Staying in an empty house

amother

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 9:53 am

When the hosts are not there.
Where I live, people are BH very generous and open their home to others when they are not there.
I had to go away for shabbos one week and we stayed in an empty home. I spent the whole shabbos watching my kids very carefully, and we still managed to break a couple of small things, which we immediately offered to replace. I saw myself how hard it was do to, and I’m the type who was super careful the whole time. I can imagine many people aren’t like me, are more chilled, and might not necessarily keep such a close eye on their kids in such situations.
Having experienced how hard it was to do, I’m very reluctant to open my home to others in the same way. When we are home, or it’s a family of adults, I’m totally fine with it. But with a family with small kids (especially if I don’t know them), I feel like things are going to get unorganized/broken/lost, specially the kitchen and playroom.
Is this a bad Middah on my part? I don’t want to do a mitzvah I’ll end up being resentful by.
DH thinks that if we don’t lend out to other people than we can’t go to other people’s homes in the same way (not that that usually happens). It’s specifically a family with little kids who may not be on top of them that worries me…

Ema of 5

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 9:57 am

amother OP wrote:

When the hosts are not there.
Where I live, people are BH very generous and open their home to others when they are not there.
I had to go away for shabbos one week and we stayed in an empty home. I spent the whole shabbos watching my kids very carefully, and we still managed to break a couple of small things, which we immediately offered to replace. I saw myself how hard it was do to, and I’m the type who was super careful the whole time. I can imagine many people aren’t like me, are more chilled, and might not necessarily keep such a close eye on their kids in such situations.
Having experienced how hard it was to do, I’m very reluctant to open my home to others in the same way. When we are home, or it’s a family of adults, I’m totally fine with it. But with a family with small kids (especially if I don’t know them), I feel like things are going to get unorganized/broken/lost, specially the kitchen and playroom.
Is this a bad Middah on my pet? I don’t want to do a mitzvah I’ll end up being resentful by.
DH thinks that if we don’t lend out to other people than we can’t go to other people’s homes in the same way (not that that usually happens). It’s specifically a family with little kids who may not be on top of them that worries me…

Ita nice to open your home when you are not home, but it’s not mandatory. There are only (not even) a handful of people I would open my house to if we weren’t home. We have friends who have a sibling in the neighborhood, so they have stayed here when we have been away, and we have a friend whose nieces stay here sometimes. I honestly can’t think of anyone else. It is NOT a Mitzvah if it doesn’t work for you. I really don’t like this tit-for-tat way of doing chessed. Also it’s not like you ASK to be put up in a home where the family isn’t home when you are there.

amother

Heather

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 10:45 am

How does the fact that you are home while the guests are there prevent things from breaking? You said it yourself you were watching your kids super carefully and things still broke. That is life with kids. If you don't want to host families with kids that's fine. You may find you have a hard time if you need to put up family members in the future if you are not available to host when your neighbors need though.

amother

Babyblue

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 10:46 am

I would never let anyone stay in my house when I’m not home. I consider my house private. I don’t need people using my kitchen when I’m not there. Or anything else. I don’t feel bad about it.
I only ever stayed in other people’s houses if I rented it. For simchos we are usually put up in a bedroom in the basement with nothing much to use or break.

amother

Watermelon

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 10:53 am

I've had people stay in my home when I wasn't there and believe me when I say broken things are the least of my issues. People had zero respect for my privacy, went through my cabinets and draws . It was fairly obvious when we came home that things were touched.
I don't agree with your husband though. If anyone else is comfortable hosting you without their presence then the fact that you don't feel comfortable to do it shouldn't make a difference.

mommyhood

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 11:06 am

I happily lend my house to adults when I’m not home, not young families. I also have never asked to be put up in an empty house so I don’t see it as a contradiction. If I family member offers it to me I would take it but I’m happier staying in a guest room with a family home so I don’t have to worry about what I can or cannot touch or if I put a toy back in the right spot.

amother

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 11:15 am

amother Heather wrote:

Of course it makes a difference! I’m around so they don’t have to go through the kitchen to find something, I can put out the food that they are welcome to eat, my kids and I are around the whole day and the playroom and kid situation has some supervision. My kids are little, but they know what to do/not to do in their own playroom and will tell a different child to stop if they are breaking something etc.

Putting up family members is very different. I have yet to need to put up a family with little kids in a home when no one is there (I am not at the simcha making stage yet). And I have space for people to stay at me even when I’m here. For myself, we were offered it.

amother

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 11:17 am

amother Watermelon wrote:

I don't agree with your husband though. If anyone else is comfortable hosting you without their presence then the fact that you don't feel comfortable to do it shouldn't make a difference.

