with the bullies, but that means that those 4 kids have a 50% chance of being paired with one of the bullies instead of someone else.

amother

Mocha

Sun, Dec 24 2023, 7:57 pm

amother Molasses wrote:

For a lot of these the solution is to make a group of 3-4, not 2. I'm just not going to repeat that over and over Smile

In my experience, if there's 4, or even sometimes 3, the quieter kid in the group gets no say.

1) both kids are in therapy. Not helping much. But they're limited to a total of like 4 kids.

2) I can't just sit with them the whole time, the other 16 do need some help and guidance too- not fair that they get no attention at all on the project. I often put them with the same 4 nice girls, so those girls each have a 50% chance of ending up with one of the weak girls on each project.

3) yup, in the general scheme of things that one pair shouldn't be such an issue , it's just one more thing to think about. And no, they can't just be together. It turns into WWIII in my classroom for a week.

4) there was last year. The girls made up. One of the parents can hold quite the grudge.

5) nope. I'm not bringing sibling rivalry into my classroom. We have an agreement that fights at home stay at home as long as they don't have to work together.

amother

Jasmine

Sun, Dec 24 2023, 7:57 pm

Thanks so much for posting this question. Many years ago I was a quiet- very quiet student. I was paired with one of the very popular students for a project. We became really good friends for 7th and 8th grade. Thinking about it now, she didn't need me at all for a friend. But we had a chance to connect and it worked. (we were not in the same High school and have lost contact since).

notshanarishona

Sun, Dec 24 2023, 8:08 pm

amother Mocha wrote:

Of course you don’t say it like that, in most classes that I teach, it’s very obvious that there are 1-3 weaker iep students who get intense supports and all the students notice that.
Second, another option is instead of having everyone do the same project, assigning topics (easier vs harder ) to different groups so whoever has the weaker kids gets a simpler project or just grade accordingly.

amother

Mocha

Sun, Dec 24 2023, 8:17 pm

notshanarishona wrote:

My class is structured in a way where I try to not make it so obvious. And the kids appreciate that. Their close friends know they get modifications, but the rest of the class doesn't. (which is why path of least resistance is to put them with their friends).

Some projects work well for assigning different topics, some don't, but I can't put that very weak kid with a strong kid who could and should do a top project and then let the top kid not work to her potential.

Again, I found pairings that work, but we keep falling back on the same 3 or 4 groupings.