Really? He thinks it’s hypocritical. Like if we wouldn’t do the chessed that way we shouldn’t expect/ask for it ourselves.

amother

Watermelon

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 11:50 am

amother OP wrote:

Really? He thinks it’s hypocritical. Like if we wouldn’t do the chessed that way we shouldn’t expect/ask for it ourselves.

Chessed doesn't work that way. Giving out an empty home depends a lot on personality. While you may have a hard time with strangers in your home others may not.
Curious, does he never ask for favors that might be hard for him to do for others?

B'Syata D'Shmya

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 12:20 pm

amother OP wrote:

Its great that you understand that you will feel resentful if something happens. Not a bad middah to be honest with yourself. Not a bad middah to want your home in one piece.
Tell DH that you dont mind older couple or mature couple with older kids who you know to be well behaved and respectful. Your problem is that the average family wont be as careful or considerate as you with other peoples things and wont reimburse as you did.
So its ok to do if its for a family you feel comfortable with.

lamplighter

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 12:35 pm

I don't think it's a bad midda. It is a very big ask to stay at someone elses home when they aren't there. We did it one time (had people by us when our house was empty) and my husband said never again. I think it's more about privacy and how you feel about your personal space and things than a chilled personality. I'm very chilled, I host a lot, kids break things all the time but no one is going through my things to find xyz for example. My husband found it very violating.
The idea of you can't expect it from others is true in a reciprocal way. Meaning if someone asks me to stay at my house when it's empty and I say no, then I agree I can't ask them to use their house when it's empty. If there is a simcha and the baal hasimcha puts you up in an empty house you don't need to refuse those accommodations because you don't let people stay in your empty house.

amother

DarkViolet

Mon, Dec 25 2023, 5:03 pm

Not doing a nice thing is not the same as doing a not-nice thing. You're not obligated to open your home to strangers when you're not there. I'm amazed that people do this and I'm beyond grateful to those who have done me this chessed, enabling me to spend YT with my children or to attend a grandchild's OOT bris on an erev Shabbos or Erev YT. There aren't hotels in most frum neighborhoods, and the only recourse is to stay in someone's house. But if you've already had a bad experience, no one can really fault you for opting out.

Ema of 5

Tue, Dec 26 2023, 9:01 am

amother OP wrote:

Really? He thinks it’s hypocritical. Like if we wouldn’t do the chessed that way we shouldn’t expect/ask for it ourselves.

I don’t get this attitude. I don’t live my life tit for tat. I do what I can for you, and you do what you can for me. Maybe we are able to do the same things, maybe not. If you ask me for 4 TBSP sugar, I don’t expect you to come back with it. Truth is even if you ask me for a dozen eggs I don’t expect you to come back with it! If you bring it back that’s great, and if not that’s fine too. Just because you are able to have my kids over when I ask doesn’t mean I will be able to have your kids over when you ask (or ever!)

essie14

Tue, Dec 26 2023, 9:27 am

When I'm invited to a simcha over shabbat, my hostess arranges the sleeping arrangements. I don't expect or ask for an empty house.
We always stay in a hotel during the week, but none of my family members live within walking distance of a hotel, so they put us up for Friday night.

Several times we have been put up in a neighbor's guest room or basement.
We were once given an empty house and we definitely appreciated it , but I didn't expect it or ask for it.

It also wasn't the hosts' primary residence so there weren't really knick knacks or breakable or private things. So it wasn't really an invasion of their personal space.
It was more like an airbnb situation.

I would never give my empty house to guests that I don't know. I just wouldn't feel comfortable with this at all for many reasons.
We do host neighbors' guests for sleeping when we're home.
Just because I once slept in someone's empty house halfway across the world, why would I have to reciprocate this to strangers?

amother

Peachpuff

Tue, Dec 26 2023, 10:05 am

I would never be able to give my house. IYH if we one day have a separate guest suite with a separate entrance, I would be able to do it. That being said, I frequently use a relatives house. They are the most generous chilled people and I am so grateful that they are willing to do this for us. But... we treat their house like a museum. We leave their place cleaner than when we got there, watch the kids like a hawk and stay outdoors as much as possible. If hypothetically something would break, we wouldn't "offer" to replace, we would replace automatically, no questions asked. I wish I could be more like my relatives, but I just don't trust people that way.